CMX2 Wishlist

[Engel]

Terrain grid you can turn on and off with a key press.

[aka_tom_w]

elevation contour lines you can toggle on and off with the flick of a switch.

Panzer Elite is OLD but it had NICE maps

GRAT maps with contour lines in the mission briefing.

My I request that the BTS design team for CMX2 (the Next big thing) play the latest version of Panzer Elite for a few hours and check out the maps they use.

PE is a VERY different game because it a tank sim you can ONLY see the battlefield from view level on in CMBB lingo butyou can toggle to a NICE topo map with contours so you can see your progress.

ALL I am saying is that I like the contour lines and topo maps in PE

thanks

-tom w

[Runyan99]

bump

[Snowbart]

Ability to save a certain group of characteristics for some units(their ammo, exp., leadership qualities if applicable, names, etc.) and be able to carry that to the next battle EASILY. I know you can do this in the editor now, but you have to redo everything after that battle, which is time consuming when doing a campaign like Biltong's Campaign Rules. If you could somehow save a file that has all the characteristics you want your Battle Group to have and simply import this file into the map you want to play on.

[Schoerner]

My vote goes to tom_w's underestimated TFoW Terrain Fog of War (what you can't see, isn't there).

What i would find an improvement, is air support, that is a bit more user-controllable, means that can be called in with appropriate delays by the user during the battle and can be pre-planned, too.

Parachute units falling from the sky (pre-planned?) would be nice, too.

[ April 26, 2003, 07:37 PM: Message edited by: Schoerner ]

[WWB]

What I would like to see:

Scenario Design:

1) Dispense with the grid for map design! Go to a vector-based, freehand editor. Moreover, have this editor run outside the program--that way a designer can consult online references without alt-tabbing.

2) Event-enabled scripting tool for scenarios. Just imagine what one could do with a few simple events (enemy takes X point, crosses X line, X time passes, enemy chooses option X). Then one could bring in reinforcements, activate and de-activate flags or exit zones, etc.

3) Some way for designers to suggest plans to the AI. EG, static defense with this unit, advance with that unit after X event.

Overall:

Ability to start a multiplayer game from the command line, for both TCP and PBEM (if that is even supported). Will make possible things like, say, hyperlobby.

In-game settings editor. Why should I have to wipe everything in order to fiddle with the screen resolution?

WWB

[General Bolt]

Multi-player teams battling other teams. Even in PBEM. This would cause some serious FOG about what the commander on your flanks is doing.

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by Soddball:

I'd like to see the inclusion of blinding effects from the sun.

If you're launching a dawn attack against an opponent to your west (assuming you're north of the equator) the sun will rise in your opponent's eyes.

For what its worth, the Sun rises in the East south of the Equator too!

Its only the seasons that you have screwed up.

[SgtMuhammed]

The ability for scenario designers to take away units in between battles of an operation.

I also second the call for being able to give the AI a plan during scenario design.

Different defensive states should come with increasing fortification bonuses. Hasty defense should be come as you are while a prepared position should include trenches and minefields free of charge.

Minefields, wire, and trenches should either be larger or you should get so many square meters when you spend points and then be able to paint them on the map.

[Michael Dorosh]

CIVILIANS

Civilians will be present in "units" of 1 to 8 people. (Larger units would represent families, for example). There are no HQs and no weapons possible with exceptions listed below.

Civilians will not fight soldiers, and will generally attempt to Hide. They may attempt to Move or Run at random, depending on their stance (see below).

Civilians can be wounded or killed just as soldiers do. Wounded civilians are treated as wounded soldiers (ie they are invisible and not tracked).

Players can give Move (only) orders to civilians only when one of their units is within shouting distance of those civilians (say 1-30 metres). There may be instances where both Allied and Axis players give orders to the same "civilian" unit.

