dpabrams Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Or is it just me? I have lots of stories. How about the commander who opens his moving Cromwell IV and is shot once through the head by a single rifle shot from 100 meters away, 1 second after the hatch is opened. And no, it wasn't a sniper. As it stands now, I cannot have a single open British tank within 250 meters of even an enemy pistol. It appears to me the most vulnerable place on the battlefield in CM:BN is a British tank. I didn’t observe this mortality in US tanks or German tanks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franko Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 A head-sized target at 100 meters is not that hard. Especially for a trained rifleman, to say nothing of a whole squad of pissed off enemy riflemen. Button up if you're within 100 meters of cover which may contain bad guys. Or scout with infantry. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpabrams Posted March 25, 2012 Author Share Posted March 25, 2012 I understand the tactics and need to stay buttoned near enemy units. That being said, I am telling you that British tanks, in particular the Cromwell and Churchill seem to suffer a higher casualty rate in relation to other tanks. This has been my particular experience in the time I have had CM. Could it be bad luck, certainly, do I have any hard data, no. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franko Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I haven't had one get shot yet, so it sounds like I'm getting lucky and you're unlucky. The Fog of War. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieMike24 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Perhaps the British tank commander's head is bigger than the US one? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieme(ITA) Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Churchill tanks are 2.5 meters high and the commander's cupola or hatches do not seem to offer much protection all around: I am not sure if the game simulates differently the tank commanders' exposure depending on the vehicle type or height, nonetheless I recognize unbuttoned tank commanders being much easier to kill after the last patch/module. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Yep its the pistol shots that do it. BTW in RL there is an action in Normandy where a British tank commander uses his pistol to take out an enemy sniper in a tree. : ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave85 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Apparently it was part of the CW patch in an attempt to reduce a tanks spotting abilities. I have had the same experience with Brits but you may find its the same for the US and krauts now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Williams Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Guess we all better keep our armor buttoned up most of the time now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil stanbridge Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Is this not realistic? I will always try and (remember) to button my tank when I advance into territory I suspect is occupied with enemy infantry. You're asking for trouble otherwise. I remember the same thing in CMx1 too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chainsaw Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 IMHO its realistic. We (still!) had the same problem while I was in the army. Our tank commanders in their Leo2A4 was all riding high and having a good look around, totally ignoring our small arm/machine gun fire against them. We bitched plenty about it so after a while both the commander and loader had to wear BT system (simfire system that tells if you are shot) like the ones we had. Commander Casualtys increased like bloody hell and loaders stopped playing with that damn loader MG They learnt the leason, after one weeks exercise where they had pathetic amounts of TCs shot they learn to hunk down and not show so much of them self... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1966 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Apparently it was part of the CW patch in an attempt to reduce a tanks spotting abilities. I have had the same experience with Brits but you may find its the same for the US and krauts now. But wasn't the problem the ability of a tank to spot when it was buttoned? If the TC is exposed then I'd expect good spotting ability... And while I think about it, with all these realistic ballistics and WYSIWYG whatnot, how do you "nerf" the game quite like that anyway? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Apparently it was part of the CW patch in an attempt to reduce a tanks spotting abilities. I have had the same experience with Brits but you may find its the same for the US and krauts now. Where are you getting that from? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 It all makes sense, but the Israelis at least trained and successfully fought with commanders uncovered. Perhaps they maneuvered faster and the ranges were longer? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Or perhaps they just died. All the Israeli tank and APC commanders were standing in their turrets... Within minutes, twenty out of the twenty-four Israeli tank commanders were hit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Suez 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave85 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Where are you getting that from? It was just a comment I read on another thread. "How to button my TC?" Or summin.... Ive certainly noticed a FAR higher TC attrition rate since the module (I've only played as british so far though) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SelfLoadingRifle Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I had a tank commander who refused to bail out of a brewed up Cromwell. He just sat there in the turret and (presumably) fried. The uber-marksmanship by German soldiers recorded on this thread might just offer an explanation!! SLR 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Silly question. Have we been so busy playing Commonwealth forces that an overall change to TC vulnerability has slipped in under the radar? I'm speaking as someone too busy playing Commonwealth forces, myself. I don't know the last time I sent a US tank into combat and don't know if he's become more or less vulnerable after the patch. