Visual Bone

[Chad Harrison]

Ha, night of the refresh monkies? I . . . may . . . have . . . helped bring that about

[Boo Radley]

Going to hold off on the screenshot untill the trees are redone. Will wait for the new graphics then have the scenario ready to be shown.

Rune

Why bother? It's not like the duct-taped puppies will be able to hide behind the trees.

Oh! You need them to be there so the zombie werewolves can set fire to them with the lasers embedded in their foreheads.

Gotcha!

[Battlefront.com]

To echo Rune... we've got to tweak the LODs for some things before showing some "big picture" shots. Got some ugly side effect going on that Charles hasn't got around to cleaning up yet. I've just poked him for a fix

Steve

[Blackcat]

To echo Rune... we've got to tweak the LODs for some things before showing some "big picture" shots. Got some ugly side effect going on that Charles hasn't got around to cleaning up yet. I've just poked him for a fix

Steve

Sorry, old chap, once more in English if you don't mind. What is a LOD?

[flamingknives]

Level of Detail. A graphics trick to avoid wasting processor cycles on rendering a Thompson safety catch when the view point is 2000m away. As you move the camera away from things, the model is replaced with successively simplified models referred to as levels of detail.

[snake_eye]

I am finding the GI's pretty well rendered and the fact that they are having their chinstrap on, do not bother me at all, despite the issue that followed and which is not that important to me, but on one point, which was that some thought wrongly for not having the right informations. Luckily, here they are. You will learn a lot of things from that US ARMY link about the helmets.

This link to the US ARMY MEDICAL DEPARTMENT – OFFICE OF MEDICAL HISTORY will close the debate about the helmet chinstrap and the blast injuries or death resulting from having it on by giving you real facts.

Here after is what they wrote about the chinstrap and the T1 release device made available from july 1944 (picture shown below), but not widely.

The full documents can be found at the following link

http://history.amedd.army.mil/booksdocs/wwii/woundblstcs/chapter11.htm

http://history.amedd.army.mil/booksdocs/wwii/woundblstcs/chapter11figure305.jpg

“During the course of the North African campaigns in 1943, the rigid hook fastener of the chinstrap was found to be a source of potential danger by remaining intact under the impact of a blast wave resulting from a nearby detonation and thereby jerking the head sharply and violently with the production of fractures or dislocations of the cervical vertebras. Therefore, it was necessary to redesign the helmet strap with a ball-and-clevis release so that it would remain closed during normal combat activities but would allow for. a quick voluntary release or automatic release at pressures considerably below the accepted level of danger. Following extensive tests by ordnance engineers, a new release device was developed which would release at a pull of 15 pounds or more. This device (fig. 308) shown below was standardized in 1944 »

This other link

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/M1_Helmet

Will give you first another explanation, which by the way reminded me, the way I was taught to get rid of a sentry, by slicing its throat and or breaking his neck by putting a knee on its back, while grabbing the helmet with one hand and pulling it violently backward. I was very happy, never to have to do it for real

Their second explanation, having not been informed about the US ARMY Medical enquiries is close to what many people think, that is, that the chinstrap is not the cause of injuries or death.

“During World War II and later, many soldiers wore the webbing chinstraps unfastened or looped around the back of the helmet and clipped together. This practice arose for two reasons: First, because hand-to-hand combat was anticipated, and an enemy could be expected to attack from behind, reach over the helmet, grab its visor, and pull. If the chinstrap were worn, the head would be snapped back, causing the victim to lose balance, and leave the throat and stomach exposed to a knife thrust. Secondly, many men incorrectly believed that a nearby exploding bomb or artillery shell could cause the chinstrap to snap their neck when the helmet was caught in its concussive force, although a replacement buckle, the T-1 pressure-release buckle, was manufactured that allowed the chinstrap to release automatically should this occur. In place of the chinstrap, the nape strap inside the liner was counted on to provide sufficient contact to keep the helmet from easily falling off the wearer's head”

Well, I hope that these links will help you in comprehending that chin strap debate.

