CMBO CM:BN Equipment comparrison chart

[Battlefront.com]

Sometimes there's a good reason to raise a thread from the dead. This is one of those good reasons

Yes, as can be seen the charge of CMBN having less than CMBO is factually flawed because, well, it's not true. Especially in the TO&E department, for which CMBO (and the other two CMx1 games) simply can't hold a candle to in comparison. The TO&E system for CMx1 was extremely simplified and superficial by design.

As JonS correctly said a couple of pages ago, "just because it was in CMx1 doesn't mean it belongs there". That explains pretty much all of the CMBO stuff (for this timeframe) that isn't in CMBN. Things like the basic M7 (because they weren't in service by this timeframe) or the Nashorn (not in use on the Western Front for this timeframe) or because we got the introduction dates wrong, such as Jumbos and Wasps IIRC.

Now, about a possible 2nd Vehicle Pack. There does appear to be enough vehicles that we could put in to make it worth doing. If there really aren't that many interesting ones left to do we could simply release a smaller one and charge less. Dunno if that's the way to go, but in theory we could do that.

As for amphib vehicles, in theory we can add them. Not LSTs or other sorts of dedicated landing craft, but things like DUWK, DPA, Weasel, and Schwimmwagen are the only vehicles I can think of that are relevant. Possibly DD Shermans, but without LSTs there doesn't seem to be much point.

Steve

[Mord]

Thanks, Steve. That finally cleared that up.

 

 

 

Mord.

[sburke]

I have never heard anything about this. You have a link? As far as I knew the one VP was it for CMBN. I remember Steve saying something to the effect of there being "no amphibious vehicles in the WWII titles...yet" but nothing else.

 

 

Mord.

That is one position I hope they change.  AFAIK the question of a second vehicle pack depended on how the first went and having enough content....I wouldn't count one out, but I have no idea how well it sold.

[Mord]

LOL. Did you see Steve's post?

 

 

Mord.

[Battlefront.com]

The first Vehicle Pack is doing quite well otherwise I would have said "no" to a second one instead of teasing people. Though I has to be kept in mind that it stacks up against other projects in terms of timing and resources, therefore no promises can be made at this time as to when it might come about.

People have the misunderstanding that making vehicles is a piece of cake. While they certainly aren't as involved as other products we make (hence the lower price), they still take a significant chunk of time and get out the door.

Steve

[Mord]

Oh, I wouldn't expect anything until at least after the next RT module which hasn't even been mentioned yet. It's just nice to know that CMBN could get some fresh stuff sometime in the future.

 

The French would be a nice addition. I'd bet the French players would love that.

 

 

Mord.

[JonS]

Different sources do say different things however, from an understrength battalion but of exclusively StuGIV's, while some others say it was a mix battalion with StuGIII/IV's. Latter probably more like I'd imagine. Never seen JPzIV's mentioned, at least filling the role of a the Panzergrenadier's Panzer Battalion - or closest possible match with what armour was available. Be interested in in seeing yet another source JonS.

My mistake - the JPz IV were in SS-Pz.Jager-Abt. 17 (duh ).

 

Zetterling (Normandy 1944) says StuG IIIs only in the Pz Abt, and no StuG IV anywhere in Normandy.

Edited June 25, 2015 by JonS

[John Kettler]

Steve,

 

Please, please, please include LVTs and the small landing craft: LCA, LCVP and LCM. These would let us fight in the Scheldt Estuary, conduct various raids and river crossings, to include "bouncing the Rhine." I'm sure no one here expected the huge LST, whose acronym was colloquially defined by Navy men as "Large Slow Target" and landed administratively after the beach/other landing location was  secured. I knew a guy who skippered one in the Med, and he was scarred for life by the air attacks he underwent and the sight of other LSTs being hit and set ablaze. Stop the presses! I was flat out wrong. The LSTs at Salerno were used as assault craft on that D-Day, with orders to "beach at all costs." You won't believe what one of them encountered. Made me blink.

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

Edited June 25, 2015 by John Kettler

[JonS]

Possibly DD Shermans, but without LSTs there doesn't seem to be much point.

They did self-launch for the Rhine crossing, but that's for the next, uh, game(?) anyway. But otherwise, AFAICT, they were a one-shot deal. They spent ages prepping the vehicles, floated them ashore at Normandy (or Anzio, or across the Rhine), dropped the skirts, and then they couldn't be used again as DDs. It would be kinda neat to see them as a variant Sherman, trundling around with their skirts down, but even that only lasted for a few days or weeks, then the extra claggage was stripped off. You see photos of them with their skirts down in the immediate aftermath of D-Day, but in none of the photos from July or later.

Edited June 25, 2015 by JonS

[Darknight (DC)]

Oh, I wouldn't expect anything until at least after the next RT module which hasn't even been mentioned yet. It's just nice to know that CMBN could get some fresh stuff sometime in the future.

 

The French would be a nice addition. I'd bet the French players would love that.

 

 

Mord.

I'd be happy with British Commandos, a Centaur IV,  Wasps, DD Shermans and maybe a Tetrarch. 

Edited June 25, 2015 by Darknight (DC)

[Mord]

I'd be happy with British Commandos, a Centaur IV,  Wasps, DD Shermans and maybe a Tetrarch. 

 

Is this the part where I am supposed to be surprised? Coming from an admitted Commonwealth junkie I'd expect nothing less. LOL.

