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How Hot is Ukraine Gonna Get?


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7 minutes ago, sburke said:

Biden's Bold Gamble Might Just Save Ukraine | Opinion (msn.com)

A good article, and I agree that the free dissemination of intelligence was vital in securing the basic agreement that Ukraine should be helped that we see now. IMO Western intel agencies are too reluctant some times to share their info with people. It leads to a situation where they were right, but because they didn't back up what they said it doesn't do much to sway public opinion. 

3 minutes ago, sburke said:

what the hell is cancel culture even?

I suspect that this is the kind of conversation that will quickly lead to one of those vacations Elvis has been telling us about. If you go let us know where he sends you!

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1 minute ago, sburke said:

what the hell is cancel culture even?  people have made choices about products they do or don't want to buy for various reasons for generations.  Now it's a pejorative term as if there is something wrong with deciding cause A means something to me and I don't want to buy products that undermine it.  Rosa Parks refusing to sit in the back started the Montgomery Bus Boycott.  That was "cancel culture".

'Cancel culture' became such a negative term because it was abused so often due to how quickly the target was shutdown without any real evidence, just fear of bad press.

But in the case of this war - the cause is just

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1 minute ago, kraze said:

'Cancel culture' became such a negative term because it was abused so often due to how quickly the target was shutdown without any real evidence, just fear of bad press.

But in the case of this war - the cause is just

okay yeah that I get.  Sign of the times with folks being so divided with kneejerk responses.  I blame facebook and twitter. 😝  When I first saw that Putin had banned facebook I admit to being a little jealous...

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38 minutes ago, sburke said:

it did go through.  I think you need to understand is you are hearing people's frustration with watching the Russians continue to target and murder innocent civilians.  You'd have to be completely inhumane to not want it to stop especially if you know our military could halt it within hours... in a virtual world where there wasn't immediate follow-on impact that might actually be worse.  Neither of those you mentioned are warmongers blindly following a gov't position and for all I know they may have both served previously.

My stance is that if you are an American, when your own border is being invaded daily, who gives a flying f%^& about Ukraine's border? I don't. I dont give a rats ass about Ukraine's border, I care about mine. I got sacrificed for a third world border 55 years ago and it didnt amount to ^$^&. Whether Ukraine lives or dies I don't give a flying $##% because I'll still be breathing$ tomorrow. Maybe I'm a totally immoral POS but whatever, I couldn't care less

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22 minutes ago, Erwin said:

Not sure how determined the Brits are to sanction Russians:

Update from GOV.UK for:

Entering England during coronavirus


Change made:
If you began your journey in Russia, you do not need to complete a passenger locator form, or take a COVID-19 test before travel to England or on arrival.

Time updated:
7:41pm, 5 March 2022

Well, the government has advised UK citizens to leave Russia as soon as possible...

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49 minutes ago, BlutUndEhre said:

I guess my last post didn't go through so here goes again. I am disgusted by the likes of danfrodo and dan/california as they shout for war, war by my countrymen, because I feel that anybody hollering for war that loud obviously has never been to war. I have. I joined the USMC in 1966 and deployed to RVN in 1967. I was assigned to I Corps, 1/9 Marines. I understand sacrifice. I understand death. I do not understand these things when they do not benefit my nation in any way and that's what this amounts to. I joined, and I'll be the first to admit that it was not out of patriotism but out of "I'm gonna get drafted so %$^& it". I DID however think that I should contribute to the larger war against communism. That, unfortunately was BS too. It was all BS. My belief in America and what it "stands for" led to my son being a casualty of my own retarded beliefs as well. He joined in time for the glorious "Operation Iraqi Freedom" and hes now a mind$%#@ too. He was an 0311 in Fallujah and now 18 years after? Yeah, hes $##^ed. Rah rah USA. I'm sure I'll be belittled and talked down to over this but I could give a %^$' less, walk a mile in my shoes, walk a mile in my son's shoes...

Belittled?  not my me.  Thanks for sharing that. 

Note that I was strongly opposed to the invasion of Iraq, knowing then as I do now it was just a powerplay by Cheney et al, duping a lazy, incurious president into a gigantic mess.  And hurting your so, permanently.  That doesn't mean that all those kids that signed up & served were in the wrong, they were brave and served and fought and died and were maimed in something they thought was right.  I also, through reading only, not through your experience, know that the vietnam war was a bright shining lie, to steal a phrase.  So we agree.

The only thing we disagree on is whether this new war is justified for international intervention.  Is this whole thing another bright shining lie? 

You don't want intervention.  You may totally be right.  I at least want us to forge out a big safe zone in western Ukraine before it's (possibly) too late.   I am looking months out and thinking european nations will start feeling overwhelmed by refugees, and nasty demagoges will use that to gain power.  So my safe zone is about helping the displaced, keeping Ukraine alive, and also showing Putin there's a hard line he better not cross, while knowing that there's probably a refugee backlash in the near future.  I get that direct intervention is probably a really bad idea.  But I still like the safe zone. 

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2 minutes ago, DesertFox said:

Can´t tell if that convoy was knocked out last night before the snow or even earlier last week, however quite a lot of wreckage.

 

 

my gawd, that convoy is like a mile long.  Dozens of vehicles.  what did this??

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10 minutes ago, Bulletpoint said:

A complete lack of morale. Soldiers realising that what they were doing is not only wrong, but suicidal.

A complete lack of everything, morale, training, leadership, command and control, supplies, and whatever else you care to name. The Russian army is putting in a world historically bad performance here. Either Putin is going to shoot his entire general staff, or the general staff is going to shoot Putin, and claim it was all his fault. I really don't see a third choice.

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Just now, DesertFox said:

IMHO, This could very well develop into something which will be the last drop needed ...

 

 

This would be why I am pro intervention. The Russian army is like dinosaur that is already brain dead, but it is thrashing like it means it. I am arguing for a bit of spinal severing.

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46 minutes ago, BlutUndEhre said:

My stance is that if you are an American, when your own border is being invaded daily, who gives a flying f%^& about Ukraine's border? I don't. I dont give a rats ass about Ukraine's border, I care about mine. I got sacrificed for a third world border 55 years ago and it didnt amount to ^$^&. Whether Ukraine lives or dies I don't give a flying $##% because I'll still be breathing$ tomorrow. Maybe I'm a totally immoral POS but whatever, I couldn't care less

Not in this thread. Nope. It's been a few days since I've had to give someone a vacation.

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Actually, not unexpected.    China and Russia have traditions of grabbing foreigners under trumped up charges and having that on the sidelines as a subtle threat to whatever the real issue is that resulted in the 'arrest'.  Expect more of the same.

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