Cheers

[Battlefront.com]

BTW, there is another reason chinstraps were left undone. Has anybody tried to take a buckled US M1 style helmet off with one hand? It's not easy! Now think of yourself, walking down a hot and dusty road in the summer. How many times do you think you would want to take your helmet off and wipe your head of sweat? Probably more than once a day

Although this is just a guess, I'm thinking that there were simply practical comfort reasons to have the strap off. You can remove the helmet with one hand, easily, under any circumstances. And if both hands are free, even better! One hand takes the helmet off, the other hand wipes the head.

Steve

[flamingknives]

My trouble with the medical report is twofold:

1) The danger is only reported as being potential

2) If the rumour is doing the rounds that blast and chinstraps are bad combinations, then it will be difficult to convince the troops to fasten them if there is another need (head injuries caused after the helmet falls off or due to it being worn improperly*, reduced combat effectiveness due to faffing about with the unfastened helmet.) So one way to do it is to slightly changing the chinstrap and telling the soldiers that you have fixed the problem. Bingo! Confidence restored.

* That's a pretty big issue. Give most people a helmet and the instinctive behaviour has it pushed back on the head, exposing the temples which are the most vulnerable part of the skull. Part of the linked report also notes that soldiers taking cover from artillery sometimes lose helmets and are consequently injured by the second or third volleys.

I just cannot understand how this particular blast dynamic can work and be based on the same physical effect as "regular" blast. As a comparison, if we put a watermelon in a cooking pot and blew that up, the force differential implied by the neck-break scenario means that the pot should vanish into the wide blue yonder while the watermelon remains, unscathed.

[theFightingSeabee]

Although this is just a guess, I'm thinking that there were simply practical comfort reasons to have the strap off.

Steve

Good guess in my opinion. Having had to wear a kevlar helmet with chin strap for long periods of time, I know how much it sucks. Talking and eating are uncomfortable because you can't open your mouth all the way. Also, as Steve said, sometimes you just gotta take it off to either give your neck a break (not fracture ), wipe off sweat, or just get those darn hurtful straps off of the noggin for a few.

Oh, and if it makes John Wayne look cool, it will make you look cool too!

[snake_eye]

Although this is just a guess, I'm thinking that there were simply practical comfort reasons to have the strap off. You can remove the helmet with one hand, easily, under any circumstances. And if both hands are free, even better! One hand takes the helmet off, the other hand wipes the head.

Steve

Right guess, GI's always tried to find practical comfort reasons to wear the M1 Helmet and the chin strap off is primarily one of them, the thought of the injuries was secondary. It is like the campaign for not smoking every smoker thinks that what they advertise will happen to someone else and not to them. I did so.

The GI's, also used their Helmet to carry a cigarette pack, matches and or pictures of relatives (and or girlfriend), letters and even more militarily a folded map. All these rather put in a plastic wrapping to avoid the sweat condensation. They even used it sometimes at the rear for cooking or as a seat. The quartermaster had at the time to issue a warning through a leaflet over stressing the danger of cooking with it, hence reducing the steel treatment value.

The helmet was also used in close combat to break the skull of an enemy when no more ammo was available and nothing practical in hand (like a folding shovel). If the chin strap had been on, the time to take it off, it will have been too late.

The best use I recall, was to use it for collecting money in order to have a huge party, God that was fantastic.

Cheers

[Meach]

To add to the chinstrap debate...

If a blast is sufficient to damage your neck chances are your mouth is open to scream "oh ya bugger!" which channels the blast past your tonsils and blows the back of your head off.

Saw a few like that. Not much burns or damage but large holes at the back of the head above the cervical vertebrae. When we asked about it we were given the above explanation. True or false I dunno cos I am not a physicist but explosions are bad, mm'kay?

[Michael Emrys]

To add to the chinstrap debate...

If a blast is sufficient to damage your neck chances are your mouth is open to scream "oh ya bugger!" which channels the blast past your tonsils and blows the back of your head off.

Saw a few like that. Not much burns or damage but large holes at the back of the head above the cervical vertebrae. When we asked about it we were given the above explanation. True or false I dunno cos I am not a physicist but explosions are bad, mm'kay?