Scenario Designers (and players) should be able to select the following options:

CIVILIANS PRESENT - YES/NO

NUMBER OF CIVILIANS - Sparse/Few/Moderate/Many/Exodus

These numbers would be tied to the type of map also. Rural maps would have fewer people per category than City maps.

STANCE OF CIVILIANS -

Actively Pro-Allied

Moderately Pro-Alled

Actively Neutral

Passively Neutral

Moderately Pro-Axis

Actively Pro-Axis

"Actively pro" means that civilians can spot (or be interrogated) to a limited degree for friendly units, and may even take up arms from fallen units (enemy or friendly).

"Moderately pro" means that civilians can spot (or be interrogated) to a limited degree for friendly units but will not take up arms

"Actively Neutral" means that civilians can be interrogated by both sides for information

"Passively Neutral" means that civilians will not divulge information of any kind to either side

CONDITION OF CIVILIANS

"Residing in place"

"Resisting"

"Escaping" (set map edge - N, E, W, S, Random)

Residing Civilians will attempt to stay in their initial set up location, usually their homes, though if panicked during fighting, will rout to nearby cover.

Resisting Civilians will move under the orders of friendly troops

Escaping Civilians (think "refugees") will attempt to flee off a map edge determined for each civilian "unit" (in a large city, people may want to leave via different routes, for example).

EFFECTS ON VICTORY LEVELS

Civilians may be designated as having the following effects for each side

- any civilian loss inflicted by friendly troops represents automatic loss for your side

This simulates situations in which friendly troops have been ordered not to damage civilian property, etc. Think in general of the Allies in Holland.

- civilian losses inflicted by friendly troops represents VP losses for your side

Represents areas where commanders took pains to minimize loss of life to civilians if possible, but were not prepared to sacrifice their own men's lives to do so. Think in general terms of the Allies in Italy or Germany.

- civilian losses infliced by friendly OR enemy troops represents VP losses for your side

Think the in general of the Germans in Berlin, or the Russians in Stalingrad. This represents friendly troops fighting in urban areas, for example, attempting to keep civilians safe while fighting a battle at the same time

- civilian losses inflicted by friendly troops have no effect

Think in general of the Russians in Berlin. Why have this option? Because the other side will probably have different effects in place; ie the Germans in Berlin will lose VPs for casualties caused by the Russians to civilians, therefore, the German is given the burden of keeping the fighting away from civilian occupied areas.

CIVILIAN AUTOMOBILES

Generally found abandoned, these should be able to be commandeered by soldiers of both sides, abandoned and used as hasty roadblocks, taken over by escaping prisoners, or used by civilians in Escape mode to travel along roads (possibly impeding military traffic).

[ April 26, 2003, 06:53 PM: Message edited by: Michael Dorosh ]

[Other Means]

as well as all the main ones mentioned:

1) rate of area fire to able to be set. rather than blowing all a mortars ammo, you just say "drop 3 shells into the woods" or even something as variable as "keep their heads down". that way a MG/mortar would target the most active enemy unit in it vision.

2) enforceable rule sets such as Franco's rules. if you both agree to play by them, the game enforces this. you could possibly control this with a reality setting in the QB params.

[Snowbart]

I agree with Other Means!!!!

One of the most valuable changes would be to tell your mortar/arty guys what rate to fire at. 50mm mortars easliy drop 1/3 of their ammo in one turn!! This is a MUST feature for future CM games(CMAK too). :cool:

[flamingknives]

Another point regarding civilians.

Apparently, the German recon units on the Eastern fron (esp. the armoured cars) were able to ascertain whether a village was held by the enemy by looking for civilian prescence.

e.g. no civilians = enemy prescence likely.

This factor would make recon more than DBC.

[Engel]

The presence of civilians would probably cause an uproar in the politically correct crowd, since their presence on the battlefield would necessarily lead to them becoming collateral damage, which is probably too much for certain people, never mind how much you include various controlling factors. All that is of course no reason not to do it anyway.

