Patch V1.02 news from CDV

[mike8g]

Just read this on the German CDV forum:

Patch v1.02 is supposed to be available on Wednesday, 02/12/03.

True or just a CDV speculation ?

Source:

CDV German CMBB Forum

----------------------------------------------

They also posted the complete readme.txt from the patch. Here's a small extract, listing the new & improved 3D tank models:

*new*

Pz 38(t) E

BT-2

SPW 250/11

Valentine III

StuG IV (early and late)

German 28mm sPzB 41 Panzerbüchse

*improved*

Tiger I (early, mid, late)

M3 scout car

PSW 234/1

Puma

PSW 234/3

SPW 250/1

Churchill

Russian 76.2mm M1927/39 regimental gun

[ February 08, 2003, 05:06 PM: Message edited by: mike8g ]

[Kaiser Soze 71]

Now, if someone nice could translate the CDV info in to English

[Nolloff]

I try. Please note that I´ll be doing it quickly (spelling, grammar might be a bit shaky sometimes). I do not take responsiblity for any misunderstandings in case I made mistakes with the translation. Ok? No guarantees!

Modifications

* Support weapons will use "sneak" more rarely when coming under moderate enemy fire

* "Follow" vehicle command cannot get used for Bunkers

* Higher probability for snow in QBs taking place in winter

* Scenario briefing for QBs shows quality settings.

* Reduced chance for bogging of heavy vehicles

* In case of QBs with Computer purchased forces, heavy weapons were deleted from the list of available weapons for the attacker

* TacAI. Area fire (supporting fire?)commands for vehicles which start to reverse due to threats will get deleted automatically.

* New unit composition category for QBs. "Tanks only"

* Battles saved in tourney format will autmatically use EFOW settings

Models

*New: Pz 38(t) E, BT-2, SPW 250/11, Valentine III, StuG IV (früh und spät), Deutsche 28mm sPzB 41 Panzerbüchse

* Improved: Tiger I (früh, mitte, und spät), M3 Spähfahrzeug, PSW 234/1, Puma, PSW 234/3, SPW 250/1 (alt), Churchill, Russische 76.2mm M1927/39 Regimentskanone

Fixed BUGS:

* Problem corrected regarding units which due to too high fatigue need too long to revocer

* Guns will fire with lower probability if there´s a high probability the projectile might hit an obstacle or rising ground

* Correct textures for Ampulomets

* Ammo settings now work for computer purchased forces in QBs.

* Smaller PBEM file sizes when ski-units are involved

* Lowered effectiveness of AA fire and damaged aircraft might leave earlier

* Wenn following a vehicle which is only displayed as a sound contact the real location of the enemy unit will not get shown anymore

* Correct points for units which exit the map as passengers.

* No more black Command and Control lines to captured HQs

* Reset target order for Artillery will remember if smoke or HE got fired

* Infantry units don´t walk in place underneath a rotating vehicle they are ordered to embark but will wait until rotating is finished

* Enemy foxholes will not get shown in the setup-phase when the mouse pointer is placed upon them.

* Correct display of the word "casualties" when bunker crews take casualties

* Shift-X settings will get carried over to new games

* More realistic effects (lowered) of aircraft bombs against upright infantry

* Improved graphics for intersections

* MG carrier rotation for aiming corrected.

* Tanks where the crews have bailed out continue "influencing" VLs until the tank is getting displayed as abandoned or destroyed for the enemy.

* Units firing small calibre weapons can´t hurt themselves during night battles

Unit data changes:

* Sowjet 122mm AP ammo with ballistic cap will be available in Feb 45

* T-34, SU-85, SU-122 have an angle of 53 degrees for lower front hull

* Tanks of the KV-I series (exception KV-IS) have a 30 degree angle for lower front hull.

* SU-85, SU-100, SU-122 have an angle of 20 degrees for upper side hull

* Smaller changes for armor on IS-2 series

* ZIS-3 gun has calibre L/42. Muzzle velocity unchanged

* Sowjet 82mm M-8 and 132mm M-13 Raketen first available July 1941

* German 214mm Rockets availabe Feb 42

* minimum range of german 50mm mortar 60m

* Turret mounted MG for early StuG IV

* Der Nimrod tank has Crew of 6 and more AP ammo

* Zrinyi renamed to Zrinyi II and has HEAT. Front armor increased to 75mm, side armor reduced to 25mm.

* More MG and main gun ammo for Toldi IIA and Toldi III

* Hungarian 40mm AP is better than earlier type from April 43 onwards

* Turan I and II side armor 25mm.

* Csaba side and rear armor 9mm

* Hungarians can use 45mm and 76mm Russian captured guns

* Higher probability that Hungarian tank hunters have Panzerfausts from May 44 onwards

* Hungarian Tiger available until September 44

* Hungarian Panther available between September 1944 and February 1945

* Increased rarity of hungarian 45mm Pak from Feb 43 onwards

* Hungarian forces use Pz IIIM and not early Pz IIIJ.