No expert on the subject am I, but my suspicion is that a blast strong enough to do that particular thing would also blow most of the skin off one's face. Might have been a random piece of shell fragment? Still bizarre...

Michael

[bodkin]

To add to the chinstrap debate...

If a blast is sufficient to damage your neck chances are your mouth is open to scream "oh ya bugger!" which channels the blast past your tonsils and blows the back of your head off.

Don't artillery men try to open their mouths to relieve the discomfort of the pressure of the muzzle blast? Maybe this is a different level of physics at work.

[MikeyD]

People are talking like in all cases blast effect is sufficient to tear you limb from limb. Yes, standing right on top of the explsion you're right. But 20m away? 30m? 40m? After a certain distance the energies applied would be reduced to 'car crash' levels. I suspect there's a reason why nobody's designed an auto aftermarket strap to tie around your neck and attach to the headrest.

[Erwin]

The pictures are GREAT! However, we've seen LOTS of great-looking games that had gameplay that sucked.

So, for THIS audience, I plead that you guys focus on GAMEPLAY and the aspects that made CM1 the best game of its type to date, and CM2 a extremely good game and the best of the modern genre.

[Michael Emrys]

The pictures are GREAT! However, we've seen LOTS of great-looking games that had gameplay that sucked.

So, for THIS audience, I plead that you guys focus on GAMEPLAY and the aspects that made CM1 the best game of its type to date, and CM2 a extremely good game and the best of the modern genre.

They did that in the original bone last week and the whining for pictures was so deafening that BFS responded by putting up the pics. I think we lucked out to get it both ways, given the small size of the BFC staff. I think it is totally cool to remind them that excellent gameplay will be rewarded, and should be given first priority, but speaking for myself I am not too worried about that now.

Michael

[TheVulture]

The pictures are GREAT! However, we've seen LOTS of great-looking games that had gameplay that sucked.

So, for THIS audience, I plead that you guys focus on GAMEPLAY and the aspects that made CM1 the best game of its type to date, and CM2 a extremely good game and the best of the modern genre.

I think that the CM:SF engine combined with the more interesting setting of WWII (my humble opinion, natch) already take care of my worries about gameplay. And graphics will be pretty impressive obviously.

What I want to see improved most is the interface, partly in terms of implementing new features for giving commands (including some CMx1 features that never made it in to CMSF for a variety of reasons), but mostly in terms of providing information to the player.

I'd also like some kind of 'tactical map' that showed unit positions, orientations, status and so on, to give a kind of overview of the battle situation. And while we are making wishes in fairyland, I'd like CM:N to have a special print driver module to make my printer produce sheets of gold foil from thin air.

[Erwin]

The pic of the town square looks horribly like "Company of Heroes" and their type. I hope we'll see things dirtied up, weathered and worn too. Or, is that going to be up to the mod volunteers?

Problem is that there are far fewer mods for the CMSF series than for CM1, so I assume mods are a lot harder in CM2(?)

[Dietrich]

Problem is that there are far fewer mods for the CMSF series than for CM1, so I assume mods are a lot harder in CM2(?)

That's not because modding is any more difficult in CMx2 but because far fewer people are interested in non-WW2 warfare.

It's yet another thing I look forward to as regards CM:N -- a greater number and wider variety of both mods and scenarios.

[Battlefront.com]

I also think the subject matter is harder to improve when looking at an arid environment. One of the long standing jokes around here is "who's grass mod are you using?". I have yet to hear "who's sand mod are you using" simply because it's much harder to have a different artistic interpretation of sand than grass. Similar to how we never heard people saying "who's snow mod are you using?" for CMBB. And although I've done no research on what I'm about to say, I suspect CMAK had the least number of mods proportional to the players owning it.

Having said that, modding CMx2 is definitely more difficult than modding CMx1 because the models in CMx1 were quite primitive. People with even a mediocre understanding of MS Paint or PhotoShop could make mods fairly easily. Not so with the more complex objects in CMx2.

