Tigrii Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 I want to know how many people would object if I used large numbers of half squads against them in a game and how many people think its a normal tactic just like any other? Please just state YOUR opinion and don't start arguing here (there's another thread for that). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 No objection. While I think the benefit is there (the morale hit is too low to discourage the practice) I don't think the overall benefit is high enough to break into sweat. I won't use it because I'm too lazy and rather take fewer than more units 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philippe Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 No objection. Don't use them much myself, but I suspect that they may be more realistic than the designer intended them to be. So I don't have a problem with getting attacked by half-squad hordes, especially in the wrong situation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 Object – but only because its a bugger to fight - not for any 'gameyness'. Which I guess would be 'No objection'. Might as well object to the massed use of 'hide' by the defender, too! 'Split' and 'Hide' are both in the menu options. All's fair in love and... CM. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merkin Muffley Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 No objection. In fact, compulsory for opponent to have split squads when playing 2000 point combined arms ... TCP/IP and 2 minute turns 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 No objection 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 Not a problem. Mind you, I have yet to meet an opponent who has used this tactic! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A. Miles Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 Same here, I've never encountered this tactic in an opponent! If this did happen though... I wouldn't object, as long as splitting squads is used in a localized tactical maneuver, or an extremely spread out defence. However, I do object to the wholesale splitting of an enemy force. [ February 02, 2005, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: K.A. Miles ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treeburst155 Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 I would not play a squad-splitter in a non-competition setting as it detracts from the OVERALL realism of the game. In a tournament, I would expect to run into the tactic because it works so well, IMO. I would happily play a squad-splitter in a tournament. Treeburst155 out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glider Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 No objection, except for tediousness. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herr Kruger Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 If you beat me with it, I wouldn't like it! Hehe... well, in all seriousness I don't think I would like it much. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Other Means Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 Originally posted by Glider: No objection, except for tediousness. Kind of sums it up for me. The thing is though, the wholesale splitting of squads *does* seem to offer a great advantage. Great enough to force you to do the same. And IMHO that adds to the workload of making a turn without adding any to the fun. So I guess as the tediousness is real, so is my objection. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Other Means Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 Thinking again, I've never tried to do it. Maybe I will with a few games I have going & see what happens - I might love the decisions it forces on you. Harumph. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 I wouldn't worry at all. I'd try to learn from where it works for you and where it doesn't. GaJ -- Steve, BFC: "If both sides play with all their squads in halves... it is more even, and in some ways a little more realistic." 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KG_Jag Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 I would object. By using this technique you are, in effect, changing the base infantry unit in the game. In my view that is gaming the system. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paco QNS Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 No problem. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_no_one Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 I would say that I would need to see the situation before I say if I would object or not.The larger the venue though,the less likely I would be to object. I will use split squads,versus my usual opponents,in the typical manner in which the vast majority of us use them.If it were some sort of competition,I would consider it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 No objection. Cheers Dandelion 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Pilot Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 No objection. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KG_Jag Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Here's the post from Battlefront that supports my opposition to massive use of half squads. Put simply the game system (the tac AI especially I suspect) is not designed to deal with this "technique". Battlefront said: "Remember that CM is not real life and therefore unanticipated things tend to undermine the system because balancing elements are simply not there or are not balanced correctly. It would be nice if things just magically worked as they would in real life, but that isn't what happens. If both sides play with all their squads in halves... it is more even, and in some ways a little more realistic. On the whole though it is less realistic than if the squads were kept in one piece. The reason is because the game was designed around the principle of the squad, and therefore there are some things that simply don't work as well when faced with tons of half squads. The reason for that is CM was never intended to work that way. Since we didn't intend it to be, we did not program it to be. And if we did not program it to be, chances are it can not be. For those of you who have coded any type of application that is used by lots of people, you know what I mean. One of the unrelenting rules of software is that the closer the user is to the one in the developer's head, the better the software will perform its intended functions. The opposite is true. Good developers are the ones who anticipate or restrict user actions and program accordingly better than others in their field. And the more complex the program, the better the developer has to be at it. Inherently, however, it is still software and it can still be broken through unanticipated user actions. Swarms of 1/2 squads were not anticipated, ergo the sim will (in some situations more than others) not function as intended. For us we have never been surprised that people have found ways of doing things we never thought of or actually spent time trying to prohibit. Nope, the surprise is how little of this there has been over the years in relation to the complexity of the scope and subject matter. In this case, we're not surprised people found a loophole with the half squads in certain situations... we're surprised it took 5 years to find it Steve" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philippe Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Umm...I think everyone here read that elsewhere. This thread is for getting a sense of the numbers on both sides of the issue, not for debating it. There are two other threads for that. I suggest we both delete our posts after a decent interval. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KG_Jag Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 Philippe, thanks for your suggestion, but I repectfully decline your offer. Here is why. No vote is very meaningful unless the people voting are informed about the facts. I do not necesarity share you assumption that everyone who will vote here is familiar with two other threads, at least one of which is very long. I did not post the opinion of just anyone or of anyone merely taking a position on this issue. I posted a direct quotation of what the makers of this series of games have said. If Battlefront posts other information on this issue, it also will be helpful to have here at the polling place. That is true, regardless of which side of the poll, if any, it can be viewed as supporting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted February 4, 2005 Share Posted February 4, 2005 KG - the best you can do is point people to the relevant threads. Otherwise you just have a quote from Steve out of context. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KG_Jag Posted February 5, 2005 Share Posted February 5, 2005 Since Philippe's point was that everybody who voted had already read the threads, I saw no need to post a link to them. I'm surprised that you did not do so yourself, if you thought it was important. However, since you didn't, I'm glad to do so. We'll let everyone decide for themselves whether or not the quotation I posted was taken out of context. http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=23;t=010379 http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=23;t=010438 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew H. Posted February 5, 2005 Share Posted February 5, 2005 I wouldn't have any objection to people using half squads if they want to. As I mentioned in my post in the other thread, I think that they make the game more realistic than not. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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