[kipanderson]

Hi,

I know everyone is turning these lists out, so I thought I would just throw in my wish-list of features for the new engine. One reason why there is no harm in producing these things is that I know BFC are keen to hear what we are all after. At this stage it is not too late to lobby for new features, so here goes. And, no, there is nothing very original in my list; also, I have purposely restricted it to my top five priority features.

In no particular order.

An end to Borg Spotting.

This is very much already in the works, Steve has said there will be individual spotting, plus a radio net modelled where appropriate, in the next engine. So Borg Spotting will be a thing of the past. But I do not wish to give up the role of squad/AFV commander. I do not wish for a command game.

Live Team Play.

The ability to play live with 2-4 players on each side. Each player only being able to spot what the units he actually commands can spot. i.e. not what units belonging to another friendly company, but commanded by another human player, can spot. Would be fun, and add to Fog Of War.

Toggled Elevation Grid.

For me, others will differ; the one big human-to-computer interface problem is the lack of an ability to spot elevation/undulation changes realistically. Using the 1.25m elevation settings there is a greater change in colour for any given change in elevation, but even so, the real life ability to spot elevation change, undulations, is far greater then in CMBB. Computer screens just cannot handle it the way the human eye can in the real world. Thus the ability to toggle a grid on and off in the orders phase of the game so as to better spot undulations, would be a big plus.

The ability to Save Forces from any game.

I am one of those who would like to see an operational layer to CM. However, I realise that BFC are only a small company and so I am more than grateful to have a continuing flow of new versions of CM coming through. To expect such a small company to also add a genuine operational layer is both unrealistic and unreasonable. In my view. However, if one could Save Forces from any CM game, at any time, then launch them into the Editor later; a huge leap towards the ability to build genuine operations will have been taken. The ability to Edit Saved games in general, would help greatly.

Edit Morale independently of Unit Experience.

In CMBB we have the ability to set different Fanatics ratings for forces. This is clearly a form of morale setting. However, in my view, others will differ; it is a shame that one cannot Edit the actual Morale setting itself independently of the Unit Experience level settings. I agree with those who would say that care is needed in this field. I would suggest only being able to change/Edit the Morale setting by “one level”, no more. What I mean is that if one wished it would be useful to able to give forces one level higher Morale then there Experience Level setting. So one could give a force of 60/40 Green and Regular Soviets, the same Morale as a force of 60/40 Regular and Veteran Germans. To set this in context it is worth noting that it is well understood why some less well trained troops often have combat morale as high, or higher, then better trained opposition forces. There have been many studies of the subject over the last twenty years. It turns out that the harsher the upbringing, the harsher the training, the harsher the discipline, the higher the true combat morale of the troops. There are a huge number of qualifications to this, and, yes, there is still a close correlation between quality of training and combat morale. However, it is now recognised that harsh upbringing, harsh training, and harsh discipline do indeed lead to higher combat morale. All the factors a WW1 sergeant major would have listed as leading to high combat morale have turned out to be correct. (The context of these studies, as reported in various Jane’s journals over the years, is to try and explain why the troops of poorer countries sometimes have higher combat morale than the better trained troops of western countries. BTW, combat morale is defined as the ability to continue to generate combat power after suffering casualties. The willingness of survivors to fight on.) There are circumstances in which troops from different nations, and different units within the same armies, have different combat morale even though they have the same combat skills. The ability to shift the Morale level, “one level” relative to the Unit Experience rating, would be a big plus. In my view.

All good fun,

All the best,

Kip.

[SlowMotion]

Something a bit like what Othermeans suggested:

Enforceable *unit buying* rule sets for Quick Battles.

It would be cool if one could restrict the maximum number of some unit a player can buy in a game. For example, if one would like to create a game where tank buying is restricted so that you can only buy one Tiger and no King Tigers. In maybe scenario editor one could select the axis tank list and set max numbers 1 and 0 for those units and then save a restriction list. Later on when making a QB, this restriction list file could be selected as parameter, like map is now. Buying restriction would affect both player and computer purchased troops.