Lastly, when we did the artwork for CMx1 games we kept medium sized graphics cards in mind. Modders tend not to be so kind Which means someone could make a really super detailed Panther A mod that took up a ton of VRAM and not really care about the overall effect because it isn't his problem if the game starts to slow down or cease working for the player with the 3 year old card. Therefore, we had to purposefully keep some artistic quality in check. With CMx2 we've had to do that a lot less thanks to breakthroughs in affordable VRAM and graphics processing power. Which means that we aren't holding back as much, which in turn means that modders have a higher standard to surpass before their work measures up to our work.

Therefore, I expect there to be less mods for CM: Normandy than there was for CMBO proportional to the number of customers of each. And to me, that's fine because it means more people are happy with their "out of the box" experience.

Steve

[softwaretool]

hey, why all of you think that?

dont think its echo image

[snake_eye]

To add to the chinstrap debate...

If a blast is sufficient to damage your neck chances are your mouth is open to scream "oh ya bugger!" which channels the blast past your tonsils and blows the back of your head off.

Saw a few like that. Not much burns or damage but large holes at the back of the head above the cervical vertebrae. When we asked about it we were given the above explanation. True or false I dunno cos I am not a physicist but explosions are bad, mm'kay?

I think that the following link should be helpful to comprehend the PBI (Primary Blast Injury) effect on soldiers and or civilians. It is very well done and survey terrorists as well as militaries explosion from reports in different countries with a very precise medical insight.

Here after a short recollection of a rocket attack on 2 soldiers

Blast effect military medical study link

http://www.wramc.army.mil/Patients/healthcare/psychology/clinic/VTCFellowshipProgram/SESSION%20V%20-%20DEVENSE%20AND%20VETERANS%20HEAD%20INJURY%20PROGRAM/BLASE%20INJURY.PDF

[sfhand]

I also think the subject matter is harder to improve when looking at an arid environment. One of the long standing jokes around here is "who's grass mod are you using?". I have yet to hear "who's sand mod are you using" simply because it's much harder to have a different artistic interpretation of sand than grass. Similar to how we never heard people saying "who's snow mod are you using?" for CMBB. And although I've done no research on what I'm about to say, I suspect CMAK had the least number of mods proportional to the players owning it.

Having said that, modding CMx2 is definitely more difficult than modding CMx1 because the models in CMx1 were quite primitive. People with even a mediocre understanding of MS Paint or PhotoShop could make mods fairly easily. Not so with the more complex objects in CMx2.

Lastly, when we did the artwork for CMx1 games we kept medium sized graphics cards in mind. Modders tend not to be so kind Which means someone could make a really super detailed Panther A mod that took up a ton of VRAM and not really care about the overall effect because it isn't his problem if the game starts to slow down or cease working for the player with the 3 year old card. Therefore, we had to purposefully keep some artistic quality in check. With CMx2 we've had to do that a lot less thanks to breakthroughs in affordable VRAM and graphics processing power. Which means that we aren't holding back as much, which in turn means that modders have a higher standard to surpass before their work measures up to our work.

Therefore, I expect there to be less mods for CM: Normandy than there was for CMBO proportional to the number of customers of each. And to me, that's fine because it means more people are happy with their "out of the box" experience.

Steve

Steve,

I only use one mod for CM:SF, which is pinetree's base mod (I think that is what it is called). I urge you to give pinetree a little love and see if there is any way to include this mod in the release of CM:N.

[theFightingSeabee]

Well, it seems like half the mods are made by the same guys working on the game (including testers), so they are surpassing their own work. And it's not just about getting better quality, it's about changing the look. Great examples are changing desert paint/uniforms to temperate. Or the mods that reduce or get rid of sun glare, or the sun itself, or mods that reduce the size of the background mountain images. There's a lot of room for many, many mods.

I wholeheartedly agree with sfhand. Pinetree's base mods is one of those you can't go back from. It's simply the best (imo) and provides not only color indicators, but shape indicators as well. Much better than stock bases. Beside the fact that Pinetree is a good guy and went to New Zealand Army boot camp with none other than the great Rhys Dharby.

[Wengart]

Pinetree's base mods is one of those you can't go back from. It's simply the best (imo) and provides not only color indicators, but shape indicators as well.

The shape indicators have the added bonus of helping the colorblind.