The rising sun Module

[Oneyearwarpilot]

Does anyone hope to see the pacific front in one of the later module not just include US and Imperial force but Nationalist Chinese and ANZAC(I think that how its pronounced) The pacific was such a different fight more flames, ambushes and maneuverability would an even bigger roll the tanks were lighter and infantry warfare was more potent in a way what do you guys think plus you can mix in the Russians as well as Nationalist vs Communist scenarios.

[Michael Emrys]

BFC have repeatedly stated that they have no interest in the PTO. If you have a spare million to offer them, they might changed their minds.

Michael

[mjkerner]

It's always possible waaaay down the road that a 3rd party might be licensed to develop it. I'm interested in it, since my Dad fought there, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Oneyearwarpilot]

It was just an Idea I'm not trying to force anything I Just what it would be like to fight in this setting

I wish I had that kind of money Then I would.

[YankeeDog]

This has been brought up here before.

Pacific theater warfare was indeed different, and if done right a PTO CMx2 family might be very interesting to play. However (and I hate to bust your bubble), but this is simply not going to happen for the foreseeable future unless another game company steps in, licenses the CMx2 engine from BFC and produces a PTO game (which I don't think is likely).

Short version of the story is the BFC has their development calendar pretty well mapped out for at least the next 5 years, probably more like 10 -- right now, focus is on modules to CMBN. Then new game families will follow, perhaps not in this exact order: CM:Battle of the Bulge (w/ 2-4 modules), CM: East Front 1944 Bagration (w/2-4 modules), and another modern warfare-based CMx2 title.

Of course, things could change, but I don't think PTO is likely to usurp any of the above on "the list".

[Childress]

Does anyone hope to see the pacific front in one of the later module not just include US and Imperial force but Nationalist Chinese and ANZAC(I think that how its pronounced)

Among other issues with the Pacific theater, I can't think of a way of implementing the Banzai charge in a CM setting. Historically the Allies, armed with automatic weapons, stopped these attacks cold. They proved fruitless. The Japanese player would have to be compelled by some game mechanic to use them.

[slysniper]

I think of ASL any time someone starts asking for all the less covered areas of the war. the only system that did and likely will ever cover all the countries, troops and units.

But given enough tools in the system, players can and have done stuff to represent different fronts.

In CMX1 I played scenarios that represented japan and some of the battles. I recall mods being made to make the game look correct.

The players will come up with ways to try and protray different areas the game does not cover. I recall some early war battles I played also, again mods were even made to represent tanks that the game did not have.

Even though it was actually another tank being used with similar attributes.

So, if someone gets creative, there might be some Scenarios made of battles in the front

[YankeeDog]

Among other issues with the Pacific theater, I can't think of a way of implementing the Banzai charge in a CM setting. Historically the Allies, armed with automatic weapons, stopped these attacks cold. They proved fruitless. The Japanese player would have to be compelled by some game mechanic to use them.

Yep; virtually impossible for Human vs. Human unless player control is removed in ways I suspect most players would not enjoy. Would be possible for Player vs. Computer, tho.

Japanese small-unit tactics in WWII is a very interesting topic, and admittedly one I am not especially well read on. In some areas, such as infiltration and night combat, they were quite good. But right up to the end of the war, they also definitely clung to certain antiquated notions that caused them to waste of lives for very little gain, the banzai charge probably being the best example.

[Rocky Balboa]

Despite the challenges, I would pay to play CM:PTO.

As been mentioned before BF is not interested in doing it and the only other developer who might be able to pull it off would be Snowball who made CM:Afganistan. I wish I had a link to their site so I could send them some words of encouragement. Hope they speak english cause I definitely don't speak Ruskie ....

[Wodin]

It wouldn't be a module and your looking at least seven to eight years away I reckon once all the currently planned games and modules are done.

I for one have no interest at all in a Pacific War game, especially with this game engine.

[Wodin]

Anyway the english language we use today is barely recognisable from the one used in the middle ages.

[Sixxkiller]

I beg for PTO all the time. In fact I brought it up behind the scenes just yesterday. I have been asking since 2007 in various forms. The crickets you hear have been alive a long time.

And this engine is perfect for a PTO game.

[beatmasta]

It was just an Idea I'm not trying to force anything I Just what it would be like to fight in this setting

I wish I had that kind of money Then I would.

.......,,,,,,,, Here's some free dots and commas. Feel free to use them

[Malaspina]

In CMX1 I played scenarios that represented japan and some of the battles. I recall mods being made to make the game look correct.

So, if someone gets creative, there might be some Scenarios made of battles in the front

That was a kickass mod for CMBO. Loved it. They also had a voice mod in Japanese, the maps were terrific. Most of them tropical island scenarios with beach landings, fantastic.

I too feel this cmx2 engine would be perfect. I'm very sceptical of it being suitable for Bagration 44 with the vast open spaces and huge tank battles of the Eastern front.

[Childress]

Yep; virtually impossible for Human vs. Human unless player control is removed in ways I suspect most players would not enjoy. Would be possible for Player vs. Computer, tho.

I seem to recall BFC attempting to simulate Russian 'human wave' attacks in CMBB. How did that work out? Honestly don't remember.

The Zulus seem to have had success with that tactic against the British. Once.

