How Hot is Ukraine Gonna Get?

[riptides]

17 minutes ago, dan/california said:

Military failure on an incomprehensible world historic scale.

FOUR of them. Four. That speaks volumes.

 

[rocketman]

2 minutes ago, riptides said:

I guess they are not keeping up with the Ruble value in todays market.

I heard a russian speaking translator pronounce the Ruble "rubble". That was kinda appropriate by now.

[Vet 0369]

4 hours ago, kraze said:

Then people will get rid of that bad leader again.

Only people are responsible for their life and people who they choose to lead them.

A great recent historical proof of that is South Korea. It went through half a dozen extremely corrupt leaders, not much different from DPRK, before they got where they are - each time changing the bad leader.

In fact learn the history of any developed country - it's always about people changing the bad leader until they got the better one.

No change means no desire for change.

Every russian must be held accountable or we'll repeat 1991 once again. If not 1939.

OK, I’ve read just about enough of this that I can stand without commenting. While I completely understand why you feel this way, and not being one of the “boots on the ground” in Ukraine or Russia, have no place to exalt or vilify your comments. This attitude is is a prime example of the vindictiveness that led the “Victors” of WWI to level such severe reparations and conditions on Germany that it caused WWII. 
 Please try to tone it down a bit, or unfortunately, I’ll have to put you on ignore, because I don’t believe in “Stirring the S*#t.” It really is nothing except extreme prejudice of the Russian people, and no peoples anywhere deserve that attitude.

[BeondTheGrave]

4 minutes ago, riptides said:

I guess they are not keeping up with the Ruble value in todays market.

Or maybe they are and are trying to get a good deal!

[Kraft]

1 minute ago, Vacillator said:

So today's dumb question from me - all this expensive hardware being captured some seemingly intact, I don't see any of it being transferred to new military owners (only farmers ).  Does that mean it's not being used by new owners, it's not worth it, or does it mean it is but we're unlikely to see evidence of it?

I saw several posts of captured russian vehicles on flatbeds being offloaded, I think most end up in UA hands if it is usable but making it combat ready probably takes some time.

[Falaise]

This thread is getting boring, the guy from @Battlefront.comhad given the result on Sunday breaking all suspense!!!!
More seriously I have a Polish friend to whom I have been talking about games without success for more than 2 years that I have connected to the forum he has become aware of the quality of the forum now I think he will be interested in games !!!

Jacque si tu me lis !!!

[dan/california]

15 minutes ago, Vacillator said:

So today's dumb question from me - all this expensive hardware being captured some seemingly intact, I don't see any of it being transferred to new military owners (only farmers ).  Does that mean it's not being used by new owners, it's not worth it, or does it mean it is but we're unlikely to see evidence of it?

I am sure they are trying as hard as they can, but there are lot of logistics involved in taking something over like that. Most oof it has some sort of problem, even if it doesn't you have get somebody out there to drive it, and have a safe path back for something that is not exactly sneaking thru the trees. A LOT of situational complications.

[BeondTheGrave]

 

[CHEqTRO]

Tokayev about to pay its debt that he owns Putin from the protest/coup in Kazakhstan two months ago? (Man, doesnt that look like an eternety ago now). Uncorfirmed as of now of course. Nevertheless, the general rethoric coming from Russia has been more and more belicist:

By the way, tomorrow there is going to be a meeting between Finish president and Biden, presumably to talk about NATO inclusion:

Also, Moldava is going to apply for EU membership as well:

 

[kraze]

42 minutes ago, Vet 0369 said:

 snip

Very well - I agree with you.

It's Putin personally that serves in russian army (1.6 mln of his clones) and works to supply them with weapons and ammo (millions and millions of putins in a military sector) directly and all other putins through taxes indirectly.

Most importantly it is putin himself, who, literally at this very moment, bombards apartment blocks in Sumy with cluster munitions.

We are really lucky it is evils of just one man and not dozens of millions.

 

But, sorry, getting back to the topic at hand:

Meanwhile in Belarus many of their troops seem to refuse to invade and mass cancel their army contracts, chosing the disgraceful discharge over murder.

Clearly they don't know that if they were to murder people here - they would just get a free pass as we would just all blame putin.

Edited March 3, 2022 by kraze

[DesertFox]

1 hour ago, Holien said:

Seen on another thread a user rename Putin to Putler...

Might be worth naming him appropriately?

 

 

seems fitting

[akd]

12 minutes ago, kraze said:

Meanwhile in Belarus many of their troops refuse to invade and mass cancel their army contracts, chosing the disgraceful discharge over murder.

