Is CM dying?

[Battlefront.com]

Rofl? I've followed IL-2 Battle of Stalingrad and I'm aware they're using the Digital Nature engine, but that doesn't mean it's being redone from scratch.

Speaking as a developer... it's probable that if they are changing the underlying graphics engine they probably are redoing most of the code. It's usually faster to do that then to modify old code. But that's just a rule of thumb.

Now, new code does not equal new features. So it could be 100% new code and still play almost the same a the old version. But that's a design choice.

Because IL2 is such a well known game they'll try to tie to it no matter what the new game is like. For example, Avalon Hill tried to tie two different games to SL/ASL even though neither were even remotely similar to SL/ASL. And since Combat Mission was going to be one of those, I can speak with some authority on shameless marketing having little to do with actual features

Steve

[Buzz]

After Eastern Front, "Black Sea" and CMSF-2... Vietnam as another new modern family and modules of course. Simply doing my part to arrive at 10,000+ views of the mortal remains of Battlefront

You know doing the M50 Ontos after MG should not be too much of a stretch

[iMolestCats]

I think Vietnam as a CM game has tons of potential. Small unit warfare then all the way to MASSIVE battles. They could really make something AMAZING out of it.

[Saferight]

I think Vietnam as a CM game has tons of potential. Small unit warfare then all the way to MASSIVE battles. They could really make something AMAZING out of it.

would probably be much more enjoyable than CM: Afghanistan

[iMolestCats]

would probably be much more enjoyable than CM: Afghanistan

Oh yes, definitely. I found CM: Afghanistan a bore. It just didn't feel right to me.

[Saferight]

Oh yes, definitely. I found CM: Afghanistan a bore. It just didn't feel right to me.

I'm going to say its the only purchase from bfc I regret since 1999. I don't know what happened there I know little of its development. A Vietnam era game from strictly BFC would be awesome from the mainly asymmetrical battles with the US/ARVN VC/NVA to the mainly conventional warfare between NVA an ARVN from '72 to '75.

[Buzz]

Since Steve mentioned Avalon Hill does anyone still have "Firepower" from 1984? "A game of man to man squad tactics from 1965 to the present" (1984). The only A.H. game I still have in my possession. Have not played it in a long. long time.

Battlefront could create a fantastic Vietnam era game. I have no doubt it would be historically accurate, educational and interesting. The marketing issue is significant for a Vietnam era game. Sales drive the ability for any company to produce the product. To this day, Vietnam is one of the more complex, misunderstood military / social events in US history, IMO.

I have no doubt Battlefront could produce an awesome Vietnam game and modules but the market for it may not be broad enough to justify the finical investment for them.... but we can still ask. Maybe BFC could mange this before they die?

[John Kettler]

Mord,

You've got your sequence mixed up. CM is the noun, not the adjective. We don't have Normandy: CM, we have CMBN. Am going to therefore presume that EF CM/CMEF refers to the evidently aborted CMx2 version of CMBB! Why aborted?

Even a liquid nitrogen bath couldn't keep Charles's brain from possibly incandescing under the near infinite programming load, nor even those of the other troops (Phil et al., raised to an unknown, but large, exponent). And were we to clone KwazyDog, not even a bunch of him could handle the graphics production load. Scenario design for the entire War In The East in CMx2 would require an effort on par with building the pyramids, and playtest would make people involved yearn for mere nightmares, even the summation of all nightmares. Steve would have to rob the Fed to finance this astronomic outpouring of creativity, no other games could be developed, and CMEF would cost, say a kilobuck a copy. Oh, and it'd have to run on one of these for best gaming efficiency. Could put a crimp in the number of potential gamers!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titan_(supercomputer)

Regards,

John Kettler

[Clavicula_Nox]

Oh yes, definitely. I found CM: Afghanistan a bore. It just didn't feel right to me.

I'm the exact opposite, I loved CM: Afghanistan despite having very low expectations for it. Maybe I just had an easy time empathizing with my pixeltruppen who were sitting on a frozen mountain without enough ammunition and just waiting for the muj to show their faces. My only regret is that I did not back up my installation file or buy a hardcopy and lost the game in a harddrive crash.

[sburke]

Since Steve mentioned Avalon Hill does anyone still have "Firepower" from 1984? "A game of man to man squad tactics from 1965 to the present" (1984). The only A.H. game I still have in my possession. Have not played it in a long. long time.

Battlefront could create a fantastic Vietnam era game. I have no doubt it would be historically accurate, educational and interesting. The marketing issue is significant for a Vietnam era game. Sales drive the ability for any company to produce the product. To this day, Vietnam is one of the more complex, misunderstood military / social events in US history, IMO.

I have no doubt Battlefront could produce an awesome Vietnam game and modules but the market for it may not be broad enough to justify the finical investment for them.... but we can still ask. Maybe BFC could mange this before they die?

Vassal has a module for Firepower. Personally would love to see CM do a game on Vietnam, but then I loved the Afghanistan game too. As to financial viability, eventually BF will have to branch out. There is only so much WW 2 material especially high demand material. Many of us would love to see a France 1940 game however it won't have the same commercial appeal as Normandy, The Bulge or the Eastern front. Hopefully as the engine develops BF won't have as much overhead cost producing a game.

