ParaBellum Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 During a maneuver in France in '94 our mortars (120mm) fired at targets in front of our positions, about 1 km ahead of us. With the scope of my rifle I could see the explosions from the rounds very well and believe me, I never saw any shockwaves. My best friend served in an arty regiment and they made a video of one of their training shoots with their 155mm guns. Guess what? No shockwaves at all. But pretty big explosions and lots of dust kicking up. I detonated an AT-mine (9.7kg explosives) with a secondary 200g load. Almost 10kg of high explosive, guess what? No shockwave. Although you could feel the shockwave even through the armoured glass of the bunker window you couldn't see it. I'll never forget that. The mine detonated about 10m from the bunker window. It felt as if the whole bunker was swinging back and for half a second. And I've seen Leo 2s firing their 120mm guns at the range. Guess what? Never saw any shockwaves from the impact of the HE rounds. I like it how it is now, IMO more realistic, please keep it that way. [ September 03, 2002, 08:01 AM: Message edited by: ParaBellum ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Please don't. You lot need to see big buildings go boom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetchez la Vache Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 /me drops out of long-time lurking mode Personally I liked the 'shockwave' effect in the original. I clearly remember playing the Valley demo scenerio and watching my 75mm field gun lobbing it's arcing shells which then exploded with an explosion and a shockwave. That was the exact moment when I suddenly realised I HAD to order this game pdq. I regard it as a playing aid, in line with unit bases or unit size. It does take away from the realism but makes easier to see what is going on in the 'big picture' of the battle. But maybe it's something I don't want to see when I'm replaying the turn in view 1 and following my luckless inf coy as it comes under arty barrage. Therefore I would 'vote' for the option, if it's not too late, to enable/disable the shockwaves with hotkeys as desired. [ September 03, 2002, 08:08 AM: Message edited by: Fetchez la Vache ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thin Red Line Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Originally posted by ParaBellum: Guess what? No shockwaves at all. But pretty big explosions and lots of dust kicking up.I always thought that dust was the thing really missing in CM explosions. Huge plumes of dust... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Originally posted by Thin Red Line: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by ParaBellum: Guess what? No shockwaves at all. But pretty big explosions and lots of dust kicking up.I always thought that dust was the thing really missing in CM explosions. Huge plumes of dust...</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Originally posted by KwazyDog: I have dozens of WW2 documentaries Ive bought over the past couple of years and have never seen such a shockwave.Dan, I am totally with you in this debate, but have to differ with you on the above statement. I've been watching WW II documentaries for 50 years and have seen shockwaves scores if not hundreds of times. These included muzzle blasts from artillery, especially naval artillery, and aircraft bombs. Large explosions are far more likely to cause them than lesser explosions. But under extreme conditions of temperature and humidity almost anything can cause them. I have photographs of fighters taxiing on carrier decks leaving condensation trails from their prop tips. But none of that means that there ought to be shockwaves in CM. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
litchy Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 At the end of the day it's a game, so let the players choose. Please put a toggle in. Just a thought could it be shockwaves on all, off, guns only (no buildings). This would please everybody as then they can play it the way they choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Bump if you want shockwaves! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Bates Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Despite the realism/humidity/metereological discussion, at the end of the day, shockwaves made it easier to see what was going on. I like CMBB's more realistic graphics. However, throw in the lack of the shockwaves along with darker terrain and it can get tricky to see what's happening. I wouldn't support forcing shockwaves on to other players, so it would be good if they were optional. In any case, the decision has already been taken, the game is days away from release and it is too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMX2 Borg Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 This constant barrage of independent thought is NOT ACCEPTABLE. This never-ending stream of "I hate the interface, why can't we have pictures of naked dancing panda bears" is tireless, relentless, and unnecessary. BFC have worked hard to bring this Collective into being; you have all been brought into it quite unwillingly but don't pretend for a second it gives you the right to complain, quibble, or even dream. You are not Madmatt. You are not even Deanco. You will NOT be selected to be a member of the Hive Brain. Rather, you will play CMBB and you will like it! You will become one of us. Resistance is futile. The Collective will not tolerate your mewling and whining any longer. You will be aCMilated. Mods are irrelevant. Grognanical Discussion is irrelevant. Your enjoyment of CMBB will be added to our own. Did I mention you will be aCMilated? Suck it up and together we will rule the gaming universe. GI Combatters will tremble in their dens at our approach. They too will be aCMilated. It is only a matter of time. Bickering is futile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Bates Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by CMBB Borg: This constant barrage of independent thought is NOT ACCEPTABLE.There are still remnants of the CMBO militia in the hills over-looking Western Munkeeland! Since the year 2000 they have become severely inter-bred. Find them and KILL them!