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 There's a good chance this problem was addressed at some point, although I don't remember if this was pre- or post- v1.01. http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=99380&highlight=sniper 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpabrams Posted March 25, 2012 Author Share Posted March 25, 2012 Silly question. Have we been so busy playing Commonwealth forces that an overall change to TC vulnerability has slipped in under the radar? I'm speaking as someone too busy playing Commonwealth forces, myself. I don't know the last time I sent a US tank into combat and don't know if he's become more or less vulnerable after the patch. Please BF, so somefink. Seriously, I have noted: 1. Increased mortality of open tank commanders 2. Decreased sighting ability of buttoned tanks (which I believe was intended). Seems that buttoned tanks facing or with an arc that encompasses enemy infantry in bocage for example; can spot said infantry at about 50 meters. That's if the infantry are not hidden and likely firing at said bottoned tank. 3. Increased "bullet magnet" effect of open tank commanders and accuracy of small arms fire aimed at soon to be deceased open tank commander. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ithikial_AU Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Problem I've noticed is that when some (British in this case) tank commanders are shot at they just sit there for a while and don't button up immediatly. I'm hearing MG fire rattling off the Sherman's chasis and the commander is just sitting there enjoying a spot of tea. Sure enough the second or third burst takes him out. I don't mind higher mortality rates for tank commanders but surely even the most poorly or highly trained tank commander buttons up immediatly when he hear's a nearby rifle shot. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 I have noted: 1. Increased mortality of open tank commanders 2. Decreased sighting ability of buttoned tanks (which I believe was intended). Seems that buttoned tanks facing or with an arc that encompasses enemy infantry in bocage for example; can spot said infantry at about 50 meters. That's if the infantry are not hidden and likely firing at said bottoned tank. 3. Increased "bullet magnet" effect of open tank commanders and accuracy of small arms fire aimed at soon to be deceased open tank commander. These actually sound to me like longstanding complaints that must've been fixed. Peope had been complaining about infantry's seeming inability to kill unbuttoned TCs and the 'super-spotting' ability of buttoned tanks against infantry. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 1. Increased mortality of open tank commanders 2. Decreased sighting ability of buttoned tanks (which I believe was intended). Seems that buttoned tanks facing or with an arc that encompasses enemy infantry in bocage for example; can spot said infantry at about 50 meters. That's if the infantry are not hidden and likely firing at said bottoned tank. 3. Increased "bullet magnet" effect of open tank commanders and accuracy of small arms fire aimed at soon to be deceased open tank commander. These actually sound to me like longstanding complaints that must've been fixed. Peope had been complaining about infantry's seeming inability to kill unbuttoned TCs and the 'super-spotting' ability of buttoned tanks against infantry. LOL BF cannot win can they. I think the patch changes make the game better. Now we have to be careful with tanks running around without infantry support. Which is a good thing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat Johnston Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 LOL BF cannot win can they. Hehe, no game developers are ever allowed to fix the right thing - or if by some miracle they have fixed the right thing, they're never allowed to have done it right... Mind, as far as the poor TCs go, it seems to me like they're now more vulnerable to bullets than Joe Infantry at the same distance, which... well, I guess they're 2 metres off the ground and it's obvious where they are, but by the same token they're mostly covered by a bulletproof shell of armour. *shrugs* Question for me is how abstract the computer model of the vehicle shape is, and whether that's taken into account when determining whether the TC gets it, or whether the TC is being treated as an exposed infantryman in plain sight high above the ground... no idea what the answer is, and the guy upthread talking about TCs getting shot in exercises sounds good. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Mind, as far as the poor TCs go, it seems to me like they're now more vulnerable to bullets than Joe Infantry at the same distance, which... well, I guess they're 2 metres off the ground and it's obvious where they are, but by the same token they're mostly covered by a bulletproof shell of armour. *shrugs* Question for me is how abstract the computer model of the vehicle shape is, and whether that's taken into account when determining whether the TC gets it, or whether the TC is being treated as an exposed infantryman in plain sight high above the ground Well, as you probably know, one of the great strengths of BFC is that if you create a test that shows that a TC is as exposed as an in the open infantry man they will have a look at the game. They will act if you can show - with a repeatable test - that something is wrong. And I am pretty sure that they do model the tank's armor and the position of the crew. Remember that bug Steve described where the Tiger tank had poorer than expected visibility when it was buttoned up and it turned out to have been caused by the TC sitting in a seat that was incorrectly modeled to be out of alignment with the TC's viewing ports. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.