RAMADI (Iraq): Mother of All MOUT Maps

[Erwin]

Can't believe we were playing Joker 3 FIVE friggin' years ago.  (Note to self - mustn't get older.)

[Sgt.Squarehead]

I only discovered it quite recently, but it's been an absolute revelation and an inspiration! 

[Léopold]

It is a magnificent work, I hope that the author of this card does not stop there. A similar card under red thunder would be fantastic.

Or any other opus under the WW II.

Congratulations for this titanic work.

[borg]

A now throwback to the middle east is a must. With Iran/Syria/Iraq/Turkey + US and Russia + Nato

Bloody Hell - this would be one massive title.  i know i know BFC will most probably continue with its own pace of delivering modules and patches and not necessarily new games... but... 

[Erwin]

It's hard to understand why so far, none of our talented designers have been motivated to do a Mosul scenario with Iraqi Army plus Allied Uncon vs ISIS Uncon.  That would revive interest in CMSF in a big way. 

This map could work as is. 

[borg]

Should this be a concerted effort , rather than one man ? I consider myself noob in editing and creation. But the topic you suggest - god damn...

and we mustn't shout too much as combatintman might hear us

Edited November 18, 2016 by borg
Updated

[MOS:96B2P]

9 hours ago, borg said:

Should this be a concerted effort , rather than one man ? I consider myself noob in editing and creation. But the topic you suggest - god damn...

and we mustn't shout too much as combatintman might hear us

@Combatintman.  There.  Now he heard you.  He may not be able to respond for awhile, but he heard you. 

[borg]

18 minutes ago, MOS:96B2P said:

@Combatintman.  There.  Now he heard you.  He may not be able to respond for awhile, but he heard you. 

Thanks MOS:96B2P   Hey, what on earth does your profile name stand for anyway ? Ive been longing to ask. 

 

[MOS:96B2P]

1 minute ago, borg said:

Thanks MOS:96B2P   Hey, what on earth does your profile name stand for anyway ? Ive been longing to ask. 

 

Military Occupational Specialty: 96B2P.  Which in English means I was a Military Intelligence Analyst Airborne.  I was in the 313th Military Intelligence Battalion, 82nd Airborne Division in the 1980s.  My avatar is the crest of the 313th.  They have since revised the enlisted MOS nomenclature to be in line with the officers I have been told.  So the 96B is something else now.     

[Léopold]

At present I was created a scenario with the map of Ramadi, I am inspired by recent news on the battle of Mosul.

I am interested in these battles with low ways. The Iraqi army does not exist any more. The fights are similar to those of the Second World War, finally almost.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Antzorn

[borg]

3 minutes ago, Antzorn said:

At present I was created a scenario with the map of Ramadi, I am inspired by recent news on the battle of Mosul.

I am interested in these battles with low ways. The Iraqi army does not exist any more. The fights are similar to those of the Second World War, finally almost.

Hmmm not exactly sure what you meant by Iraqi army is no more. I believe there is a special branch of special forces in Iraqi SF, that do an excellent job getting rid of hostiles. You can google it.

[Léopold]

Just now, borg said:

Hmmm pas exactement sûr ce que vous vouliez dire par l'armée irakienne n'est plus. Je crois qu'il ya une branche spéciale des forces spéciales en SF irakiens, qui font un excellent travail pour se débarrasser des hostiles. Vous pouvez le google.

Actually, but she possesses almost no more armored cars. We notice the numerous modified humvees. She reconstructs little by little.

[Erwin]

"...there is a special branch of special forces in Iraqi SF, that do an excellent job getting rid of hostiles." 

They show these guys on CNN etc.  Don't look too impressive - wearing sneakers and still using the brilliant tactic of sticking their small arms above the parapet for a second or two of poorly aimed automatic fire then ducking down again. 

When I playtested JOKER 3 it was a real eye-opener how it is almost impossible to do MOUT ops without heavy casualties.  If the Iraqi army starts suffering, what evidence is there that they will maintain discipline.  It must be a concern that if pushed too hard they could disintegrate.

In any case, Taliban, Al Qaeda, ISIS etc have mastered the counter-tactic of running away from overwhelming force, waiting till the occupying force gets bored, then moving back in again.  Unless we have some new overall longterm strategy, that's my prediction.

But, that's why a scenario or (Inshallah) a CMSF campaign based on the Mosul operation using the fabulous Ramadi map would be fascinating.

[LongLeftFlank]

On 2/11/2011 at 0:12 PM, LongLeftFlank said:

If you're looking for a more built up and high rise urban area with a grid pattern, check out my Baba Amr (Homs, Syria) map. The scenario can't be played solo though (no AI plans). 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2016 by LongLeftFlank

[Léopold]

I shall like created a map so successful as that of Ramadi but under the eastern front. Similar to that of Stalingrad. Who could use in this work?