[LukeFF]

Rofl? I've followed IL-2 Battle of Stalingrad and I'm aware they're using the Digital Nature engine, but that doesn't mean it's being redone from scratch.

I like RoF and 777 studios does nice work but this is still in partnership with 1C and even the webpage says its a continuation in the first sentence. So we'll see what gets released. If it's revolutionary instead of evolutionary, you can rofl to your hearts desire. But don't bet the house on that...

The Digital Nature engine has nothing to do with the original IL2. Saying it's a continuation just means they are carrying on with the franchise's name. It's like the new Operation Flashpoint vs. the original title - they may share the same name, but the code base is entirely different.

Trust me on this. The executive producer is a good friend of mine and would laugh at the idea that this new IL2 project shares any code with the original IL2. So I will bet the house on it.

[Skwabie]

I am a good friend of the man who's developed Rise of Flight and the new IL2. He would wholeheartedly disagree with you.

...when personal relationship comes into the foray it complicates things doesn't it

and atm I've got little interest in debating a flight sim, that's not yet released, on a land combat game forum

[Buzz]

Vassal has a module for Firepower. Personally would love to see CM do a game on Vietnam, but then I loved the Afghanistan game too. As to financial viability, eventually BF will have to branch out. There is only so much WW 2 material especially high demand material. Many of us would love to see a France 1940 game however it won't have the same commercial appeal as Normandy, The Bulge or the Eastern front. Hopefully as the engine develops BF won't have as much overhead cost producing a game.

Might ned to dust off Firepower but not for the holidays. Too many kids around that might eat the units off the board I only played the Afghanistan demo but enjoyed it. Vietnam has so much possibility in terms of battles, equipment setting but it would have to sell to make it work. But then if CM is dying.... BFC might grasp at that straw before 10,000 views

[PanzerMike]

i didn't see any post about this issue, but lately i see less and less scenarios in the forum. CMFI - havn't seen a new scenario for months. CMMG - no scenarios since the launch, etc etc.

it seems that the community is dying, and the game with it.

i'm sure i'm not the only one who feels it.

Hi jkobmadrid. I released another scenario last week: MG Betuwe on fire. It's on the repository. So far I have had very positive reviews on that one, so I suppose it's not total rubbish. Check it out!

CM is alive and kicking

[JasonC]

Firepower is a pretty poor game design. It not only reflects its era, it reflect it rather poorly - the Squad Leader system was already out by then. It had fire teams and a raid on Entebbe scenario, some Nam scenarios that required rather too much hidden placement by pen and paper to work. It was fun for a bit to design some ambushes almost as a GM and have players try to run through them in nearly RPG fashion, but it got old quickly IMO.

[Buzz]

Firepower is a pretty poor game design. It not only reflects its era, it reflect it rather poorly - the Squad Leader system was already out by then. It had fire teams and a raid on Entebbe scenario, some Nam scenarios that required rather too much hidden placement by pen and paper to work. It was fun for a bit to design some ambushes almost as a GM and have players try to run through them in nearly RPG fashion, but it got old quickly IMO.

Maybe that is why I have the 29 year old board game sitting in a dusty shelf

Another reason I don't think CM needs cardiopulmonary resuscitation just a solid cash flow. Based on their track record I think they won't be cashing in the insurance policy soon.

I tried to remember all the AH board games I "loaned" to my brother over the years. I gave him all the miniatures as he was much more patient and talented painting the the little lead toys figures.

[Mord]

Mord,

You've got your sequence mixed up. CM is the noun, not the adjective. We don't have Normandy: CM, we have CMBN. Am going to therefore presume that EF CM/CMEF refers to the evidently aborted CMx2 version of CMBB! Why aborted?

John Kettler

Semantics, John, semantics! I didn't have all night to type out the next six thousand EF titles, modules, and packs!

Mord.

[Collingwood]

Are we dead yet?

Apparently not, at nearly 11,000 views.

[Fenris]

I'm just resting. I'm feeling much be'a.

-F

[Buzz]

Hard to die when CMSF the "Original Modern" won't cash in the chips either

With "New Modern" soon to be birthed well Battlefront will not slip away into some "Black Sea."

[Placebo]

Hard to die when CMSF the "Original Modern" won't cash in the chips either

With "New Modern" soon to be birthed well Battlefront will not slip away into some "Black Sea."

Talking of which, i recently dusted off my copy and have been playing again, there are loads of new scenarios still appearing, alot from peoples personal experiences in Iraq and Afganistan whicha really good. So i cannot wait for the new title to be launched.

Are there any bones anyone at BF can throw to us patiently waiting??

[Tank Hunter]

I'm hoping for a X-mass bone too! I like diversity so I basically have interest in all CM games. Looking forward to Black Sea and putting WW II in resting mode for a while.

[Michael Emrys]

I'm hoping for a X-mass bone too! I like diversity so I basically have interest in all CM games. Looking forward to Black Sea and putting WW II in resting mode for a while.

Yeah, I will be interested to give BFC's take on modern warfare a whirl. I liked TacOps a whole lot for a host of reasons, so I am not at all hostile to modern era games.

Michael

[Wodin]

The modern toys are fun!! Will be even better with two more matched up foes..

[Fenris]

Yeah me too. Wonder though with the lethality of modern systems will the new title require bigger maps?

-F