* Reworked specification for Hungarian 50mm mortar

* Minimum range for hungarian 81mm mortar increased to 75m

* small chages regarding rarity of Hungarian vehciles 1944-45.

[ February 08, 2003, 08:06 AM: Message edited by: Nolloff ]

[aka_tom_w]

WOW

great thanks for the update

-tom w

[Dschugaschwili]

Tanks where the crews have bailed out continue "influencing" VLs until the tank is getting displayed as abandoned or destroyed for the enemy.

Ha! I contributed something to the patch.

On the other hand, it seems that rarity values for infantry units will still not be shown on the purchasing screen. Was probably too difficult to code properly.

Dschugaschwili

[T-34\85]

The T-44 and JS-3 still don't get their models

Oh the wait is killing me ....

[Le Tondu]

Originally posted by T-34\85:

The T-44 and JS-3 still don't get their models

Oh the wait is killing me ....

Hmmm. They may be interesting, but I don't I'd ever use them.

Still, if the upgrade is finished (like it has been reported in this forum), WHERE IN THE %$#&^@! WORLD IS IT??????????

[Vanir Ausf B]

Models

*New: Pz 38(t) E, BT-2, SPW 250/11, Valentine III, StuG IV (früh und spät), Deutsche 28mm sPzB 41 Panzerbüchse

* Improved: Tiger I (früh, mitte, und spät), M3 Spähfahrzeug, PSW 234/1, Puma, PSW 234/3, SPW 250/1 (alt), Churchill, Russische 76.2mm M1927/39 Regimentskanone

GAHH!

I can't believe they didn't fix the late IS-2 model! I thought that would be a gimme given how common a vehicle it is. :mad:

[MrNoobie]

i thought the german half tracks were going to get new models :confused:

[Commissar]

While I appreciate the fact that we are getting new models and a lot of work is required to do even one, the choices of the new models leave me wondering and, quite frankly, sorely disappointed. I can understand leaving out the more rare vehicles like the IS-3 (which in this case unlikely saw any combat in the war), but I think they should have at least fixed the T-44 vehicle and stop using the obviously wrong model of the T-34/85 or addressed the German half-tracks. Having the Churchill is nice, but come on. Even the Soviets didn't like this tank, why should we care if there is a "new" model for it

But seriously, improving the IS-2 would've have made a lot more sense. Surely Kwazydog was swamped with what was chosen, but was any outsourcing to talented 3rd party mod makers not feasible so as to increase the number of new models without lengthening out the time of release? Kwazydog himself was originally a 3rd party mod maker in the early days.

If this is indeed the last patch, then I'll just have to live with disappointment, but it would be nice to know exactly why these vehicles were selected when others weren't (assuming this post of the readme is accurate and genuine).

[ February 08, 2003, 12:26 PM: Message edited by: Commissar ]

[Firefly]

Thanks to Nolloff for the translation, my German is just about good enough to get the gist of the post on the CDV site, but my vocabulary was letting me down and I don't know in which pile of books my German-English dictionary is hiding .

[panzermartin]

Thank you Nollof!

I wonder if it is possible for 3rd party 3D modelers to contribute their work in CMBB, like it's being done with the IL-2 sturmovik and its community.

I guess this would help to have even the less known vehicles modelled correctly in game.I dont

have a clue though if this can be done easily

with CM's engine.

[MrNoobie]

Originally posted by panzermartin:

Thank you Nollof!

I wonder if it is possible for 3rd party 3D modelers to contribute their work in CMBB, like it's being done with the IL-2 sturmovik and its community.

I guess this would help to have even the less known vehicles modelled correctly in game.I dont

have a clue though if this can be done easily

with CM's engine.

yeah i have some 3D skills, i would like to add some parts to the tanks. Like you said PM just use to correct the models, like the Marder, SU76i etc etc

EDIT: especially the russian truck

[ February 08, 2003, 02:49 PM: Message edited by: MrNoobie ]

[Ellros]

Originally posted by panzermartin:

Thank you Nollof!

I wonder if it is possible for 3rd party 3D modelers to contribute their work in CMBB, like it's being done with the IL-2 sturmovik and its community.

I guess this would help to have even the less known vehicles modelled correctly in game.I dont

have a clue though if this can be done easily

with CM's engine.

Since the models are hard-coded, it is doubtful, as BFC has said before they will not release the source code.

[Mord]

Well guys before you freak out about what is and isn't in, has BFC given the "Official Word" on any of this? To me it's all hearsay and second hand information until someone from the company (BTS/BFC) says yay or nay.

Mord.

[mike8g]

So true, Mord.

That's why I started this thread with the question:

"True or a CDV speculation ?"

Marcus

[Firefly]

Originally posted by Mord:

Well guys before you freak out about what is and isn't in, has BFC given the "Official Word" on any of this? To me it's all hearsay and second hand information until someone from the company (BTS/BFC) says yay or nay.