[Faelwolf]

I would absolutley love a PTO game and modules using this engine. I don't see it happening without a 3rd party developer, as others have already mentioned

[Sgt Joch]

I would personally love to see the PTO.

re: Banzai charges, too much as been made about this as in the "Human wave" attacks on the eatern front.

There were many interesting small unit actions in the PTO and Japanese troops could be very deadly. I was reading recently about the fighting on Bougainville. The japanese troops had an intricate system of camouflaged bunkers, trenches and even their troops in their jungle lines. They would let U.S. troops, even tanks, move over their forward lines and then maneuver to cut them off and drive them back. They even managed to knock many tanks from point blank range.

[sburke]

Despite the challenges, I would pay to play CM:PTO.

As been mentioned before BF is not interested in doing it and the only other developer who might be able to pull it off would be Snowball who made CM:Afganistan. I wish I had a link to their site so I could send them some words of encouragement. Hope they speak english cause I definitely don't speak Ruskie ....

same here, I'd also pay for a CMx2 Vietnam....then again I'd pay for a Cmx2 1980s Central Europe as well and of course all the existing plans for ww 2. Basically BFC has a customer here for as long as they want to keep cranking stuff out.

[YankeeDog]

I'm very sceptical of it being suitable for Bagration 44 with the vast open spaces and huge tank battles of the Eastern front.

You should read (or re-read) some Bagration histories. Most of the terrain the fighting took place in on the Central Front in June-September 1944 was not at all the wide open "Tank Country" of the Steppe, but rather a moderately dense mix of woods, rivers, small towns and agricultural land. Not all that unlike Western Europe, actually (though certainly not as enclosed as the Normandy Bocage).

As far as wide-open Steppe battles go, worth remembering that CMx2's opening act was the wide open deserts of Syria. There are obviously some differences when depicting T-34s rather than T-72s, but I have every confidence the engine can handle it.

[sburke]

You should read (or re-read) some Bagration histories. Most of the terrain the fighting took place in on the Central Front in June-September 1944 was not at all the wide open "Tank Country" of the Steppe, but rather a moderately dense mix of woods, rivers, small towns and agricultural land. Not all that unlike Western Europe, actually (though certainly not as enclosed as the Normandy Bocage).

As far as wide-open Steppe battles go, worth remembering that CMx2's opening act was the wide open deserts of Syria. There are obviously some differences when depicting T-34s rather than T-72s, but I have every confidence the engine can handle it.

Actually think it would handle those better than it is handling Normandy, much as I love the setting. The dynamics of the map seem to have a huge impact on performance and a flatter more wide open map would seem to have fewer problems than some of what we seem to be running into.

[LongLeftFlank]

Seems to me that given enough gumption, PTO fanbois should be able to mod up a creditable representation once the Commonwealth module comes out.

Strip the Brits of their vehicles, mod faces (M1A1TC did some North Koreans for CMSF -- there's a start), uniforms and Airborne helmets, set morale to Fanatic and you've got a reasonable surrogate "Japanese" force to face the US (or British) Army (remember, more US Army soldiers fought in the PTO than Marines). No clue whether squad size compares, I'm sure someone knows.

Bren for Nambu, 2 inch mortars stand in for "knee mortars" and Tojo's yer uncle! Yes, your infantry are lugging SMLE .303 instead of the underpowered Arisaka .25 but ya can't have everything. I gather Japanese artillery was quite good, on the German model. Oh, and buy lots and lots of snipers.

For tanks, you'll likely need to wait until the final "funnies" module when French H39s or PzIIs / 38(t) come along to stand in for the Type 97.

[DavidFields]

I seem to recall BFC attempting to simulate Russian 'human wave' attacks in CMBB. How did that work out? Honestly don't remember.

The Zulus seem to have had success with that tactic against the British. Once.

Worked, in my opinion, well. The morale of the units was set so low that the only way to get them to advance was to use the human wave. Then one hoped that the bulk of the attack was enough to cause success.

When it worked, it was astonishing.

When it was all one had, one did it. Just like, to my understanding, the reality of that time.

[mjkerner]

mod faces (M1A1TC did some North Koreans for CMSF -- there's a start)...

Tried that for the 442nd RCT for the Iatalian Campaign shoulder patches mod. The 3D models for CMSF and CMBN are different sizes or something. The "skin" bmp images are different and don't line up. In game, it looked like someone was wearing a Halloween mask stretched sideways across the face. Actually, it was pretty funny!

[LongLeftFlank]

Well now you have the Cubist Anti-Fascist Volunteers for your Spanish Civil War module!

[Magpie_Oz]

I for one would love to see a PTO module but for sure I'm not holding my breath. I have for many years pined for a computer game that worked through a series of modules, as CMx2 seems to do in the hope that one day, like ASL the less commercially viable theatres can be represented.

As for the Banzai charges, well they were really a marginally less wasteful way of committing suicide, the Japanese troops knew they had lost and their way of looking at things necessitated suicide so why not try to take a few of the enemy with you?

Rather than needing to compel a player via the game engine to perform a Banzai charge you could simply do it by scenario design. Give the player a mass of troops and a very short timescale to achieve an objective, like occupy an area for 2 seconds and make casualties irrelevant.