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Armorgunner

Cross-country capability trials Sherman vs Panther

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On ‎3‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 9:47 AM, Macisle said:

I haven't done systematic testing, but when my vehicles bog, a trick I do that seems to help is to issue a timed pause followed by slow forward or reverse.

I usually cancel all movement orders and leave the crew to sort themselves out. I don't know if it makes a difference, but it makes me feel better.

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Terrain is often dotted with hard and rocky ground. This is an important feature during damp and muddy conditions because the chance of bogging drops greatly on hard and rocky terrain. Try hopping from hard patch to hard patch while moving. Soft ground in muddy conditions during a heavy rainstorm may just be one of those times armor ought to be kept back from the front entirely.

Interesting tidbit about Panther. France fielded about 49 Panthers after the war to compliment their post-war Sherman tank force. Generally they gave Panther low marks, thought Panther's negatives far outweighed its positives. Panther only stayed active in the French army for about 5 years, which admittedly is 2 years longer than Germany had fielded them.

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55 minutes ago, MikeyD said:

Terrain is often dotted with hard and rocky ground. This is an important feature during damp and muddy conditions because the chance of bogging drops greatly on hard and rocky terrain. Try hopping from hard patch to hard patch while moving. Soft ground in muddy conditions during a heavy rainstorm may just be one of those times armor ought to be kept back from the front entirely.

Interesting tidbit about Panther. France fielded about 49 Panthers after the war to compliment their post-war Sherman tank force. Generally they gave Panther low marks, thought Panther's negatives far outweighed its positives. Panther only stayed active in the French army for about 5 years, which admittedly is 2 years longer than Germany had fielded them.

Quick question: How´s about dirt roads underlaid with various terrain types? Is it just the road terrain type considered for bogging, or underlying terrain as well? (i.e dirt road on grass and muddy ground condition set, compared to dirt road on hard and muddy setting)

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Quote

dirt roads underlaid with various terrain types?

By coincidence I had been thinking that very question while typing out my earlier post. I think I knew the answer long ago but it escapes me now. Someone probably ran a thorough test a decade or more ago. It'll be easy enough to retest, I suppose.

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21 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Quick question: How´s about dirt roads underlaid with various terrain types? Is it just the road terrain type considered for bogging, or underlying terrain as well? (i.e dirt road on grass and muddy ground condition set, compared to dirt road on hard and muddy setting)

Yes, only the road tile matters for bogging. As long as you stay on the road. So if you are entering or leaving the road on a muddy tile you will have more chance of bogging as you transition than if the underlying tile is harder. But if you stay on the road you don't suffer.

There was a bug way way back where the bogging chance in the transition between on road and off road was much to high but that has been fixed.

The only thing I am unsure of is if dirt roads themselves can be bogging hazards if the scenario settings are set to wet ground. I never actually tried that.

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15 minutes ago, IanL said:

Yes, only the road tile matters for bogging. As long as you stay on the road. So if you are entering or leaving the road on a muddy tile you will have more chance of bogging as you transition than if the underlying tile is harder. But if you stay on the road you don't suffer.

There was a bug way way back where the bogging chance in the transition between on road and off road was much to high but that has been fixed.

The only thing I am unsure of is if dirt roads themselves can be bogging hazards if the scenario settings are set to wet ground. I never actually tried that.

Did bits of testing just yesterday and can confirm that it´s just the dirt roads determining bogging chances. At least I see no indications, that underlying terrain types have any influence. Ground setting was "muddy" and all the bogging on dirt roads was equally distributed among the ground types I tested (grass, dirt, hard and plowed field). Haven´t tested transitions.

Things look a bit different for footpaths on various terrain types (and muddy) with test results appearing inconclusive. Might do some more testing, if finding time.

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8 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Did bits of testing just yesterday and can confirm that it´s just the dirt roads determining bogging chances. At least I see no indications, that underlying terrain types have any influence. Ground setting was "muddy" and all the bogging on dirt roads was equally distributed among the ground types I tested (grass, dirt, hard and plowed field). Haven´t tested transitions.

Does being on a road (of any kind) effect bogging chances if ground condition is deep snow?

Michael

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

Does being on a road (of any kind) effect bogging chances if ground condition is deep snow?

Michael

haven´t tested yet (CMFB), but I´d assume yes IF it´s a dirt road and temperature is not frozen or extreme cold. Worth some more testing, but likely anybody else did already in the past.

@Bulletpoint 

 

Edited by RockinHarry

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, RockinHarry said:

haven´t tested yet (CMFB), but I´d assume yes IF it´s a dirt road and temperature is not frozen or extreme cold. Worth some more testing, but likely anybody else did already in the past.

@Bulletpoint 

 

Haven't formally tested it; I just noticed I have very few problems with bogging as soon as it's just a little below freezing. So it seems cold overrides ground conditions.

Haven't played many scenarios with deep snow - it could be that it overrides yet again, making vehicles bog.

As for whether roads then override yet again... that I don't know. I don't think they should.

If the ground is frozen and there's 50 cm of snow, I assume there wouldn't be much difference between being on a road or in a field.

Edited by Bulletpoint

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38 minutes ago, Bulletpoint said:

As for whether roads then override yet again... that I don't know. I don't think they should.

If the ground is frozen and there's 50 cm of snow, I assume there wouldn't be much difference between being on a road or in a field.

Until we see these guys in game with the ability to clear snow off the road, I agree it makes zero difference where you try to drive with that much snow on the ground.

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Awhile ago I had wanted to test bogging so did a QB in deep snow and blizzard conditions. To my great surprise I got no bogs at all! Not what I was expecting. I believe if you set temps to 'very cold' the ground freezes-up and greatly reduces the chance of bogging. Deep snow with merely 'cool' temps might've produced very different results.

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16 hours ago, MikeyD said:

Awhile ago I had wanted to test bogging so did a QB in deep snow and blizzard conditions. To my great surprise I got no bogs at all! Not what I was expecting. I believe if you set temps to 'very cold' the ground freezes-up and greatly reduces the chance of bogging.

If bogging only depends on whether ground is frozen or not, I think that's pretty much a bog-bug.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

If bogging only depends on whether ground is frozen or not, I think that's pretty much a bog-bug.

when it´s just about ground firmness, then it makes generally sense (all the other vehicles and crew stats left aside). But deep snow in western europe´s  not the same as russia. In russia bumping up in deep snow was as serious issue, particularly in 41/42, when even T-34 got no further. Edit: Bumping with the AFV´s belly on thick layers of packed snow or hidden tree stumps and such.

Edited by RockinHarry

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On ‎3‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 12:46 PM, RockinHarry said:

Another wish would be for the CM series to portray slopes and a units (infantry & vehicles) slope climbing ability and effects more realistically.

This +10

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