Clearly they don't know that if they were to murder people here - they would just get a free pass as we would just all blame putin.

You don’t think there is chance that this happens in the Russian Army, as well?  There are certainly signs of cracks forming.  What if they start forcing conscripts to fight in large numbers?  This is not Afghanistan or Chechnya where the average conscript would be afraid to simply walk away from his unit to surrender or desert because of the near certainty that he would be murdered, thus creating cohesion even if coerced externally.  

Ukraine’s strategy of taking prisoners, treating them well and letting them call their moms is Grade A propaganda and subversion of enemy morale.  Way more effective than tough talk about murdering everyone that is basically tailor made for Russian propaganda to re-use. It’s also the right thing to do and buys enormous good will outside of Ukraine (maybe even in Russia), even if it seems soft to those suffering.

Edited March 3, 2022 by akd

[DesertFox]

1 hour ago, Ts4EVER said:

150 billion rubles? Gee...

Thats about what? 0,10 eurocent?

[Vet 0369]

2 hours ago, kraze said:

As I was going through militaristic russian social network channels to report and hopefully shutdown - I found that the narrative now shifts towards the following, quoting one example:

"it's now obvious that a special military operation won't be a quick one to even the most stubborn of us - so we must prepare to shift our peaceful economics to a full wartime mode and prepare to mobilize all our resources to bring peace to Ukraine"

So that martial law and possible mobilization rumour looks to be less and less of a rumour

Yes, you’ve gotten a like for this one! You are much more likable when it’s not vicious.

[kraze]

1 minute ago, akd said:

You don’t think there is chance that this happens in the Russian Army, as well?  There are certainly signs of cracks forming.  Ukraine strategy of taking prisoners, treating them well and letting them call their moms is Grade A propaganda and subversion of enemy morale.  Way more effective than tough talk about murdering everyone that is basically tailor made for Russian propaganda to use.

Russian soldiers panic because they were fully expecting to come in here and start ethnic cleansing unopposed - but instead began suffering disproportional casualties.

Make no mistake - every single russian soldier at a border knew he is coming to murder us. They literally signed papers stating just that, all 180k of them and more and more keep coming (and dying). They now feel bad because they couldn't.

[dan/california]

3 minutes ago, kraze said:

Russian soldiers panic because they were fully expecting to come in here and start ethnic cleansing unopposed - but instead began suffering disproportional casualties.

Make no mistake - every single russian soldier at a border knew he is coming to murder us. They literally signed papers stating just that, all 180k of them and more and more keep coming (and dying). They now feel bad because they couldn't.

I COMEPLETELY understand your desire to watch them all die in burning vehicles. But the way this end with some of Ukraine still standing is to encourage mass surrenders. The Ukrainian command structure seems to understand this. Mass surrenders/desertions are also the most destabilizing thing for the Russian Government. There is just no way to spin it.

[Aragorn2002]

12 minutes ago, DesertFox said:

Thats about what? 0,10 eurocent?

[Commanderski]

1 hour ago, Ts4EVER said:

150 billion rubles? Gee...

Isn't that worth about a dollar fifty now...

[sburke]

15 minutes ago, kraze said:

Russian soldiers panic because they were fully expecting to come in here and start ethnic cleansing unopposed - but instead began suffering disproportional casualties.

Make no mistake - every single russian soldier at a border knew he is coming to murder us. They literally signed papers stating just that, all 180k of them and more and more keep coming (and dying). They now feel bad because they couldn't.

we get it.  We got it 6 pages ago.  Can you provide any info regarding the bridge at Ivankiv?  That would be a bit more relevant.  It seems a Ukr counter attack may have seized the bridge in effect cutting off the Russian western assault on Kiev from resupply.

The journalist got it wrong but maybe in a good way.  Rather than pushing back from Kiev it looks more like cut off.

 

 

Edited March 3, 2022 by sburke

[Vet 0369]

1 hour ago, db_zero said:

There is a suggestion that A-10s be transferred to Ukraine. Could be done in a few days. Training of pilots to use it could be done in a short time, but what exactly that means is open to interpretation. The A-10 was designed to operate from austere locations.

Interesting suggestion but I doubt how practical it would be. On the other hand if volunteers who already have experience with the A-10 could be found then it could be a valuable addition. I just don't know how the sight of American A-10s operation in the Ukraine would be interpenetrated by Russia - even though on the ground they are  suffering greatly from Western supplied weapons.

Apparently Russia has requested a list of American/western arms that will not be sent to Ukraine.