 

 

You may have to do prove the Wasp was within the time frame though, seems like there is some conflicting ideas about when it first saw combat.

 

 

Mord.

Edited June 25, 2015 by Mord

[Darknight (DC)]

I'm pretty sure I remember reading that they were used in July/Aug 1944 by some 21st AG units in Normandy (Cdn & Brit)....

though I don't have the specific reference handy.

 

As for the rest:

     British (and attached French) Commando units are a big one (and I believe the TOE is the biggest hurdle here, though I'd be willing to help with that )

     Centaur IV - very similar to Cromwell IV (though I'm not sure the work it would take to convert, if possible) but these would be cool to go with Commandos

     DD Shermans - they were seen throughout the Normandy campaign (not swimming obviously) but the hull was distinctive and the props could still be seen

     Tetrarch - a little harder to justify, as I think there were only 8 or so (don't quote me) of them in Normandy, so I don't expect to see them

Edited June 26, 2015 by Darknight (DC)

[sburke]

Oh, I wouldn't expect anything until at least after Combat Mission Shock Force is updated which hasn't even been mentioned yet. It's just nice to know that CMBN could get some fresh stuff sometime in the future.

 

 

 

Mord.

I fixed that for you.  Damn I so much want to see that game updated.

[Sequoia]

 If there really aren't that many interesting ones left to do we could simply release a smaller one and charge less.

Steve

 

Surely you jest. For me there's lots of interesting stuff, but a lot of it is soft-skinned so it might not interest every one. One AFV I'd really like to see is the Brummbar which wasn't in CMBO. 

 

I wonder what it will take for people to stop wishing for landingcraft. Steve has said many times they'll never do them. Sure they'd be cool but so would me dating Scarlett Johansson and that's never going to happen either. What I think would be the best water addition would be assault boats and rafts. That way we could simulate the 82nds crossing at Nijmegen.  

[Lethaface]

I fixed that for you.  Damn I so much want to see that game updated.

 

You're not alone!

[JonS]

I'm pretty sure I remember reading that they were used in July/Aug 1944 by some 21st AG units in Normandy (Cdn & Brit)....

though I don't have the specific reference handy.

Yeah, me too, and when the time comes I'll have to dig them out.

 

I suspect its mainly a case of massively changing rarity across a relatively short time period. So you see a few references to them in Jul and Aug, but then suddenly in Sept and Oct they seem to be everywhere. To put that in game terms:

 

• June: not available
• July: only available as a specialist vehicle, with absurd rarity
• August: available as a specialist vehicle with high rarity OR available as an option within the carrier platoon of inf bns with high rarity
• September: available as a specialist vehicle with moderate rarity OR available as an option within the carrier platoon of inf bns with moderate rarity
• October onwards: available as a specialist vehicle with some rarity OR available as an option within the carrier platoon of inf bns with some rarity*

 

* I think that Wasps were always the exception - and therefore rarer than 'regular' carriers.

Edited June 26, 2015 by JonS

[transporter]

I know they are out of time line : jumbo's, su-100, Jackson, Pershing, Super Pershing.  But sometimes it is nice to be able to throw some of those in to the scenario just for the fun of it, just to figure out how one would deal with it.  After all, with all the emphasis on time line and correctness for some reason vehicles still cannot round out a corner.  I haven't seen too many halftracks stop and pivot in order to turn and just try to go around something, stop, pivot, lurch, stop, pivot, lurch, etc, all the while making a nice target.  I have been playing CM:BO and CM:BN since they became available on the MAC even to the point of using a windows emulator for CM:BO and I have enjoyed them immensely.  So I guess the tanks and stuff would fall into the nice to have category but I do wish something could be done about the driving.  (Yes I rambled but at my age it's acceptable).  

[Battlefront.com]

(Yes I rambled but at my age it's acceptable).  

No, no, no it isn't!! Given the average age of our customers we'd be in big trouble if it were

Seriously, welcome! The stuff that is outside of Normandy's timeframe is good fodder for the future Bulge expansion. You know, the one that everybody wants because it has infrared equipped Panthers (if we can manage to pull that off!).

Back to the point about the DD. Yeah, it is worth noting that they did fight without their skirts on and, therefore, had a distinct visual appearance. This is something that we have to ponder including or not. Some customers definitely appreciate the visual nuance of it, but I can already hear people saying "HEY! Why can't it swim?!?" or "I'm not paying $10 for a pack that has stupid variations of crap I already have!". People can be a bit predictable That doesn't mean we won't do a skirtless DD, but it should be down on the list of priorities.

Steve

[General Jack Ripper]

As for amphib vehicles, in theory we can add them. Not LSTs or other sorts of dedicated landing craft, but things like DUKW, DPA, Weasel, and Schwimmwagen are the only vehicles I can think of that are relevant. Possibly DD Shermans, but without LSTs there doesn't seem to be much point.

 

Steve,

I humbly beseech you, in your great goodness, to bestow upon us this mighty gift, that we might crush our enemies, wherever they may be found, even on the other side of a lake.

- SLIM

[Sequoia]

I'm not saying don't do those vehicles, but none of the amphibious vehicles Steve listed would normally be used in an assault which is what Combat Mission is all about, which is why my preference would be boats and rafts. One vehicle type that would be used in an assault however are LVTs. Another is the British Terrapin. Although LVTs are usually associated with the Pacific they were used in Western Europe in our timeframe during the Scheldt battles. I'm sure Steve would have thought of these eventually.