Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 On a more serious note. Some say after the exercises Chinese and Indian material will 'get lost' and stay behind to turn up again in the war in Ukraine. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11119667/Chinese-troops-travel-Russia-military-exercises-India-eastern-war-games.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazing 88's Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, LukeFF said: Brilliant idea! This thread the last couple of pages has been a bunch of boring back and forth about Afghanistan, etc., and then of course you had to get one more dig into Trump (sounding like a child at that), because hey, we're already off-topic, right? And now I know why I spend less and less time in this topic. Ouch, did I touch a nerve? Bunch of Biden bashing going on,thought I'd help the fella out a bit... you know throw one trump cow pie into it. Just for prosperity. Nothing more. Edited August 18, 2022 by Blazing 88's 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 27 minutes ago, LukeFF said: and then of course you had to get one more dig into Trump (sounding like a child at that), because hey, we're already off-topic, right? I agree. Hopefully you are as equally unhappy and disappointed with the post Blazing 88s was responding to. Specifically Cederic's uncalled for political dig on Biden, which spawned some other digs. Neither does anything to further this thread, don't you think? So with that in mind, I'm asking everybody to put a sock in it. Each side of the political isle should realize by now that the other side has no interest in listening to the other. And I've got no interesting in having to remind people that if they want to engage in useless and pointless postings, there's plenty of other places to do it. 27 minutes ago, LukeFF said: And now I know why I spend less and less time in this topic. You didn't pick the best time to dive in again, obviously Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 15 minutes ago, Blazing 88's said: Ouch, did I touch a nerve? Bunch of Biden bashing going on,thought I'd help the fella out a bit... you know throw one trump cow pie into it. Just for prosperity. Nothing more. Well, you can stop now. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 14 minutes ago, Battlefront.com said: Well, you can stop now. Steve dang you keep some crazy hours 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 1 hour ago, Aragorn2002 said: On a more serious note. Some say after the exercises Chinese and Indian material will 'get lost' and stay behind to turn up again in the war in Ukraine. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11119667/Chinese-troops-travel-Russia-military-exercises-India-eastern-war-games.html Would they even need such an "elaborate" deception? It's not like it would fool anybody. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraze Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 10 hours ago, FancyCat said: The article linked has so much more information on Russia and attitudes to war. The head of former station Echo Moscow, a opposition oriented radio station, which was closed following the invasion, ill quote below, which is only part of the long article. Nevermind, look this stuff as well. Just part of the long article, please do read it all. https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/how-putin-s-war-changed-my-moscow-a-3b5049e7-93fd-4c2a-9c9f-742635ae2099 I think when looking at Ukrainian anger at Russia, this comes to mind, from article, Ukraine has "Within three decades, Ukraine has experienced five genuine changes of power, whereas Russia has seen none." for a people who have regularly seen changes in government, and experienced two revolutions (Orange and Maidan) since independence only 30 years ago, Russian attitudes towards their government must be near infantile. Also, the article has a interview with Alexander Borodai, who was appointed PM of the DPR in 2014 (after helping to annex Crimea), despite not being from Ukraine, says this: just absolutely dripping antisemitism. Worth noting that Echo of Moscow was "opposition-oriented" in name only. It was 100% owned by Gazprom e.g. putin himself and its execs (most of whom were Echo's journalists) had their shows in that media and were really imperialistic and aggressive in their views, especially towards Ukraine from as far as 2007 at least. I guess their goal was to cater to the "intelligencia fascists" that hoped to occupy Ukraine without the war, the ones people in the West mistakenly consider "opposition" - but after the full scale invasion started and it turned out that there's zero difference between russian "opposition" and Z-tattooed crazies - there was no point in pouring millions of $$ into it - spare money russians don't exactly have lying around anymore. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraze Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, dan/california said: The proof that Biden new and believed is the Afghanistan exit. I have zero inside knowledge on this, but I am convinced knowing about Russias plans for Ukraine are why Biden got out of Afghanistan so abruptly. We just would not have been ale to respond the same way with the Taliban suddenly being flooded with Russian kit. It may be much simpler that that. Why waste lives (and huge cash) on a country that does not want to change and does not want you there? As was clearly proven by an instant collapse when the big guy was out - everybody rushed towards supporting and joining Taliban. Real "Mission Accomplished" was at least a decade ago. Staying in Afghanistan was only helping people that cope with reality by thinking that dictators run the show and not people put dictators in power, hence why people need somebody else to depose that one for them and guide them to Democracy, Liberty and Freedom. Edited August 18, 2022 by kraze 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 23 minutes ago, Bulletpoint said: Would they even need such an "elaborate" deception? It's not like it would fool anybody. True enough. But it would be 'a cunning plan' to export arms and ammo to Putin, without large transportation over sea or land. But you're right of course. Anyone who still believes in China's neutrality (or India's neutrality) is very naive, to put it mildly. Apart from that it's a very strange signal to continue joint exercises with Putin in a time like this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paxromana Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 5 