This is “pie in the sky wishing!” I sometimes attempt to fly rage Warthog in Digital Combat Simulator (DCS) which is acknowledged by many to be one of the best (real life) simulators. It is very difficult and demanding to learn how to simply start it up. After that you have to learn how to program the navigation, waypoints, targeting, etc. I have heard that even U.S. pilots who fly it every day don’t really begin to become competent in it for about a year of training in it. About the only way a new, even experienced pilot, would be effective in it would be as a Kamakazi.

[kraze]

19 minutes ago, dan/california said:

I COMEPLETELY understand your desire to watch them all die in burning vehicles. But the way this end with some of Ukraine still standing is to encourage mass surrenders. The Ukrainian command structure seems to understand this. Mass surrenders/desertions are also the most destabilizing thing for the Russian Government. There is just no way to spin it.

Oh I agree. I'm all for russian POWs as they bear really good gifts.

One may say Russia is our primary weapon supplier at this point

[Vet 0369]

42 minutes ago, kraze said:

Very well - I agree with you.

It's Putin personally that serves in russian army (1.6 mln of his clones) and works to supply them with weapons and ammo (millions and millions of putins in a military sector) directly and all other putins through taxes indirectly.

Most importantly it is putin himself, who, literally at this very moment, bombards apartment blocks in Sumy with cluster munitions.

We are really lucky it is evils of just one man and not dozens of millions.

 

But, sorry, getting back to the topic at hand:

Meanwhile in Belarus many of their troops seem to refuse to invade and mass cancel their army contracts, chosing the disgraceful discharge over murder.

Clearly they don't know that if they were to murder people here - they would just get a free pass as we would just all blame putin.

Thank you very much! Friends?

[kraze]

15 minutes ago, sburke said:

we get it.  We got it 6 pages ago.  Can you provide any info regarding the bridge at Ivankiv?  That would be a bit more relevant.  It seems a Ukr counter attack may have seized the bridge in effect cutting off the Russian western assault on Kiev from resupply.

The journalist got it wrong but maybe in a good way.  Rather than pushing back from Kiev it looks more like cut off.

 

 

All I know is that battles closest to Kyiv rage at Hostomel right now which means russians are back to where they were on day 1 in that direction.

(The NW approach goes like so - Hostomel - Bucha - Irpin)

There were no attacks from Vyshgorod direction for days (it's the N direction from which those rushing cross-dressed russians entered Obolon district days ago)

Everything else isn't confirmed.

[LongLeftFlank]

6 hours ago, kraze said:

I'm sorry but no. If "ordinary people" aren't happy with someone in power - they get rid of that guy.

If they don't - they are happy with the guy.

It is very hard to argue with this, under the circumstances. The *Russian people* are ultimately responsible for stopping this unconscionable aggressive war that their leaders have unleashed. If they do not, it is they who will bear the terrible consequences of failure.
[Sigh, I've bit my tongue on this one for a while now. Feel free to kick me out for a bit, @BFCElvis]

....That being said, I feel I must say that, like many others here, I am tired of you using your country's righteous anger as a cloak for beating the drums of anti-Russian bigotry on this board, which you have doing now, for page upon page:

- that Russians as a people are an ignorant easily gulled mob of Mongolized barbarians or bandits, deeply alien, with no indigenous culture

- that they 'live and breathe war', and that their neighbours have received nothing from them for centuries but invasion and rapine.

- Ergo, nothing but violence and treachery can be expected of such people, now and forever.

These are ancient slanders, and within living memory they carry the vile stench of Hilfswillige and gas vans.

(as noted, I have dear personal relationships who are all too familiar with where this kind of thinking leads)

...To take it further, I am a honestly a little suspicious you are presetting the table for the vengeful 'cleansing' of millions of ethnic Russians out of Ukraine once this invasion collapses and is repelled, as it will be.

I have never credited the 'neo Nazi / Banderist / Azov SS' agitprop pushed by Putin et al., nor its '2 headed coin' dog whistle, but it is surely true no side has a monopoly on bigotry, and I regret you are showing it here now.

Your anger towards Russians now is quite understandable, and I hope you are doing your bit for the defence -- but know that such binary Us/Them thinking ultimately undermines and retards the Ukrainian nation, condemning it to remain an 'Okrajina', disputed borderlands. Bloodlands.

Feel free to refute any of the above!

...Finally, in this time of crisis, I suppose the ultimate proof (or refutation) must be: how many ethnic Russian boys and Russian speakers are out there right now, fighting and dying for the blue and gold?

Slava Ukraine!  But keep your wits, remain civilised, and don't lose the peace!

[DesertFox]

3 minutes ago, kraze said:

All I know is that battles closest to Kyiv rage at Hostomel right now

Some nice pics from Irpin