Mord.

Well CDV are the European publishers and handle the distribution of the patches for the Euro version.

[Iberian]

Well, I have to confess that I'm dissappointed too with the chosen vehicles for the patch.

It's a pity BFC didn't choose to make the 3d-model creation accessible to the CMBB fans, as I'm sure many would contribute and make great additions to the game.

Well, it's too late now.

[Battlefront.com]

I'm sure the list is accurate as it is what we gave CDV

As for when exactly it will be released... Wednesday looks to be the day.

Now... on to the model stuff...

Note how many "they should have done this" posts above. This underscores the fact that no matter what we chose to put into the patch SOMEONE would complain that their favorite this or that wasn't done. T-44 and IS-3s were added to the game over my objections, BTW, so be thankful that the data is there to begin with

Why did we choose to do the models we did?

1. Pz 38(t) E -> Extremely common German tank in the early war period. Looks very different from earlier version.

2. BT-2 -> Only vehicle in the BT series that wasn't correct. Hull was identical to other BTs so this was a super easy final gap to fill.

3. SPW 250/11 -> Extremely easy because it involved sticking the new sPzB41 gun on the existing 250 vehicle.

4. Valentine III -> Very common Soviet tank for the 1943 period, and very different than the later Valentines. Most importantly the gun/turret was not the same. It doesn't matter if you think this is a cool tank or not

5. StuG IV (early and late) -> Something that wasn't done for even CMBO. Probably one of the most complained about missing model. Felt it was time to get it in. It is also a very common vehicle for a period of time.

6. 28mm sPzB 41 Panzerbüchse -> Unique looking gun that was pretty much the only major AT gun model (for 1941 at least) that was missing. Also needed for the SPW 250/11.

6. Churchill -> This should have been in the "new" section because it basically was a ground up redo. Similar reason as the Valentine. The one in the game was simply not the correct one, and this tank was quite common for 1943 Central Front battles.

Yes, there is significant list of other vehicles that could have gone in in place of these. But as noted above, someone would complain. Especially about the StuG IV if history is any indication of the future

Adding models is very tedious and requires the work of three people to get them in. Probably around 4 work days per vehicle, assuming ground up artwork or 2.5 days with significantly reused artwork. Instead of being shocked at what we didn't put in you should be stunned at how much is in the game already, not to mention added with two patches.

It is utterly impossible to allow 3rd parties to add models to the game. It is hard enough for us to get them in and we have the source code and have been sticking them in for 4 years. And even if we spent several months making an external tool it would have to be Macintosh only. We use 3DMF format and have found that files of that type derrived on Windows based machines do not work (hence the need for 3 people instead of 2).

The sad thing is that Dan (KwazyDog) made models for each and every vehicle in CMBB. Heck, he even made some models (by mistake) of vehicles models NOT present on the Eastern Front. But because of the 2.5 - 4 day time period to get each in we were only able to do so much.

The new game engine will be a LOT easier to get stuff into it.

Steve

P.S. And no, we are not planning on adding anything else to the game.

[mike8g]

Steve,

thanks for the info - and the confirmation

Marcus

[Shep]

Steve,

Thanks for the reasonable answer. I often feel for you guys, understanding that there is a segment of the gaming community that is filled with folks who are just plain unhappy, and cannot be made happy in any sensible fashion. I imagine that you're catch your share of flaming crap over this one as one, but I just wanted to encourage you to keep up the good work and try not to take it too personally.

You all are not perfect, but doing it your way has been wildly successful and I'm glad you have. You've made the two most enjoyable tactical combat games ever. I look forward to what's next.

Best, Mark

[AP HEAD]

The patch list looks fantastic, cant wait. Its also nice to see BFCs " Why did we choose to do the models we did?". Its on the note of models chosen that i wish to comment. Maybe not for this patch but the next i believe the Soviet GAZ (T model ford) truck should be modeled. Why?

A - BFC have this model (or close to it)

B - It was a very common truck early in the war.

C- It can be expanded into many models that could contribute to the accuracy of the game.

ie: ZSU-37, SU-12, GAZ-gm-AA, ZIS-42,IAG-10-AA.

Nothing else other than to add this for consideration..

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

P.S. And no, we are not planning on adding anything else to the game.

Uh...?

I just wanted to make sure I understand you correct. No new models for CMBB? There will never be a JS-3 that looks like a JS-3 etc?

[Guest konrad]

Originally posted by Leutnant Hortlund:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

P.S. And no, we are not planning on adding anything else to the game.

Uh...?

I just wanted to make sure I understand you correct. No new models for CMBB? There will never be a JS-3 that looks like a JS-3 etc? </font>

[-E]

This is a travesty. Still no horses on motorcyles. (even I admit that while hysterically accurate, vice versa was extremely rare and needn't be modelled)