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said: True enough. But it would be 'a cunning plan' to export arms and ammo to Putin, without large transportation over sea or land. But you're right of course. Anyone who still believes in China's neutrality (or India's neutrality) is very naive, to put it mildly. Apart from that it's a very strange signal to continue joint exercises with Putin in a time like this. More to the point, how many actual soldiers can Russia commit to these 'Joint Exercises' ... a Company and a Half? Riding in T-62s and superannuated first gen BMP-1's perhaps, Isn't that about all Putler has left? Unless they want to send the guys who mount Ceremonial Guard at the Kremlin? Not exactly combat soldiers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hcrof Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 8 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said: True enough. But it would be 'a cunning plan' to export arms and ammo to Putin, without large transportation over sea or land. But you're right of course. Anyone who still believes in China's neutrality (or India's neutrality) is very naive, to put it mildly. Apart from that it's a very strange signal to continue joint exercises with Putin in a time like this. The world is not black and white. India is a historic ally of Russia that is moving away from that partnership, albeit slowly. China is a nominal russian partner but there are serious trust issues between them and they only despise each other marginally less than the USA. Neutrality is a spectrum, not an absolute. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 36 minutes ago, hcrof said: The world is not black and white. Mine is. Especially when it comes to joint military exercises with an aggressive country that just invaded another country and is bombing, killing, raping and torturing it's civilians. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huba Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 First in a upcoming series of threads, based on memoirs of VDV soldier who participated in Kherson invasion. Well worth the read: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 Ninja'd Looking forward to more of this account though. I don't think any of it is surprising at this stage, but it does highlight a background issue. For want of a better description, there is a kind of 'zombie' aspect to the Russian army, where they don't really conform to Western expectations. Perhaps for the troops north of Kherson the fact that they're existing with their logistics practically severed, abandoned by their commanders, scavenging for food, living in unsanitary conditions and slowly succumbing to disease isn't the kind of military disaster that we would envisage... it's just like being back in barracks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 1 hour ago, paxromana said: More to the point, how many actual soldiers can Russia commit to these 'Joint Exercises' ... a Company and a Half? Riding in T-62s and superannuated first gen BMP-1's perhaps, Isn't that about all Putler has left? Unless they want to send the guys who mount Ceremonial Guard at the Kremlin? Not exactly combat soldiers. It will indeed be interesting to see what Russian units will join the exercises. Only a symbolic participation will be another loss of prestige for Vlad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huba Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 34 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said: Mine is. Especially when it comes to joint military exercises with an aggressive country that just invaded another country and is bombing, killing, raping and torturing it's civilians. It's all true, but there's no way they would miss the unique learning opportunities: 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 3 minutes ago, Huba said: It's all true, but there's no way they would miss the unique learning opportunities: And why not to post photos of the locaton of your HQ on Twitter. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckdyke Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 32 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said: It will indeed be interesting to see what Russian units will join the exercises. Only a symbolic participation will be another loss of prestige for Vlad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 6 minutes ago, chuckdyke said: Most figurants will be dead by now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckdyke Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 2 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said: Most figurants will be dead by now. They give Bollywood a run for their money. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 1 minute ago, chuckdyke said: They give Bollywood a run for their money. Let them invade, I say! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckdyke Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 1 minute ago, Aragorn2002 said: Let them invade, I say! They are 'Crack Troops' in every sense of the word. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letter from Prague Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 Maybe Russia can send its two working T-14s to train with China. (On a serious note, given the culture, I would not want to be a woman in Russian armed forces). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beleg85 Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) It is worth to read this article by Kyiv Independent about criminal commander of International Legion. There were before many informations from fighters about this kind of problems in part of the unit that was subordinate to GUR. It is unfortunate that "top", including people from Zhelenksy entourage, were reportedly not interested in checking and correcting how things were going there. Now we have scandal. On one side, Russian propaganda have a Christma present. On the other, it shows that independent journalism is well in Ukraine; publishing such article would be impossible in Russian press. https://kyivindependent.com/investigations/suicide-missions-abuse-physical-threats-international-legion-fighters-speak-out-against-leaderships-misconduct Edited August 18, 2022 by Beleg85 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeleban Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 1 hour ago, Aragorn2002 said: Most figurants will be dead by now. why do you think so? they are ordinary actors, they don't have to die 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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