This way one could create battles using rarely used units. Also if one knows some units were used in some battle, then using this kind of restriction list one could guarantee only these units will be bought. Would also work well in restricting arty to some caliber and so on.

[aka_tom_w]

"Toggled Elevation Grid.

For me, others will differ; the one big human-to-computer interface problem is the lack of an ability to spot elevation/undulation changes realistically. Using the 1.25m elevation settings there is a greater change in colour for any given change in elevation, but even so, the real life ability to spot elevation change, undulations, is far greater then in CMBB. Computer screens just cannot handle it the way the human eye can in the real world. Thus the ability to toggle a grid on and off in the orders phase of the game so as to better spot undulations, would be a big plus."

THIS is a BIG one for me I would like to contour lines JUST LIKE in REAL topo maps. This feature alone would likely be a rather large undertaking BUT there should be OPTIONAL contour lines showing elevation.

For people like myself that LOVE topo maps this feature is a BIG deal and it is noticably missing in the CM series so far. We can be SURE we won't see in CMAK but in the African Theatre I the lack of contour lines in surely no big deal.

BUT for CMX2 elevation lines and real topographic maps (A WHOLE new mapping engine/paradigm is required) to show terrain contours would be a VERY important feature for me

thanks

-tom w

[kipanderson]

tom-w

do not give up all hope of a simple Toggled Grid for CMAK. I agree that it is less than 50/50 but a simple grid, black squares on a “pink/transparent” back ground that could be toggles on and off, is a possible. On the face of it a lot less challenging than some changes for CMAK. Also, without it, in desert warfare, it will be a real struggle to spot 2m-3m undulations.

All good fun,

All the best,

Kip.

[John D Salt]

Originally posted by kipanderson:

[snips]

To set this in context it is worth noting that it is well understood why some less well trained troops often have combat morale as high, or higher, then better trained opposition forces. There have been many studies of the subject over the last twenty years. It turns out that the harsher the upbringing, the harsher the training, the harsher the discipline, the higher the true combat morale of the troops. There are a huge number of qualifications to this, and, yes, there is still a close correlation between quality of training and combat morale. However, it is now recognised that harsh upbringing, harsh training, and harsh discipline do indeed lead to higher combat morale. All the factors a WW1 sergeant major would have listed as leading to high combat morale have turned out to be correct. (The context of these studies, as reported in various Jane’s journals over the years, is to try and explain why the troops of poorer countries sometimes have higher combat morale than the better trained troops of western countries. BTW, combat morale is defined as the ability to continue to generate combat power after suffering casualties. The willingness of survivors to fight on.)

Well, this raises a brain-stranglingly large number of questions, which would probably merit a separate thread or five. So instead I will merely ask for a list of your sources for these findings, and a nod of agreement that morale (in the sense of suppression-resistance and casualty-tolerance) should be separated from troop quality (skill-at-arms, fieldcraft) and also probably from rallying ability (group cohesion, probably).

All the best,

John.

[legend42]

plane cam veiw

[MrNoobie]

not sure if this was mentioned cuz i didnt read everyones wishes

follow and stay on road commands.

[Goose]

One of the reasons terrain undulations are hard to spot in CM is the ambient lighting. Directional lighting would help very very much here! Maybe even possible to include for CMAK? Please?

[SgtMuhammed]

How about changing the rarity system so that instead of rare units costing more they are just not available? Every unit would have a percentage based on its rarity. Sometimes you can buy it, sometimes not.

[Other Means]

how about having a topo map plus being able to increase the Y axis of the map, much like the shift C for unit size? shift Y perhaps.

toggle it up to see the undulations, then to normal to see the movie.

[Captain Pies]

Its been mentioned in passing by a couple of posters in relation to dynamic lighting, but needs to be specifically stated.

FO's and Mortars should have a new ammo type for night battles: Parachute Flares. I don't really care how it's modelled, just turn night into day for a minute or so