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Now that ain't zackly true. Why a little bit of whinning here an there has worked wonders in the past. And asides, who would be against naked panda bears. You ever seen a naked dancing Grizzly bear... Well there you go then. There is just something about the oriental dances that stands out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by M. Bates: Despite the realism/humidity/metereological discussion, at the end of the day, shockwaves made it easier to see what was going on.This is why I prefer the shockwaves. When viewing a PBEM movie I would do one entire replay from view 5 or 6 just to note any spotting rounds coming in. Now I will probably have to use multiple replays from lower angles to get the same information. When seen from view 6 the shockwaves don't look nearly as cheesy as they do close up. They're actually pretty cool. [ September 04, 2002, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: Vanir Ausf B ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 There is no logical reason for anyone to get their panties in a bunch over the Demo. Why do I say that? Because it's a Demo. Limited Graphics. Downsampled Sounds. Limited Scenarios. For all I know a 155mm shell landing creates a mushroom cloud (which would be kinda cool actually). So relax. You're getting all excited and you haven't even peeked under the Burkah yet. -dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by Andreas: Please don't. You lot need to see big buildings go boom.Oooh, are there secondaries? I want secondaries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 For reference to se where my arty is going (and/or coming in on me) in I would like to see instead of the shock-horror-waves, that hang in the balance, how about smaller versions of the dust that lingers when a building is taken out. Not sure what would appear when snow is on the ground - fluuffy white steam?? Finlanding Arty grogs?? Can't wait to see night battles! I wonder if there will be a few flashes to tell what's coming down and blowing up plus the parachute flares that'll illuminate the battlefield for a turn or two. Yum Yum [ September 04, 2002, 12:29 PM: Message edited by: Wicky ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agua Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 If an optional and toggleable shockwave effect can be reintroduced rather easily, via patch, then I can't see where that would hurt anything and would, at the same time, make everyone happy. If it would require some large investment of effort, don't worry with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaylord Focker Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 All this over shockwaves? I think everyone who complains about no shock waves should get a mystery key part of the game, for instance, Germans, missing from their game. This way they have something to actualy bitch about. Shockwaves are not an issue for me, the game rocks and it's only the demo so stop being so f-ing negetive already and enjoy the best wargame ever made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMX2 Borg Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by dalem: I -dale"I"? "I"? You pathetic, indiscriminate, unfeeling clod! You are not fully aCMilated. Report to detention area www.battlefront.com/cgi-bin/bbs/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=9 for reaCMilation! We approve of your comments; we do not approve of your attitude. You have been warned. You will soon be we. "I" will become "us". Together we will dictate the future of the wargaming market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by CMBB Borg: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by dalem: I -dale"I"? "I"? You pathetic, indiscriminate, unfeeling clod! You are not fully aCMilated. Report to detention area www.battlefront.com/cgi-bin/bbs/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=9 for reaCMilation! We approve of your comments; we do not approve of your attitude. You have been warned. You will soon be we. "I" will become "us". Together we will dictate the future of the wargaming market.</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by Gaylord Focker: All this over shockwaves? I think everyone who complains about no shock waves should get a mystery key part of the game, for instance, Germans, missing from their game. This way they have something to actualy bitch about. Shockwaves are not an issue for me, the game rocks and it's only the demo so stop being so f-ing negetive already and enjoy the best wargame ever made.All this over people discussing shockwaves? I think everyone who complains about people expressing their point of view on the forum should have a mystery key part of the forum, for instance, their posting privileges, missing. This way they have something to actually bitch about. Shockwaves are an issue for me (albeit a rather small one), nobody is suggesting the game will not rock without them, and we all know it's only the demo so stop being so f-ing negative already and enjoy the best wargame forum on the internet. [ September 04, 2002, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: Vanir Ausf B ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomm Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Originally posted by Vanir Ausf B:... They're actually pretty cool.This is also my humble opinion on the subject! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Harrison Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 The shockwaves are pretty cool to watch, but I didnt even notice that they were not in the game until you all mentioned it. I would rather have BTS work on something else than add back in the shockwaves. Anyhow, its a matter of taste and their taste is what decides it. Change is going to happen, we all just need to cope with it! Chad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauCoupDinkyDau Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Of Shockwaves and Tracers. . .and Realism handels this same subject with a little less passion, and a little more objectivity IMHO. [ September 04, 2002, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: Vader's Jester ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt. Ryan Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 I always thought the shockwaves looked a little cheesey, but now I appreciate them for their usefulness more than their visual accuracy. [ September 04, 2002, 01:34 PM: Message edited by: Pvt. Ryan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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