Edited November 26, 2016 by Antzorn

[sburke]

1 minute ago, Antzorn said:

I shall like created a map) so successful as that of Ramadi but under the eastern front. Similar to that of Stalingrad. Who could use in this work?

Plenty of us. Just post it up at scenario depot. 

Edited November 26, 2016 by sburke

[Léopold]

Thank you   sburke 

[Combatintman]

On 11/18/2016 at 10:05 PM, Erwin said:

"...there is a special branch of special forces in Iraqi SF, that do an excellent job getting rid of hostiles." 

They show these guys on CNN etc.  Don't look too impressive - wearing sneakers and still using the brilliant tactic of sticking their small arms above the parapet for a second or two of poorly aimed automatic fire then ducking down again. 

When I playtested JOKER 3 it was a real eye-opener how it is almost impossible to do MOUT ops without heavy casualties.  If the Iraqi army starts suffering, what evidence is there that they will maintain discipline.  It must be a concern that if pushed too hard they could disintegrate.

In any case, Taliban, Al Qaeda, ISIS etc have mastered the counter-tactic of running away from overwhelming force, waiting till the occupying force gets bored, then moving back in again.  Unless we have some new overall longterm strategy, that's my prediction.

But, that's why a scenario or (Inshallah) a CMSF campaign based on the Mosul operation using the fabulous Ramadi map would be fascinating.

I wouldn't be too hard on them - they are the only people doing the fighting in Mosul right now, they did the hard yards in the Ramadi and Fallujah clearances and according to one of those gentlemen I talked to recently in answer to the question - 'why wear black and cut around in black vehicles - you will be easily identified', he replied 'we want them to know its us because they are scared of us'.

So less of the armchair quarterbacking please unless you have first hand experience of them.

[Erwin]

Impressed by your post.  You talked with ISIS gentlemen about why wear black? 

[sburke]

1 hour ago, Erwin said:

Impressed by your post.  You talked with ISIS gentlemen about why wear black? 

I think he was referring to Iraqis govt guys. That would probably be why he referred to "clearances". 

[Erwin]

Ah well...  Hmm...  Not sure am convinced that folks who are happy to die as martyrs would be scared of someone else cos they're dressed in black.  Altho'... black is my favorite clothing color (or non-color) as well.  So, I can appreciate the exquisite fashion sense of ISIS and those cool Hugo Boss SS uniforms.

 

Edited November 29, 2016 by Erwin

[sburke]

I think you are over simplifying the ISIS base.  Look back at a few other posts by folks with experience in Iraq about the constituency of a lot of these insurgent groups.  True believers are somewhat harder to come by than hangers on and folks looking for an easy paycheck etc.

[snake_eye]

On 29/11/2016 at 8:41 PM, Erwin said:

Impressed by your post.  You talked with ISIS gentlemen about why wear black? 

Combatintman was referring to the Special Iraqi Force. They are wearing  black uniforms and riding black Humvees. A way to distinguish themselves to their foes. They have a fierce reputation.

[Erwin]

Hi snake-eye.  Enjoyed your scenarios.  Must replay "UK Helluva Road Opening".  I recall killing the Red counterattack at the cost of the US airborne, but then lost many Brit vehicles to enemy air.  I need to figure out how to protect the vehicles.

Hope you do more...

[snake_eye]

1 hour ago, Erwin said:

Hi snake-eye.  Enjoyed your scenarios.  Must replay "UK Helluva Road Opening".  I recall killing the Red counterattack at the cost of the US airborne, but then lost many Brit vehicles to enemy air.  I need to figure out how to protect the vehicles.

Hope you do more...

Erwin, as you know I am a fervent defender of Real Time playing. However, I must confess that since, I have play tested many scenarios and had no choice but to play WEGO in order to keep a situation awareness of my tactical movements and of the enemies. That to be able to report a workable AAR to the scenario designer and help him in his appraisal. Sure enough I always fought better than playing it R.T. So my advice is, if you want to get some results and fewer casualties play "UK Helluva Road Opening"  WEGO. If you want to find what troops at lower echelon usually feel in a real engagement play it R.T. That is the best advice I can think of.

The next one to come should be the one I called for the time being "Donetz airport" with CMBS. I started it a year ago but with a map of 6300 X 2700 meters it takes a long......long time  and a lot of power for the Editor and my laptop when I travel is unable to open the file !!!!! there are so many houses that it could be compare to the RAMADI map. Longleftflank would not deny that. 

Cheer

Edited December 1, 2016 by snake_eye