Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 1, 2021 Author Share Posted November 1, 2021 The Fifty-Sixth Minute - Objective ROT A lot happened in this turn so I'm going to split the update up, first we'll look at Objective ROT. SBF The infantry get a spot on the ATG team running away. It was a fleeting glimpse so my guess is that he went to ground. They also get another ATG contact in the trees where the knocked out Maxim was. It's another 45mm gun on the reverse slope. Knocked out again so my guesses continue to be lucky. There's a lot of fire going into the objective now and I am getting no fire back so I move the A team from 1st squad up to join their squadmate. Towards the end of the turn the squad I saw at the end of last turn make a run for it. Despite the amount of fire going down that road he makes it to the middle house on the left. Shortly thereafter this chap appears. He's from the same squad so either discipline has completely broken down or he's running them across the street using the Assault command, which would not be my choice in such circumstances. Assault Element - 1 Kompanie 2nd squad from 2nd zug advancing up the left suddenly take a casualty. Origin of the shooter is not known. It takes a little while but the shooter is spotted in sector D in one of the houses in the back. Another Maxim in a nice keyhole position. Pity one of my overwatching Tigers has LOS and somehow heard the shots and knows he's there. Mu ha ha ha. 1st squad are advancing up the right hand side and they come under fire from the foremost building in sector E, another Maxim. They go to ground and this building will be getting some love in the next turn from the supporting SPWs. SITMAP The presence of heavy weapons isn't a surprise. I've knocked one MG out and just discovered two more so I expect there will be one more out there somewhere. The MGs will both be taken under fire, the one in sector D will get some 88mm HE love and I'm going to use the cannon on the 251/17 to attack the gunner in sector E. The advance will halt for a mo until these guys can be neutralised. The MG teams from 4 zug are al set up too so they will provide overwatch and I'm starting to bring 1st zug forward in their transport. MMM 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 1, 2021 Author Share Posted November 1, 2021 The Fifty-Sixth Minute - KT4 Not a good turn for 1st zug, 2 Kompanie. The Maxim team open fire and take out a man from 1st squad. The rest of 1st squad get a spot and start to return fire. Only to take a casualty themselves. This shot came from the left of the MG team. It soon resolves to another Maxim team. So at least a section. Over to the left the SPW comes up to take the Maxim team under fire. 2nd squad advance down the left to a position where they can put fire into the flank of whoever is suppressed in the trees. They have to get quite close to get LOS due to the reverse slope. They get a spot on what looks like a SMG squad HUNTing through the trees towards my forces. It seems strange that he would bring more troops up to the front given the amount of fire he's receiving, the more the merrier I say. 2nd squad start to get some BDA information as we spot a few casualties and a HQ team retreating. The HQ team is quickly followed by what looks like the infantry squad that I knew was in there. What I would give for some artillery in this scenario They carry on running away as 2nd squad fire on them. It's hard to tell if this is planned or they are broken, it happened quite a bit into the turn so I'll assume it was not planned as they've been under heavy fire for a while now. SITMAP I'm a bit worried I may have pushed a bit too far towards KT4. He has 2 MG teams in the treeline and there's probably more troops in there. I'm going to bring the StuG up to put some HE fire on them and then I think I'll pull what's left of 1st squad back. I have seen no AT assets on this flank, I would expect that the SPW that is firing on the MG team would be in range and may have attracted some fire by now if he had any guns over there. Interesting... MMM 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chibot Mk IX Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 17 hours ago, Monty's Mighty Moustache said: Any movements by the armour will be led by the Tigers for this very reason, I don't trust the Panther Gs with their iffy armour to take that job on. MMM I would be more worry about 57mm Zis-2. 76mm Zis-3 pose a great threat to infantry but it is a meh against late period Panzers. It cannot even penetrate StuG III's front. Flank shot is a different story, that's why put a Tiger at front helps , (82mm side armor should make it immune to Zis-3) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 It can still knock out the gun or tracks easily enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexUK Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Really impressive DAR ! Really enjoying it, thanks for the labour of love. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamxo Posted November 2, 2021 Share Posted November 2, 2021 Also chiming in to say how great this is and that I'm eagerly reading along. The slow methodical build up in the snow is so atmospheric and you are doing a fantastic job documenting it all with some stellar screenshots and descriptions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 2, 2021 Author Share Posted November 2, 2021 23 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: It can still knock out the gun or tracks easily enough. That's probably as bad as having the tank knocked out in this battle to be honest, with the limited visibility and given how much of my firepower is in the vehicles then if I start getting them immobilised or guns knocked out then they are as good as dead. I'll be trying to overwhelm whatever defences I think he has from the max visible range for this reason. I don't want to give him time to shoot back. MMM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 2, 2021 Author Share Posted November 2, 2021 (edited) 23 hours ago, AlexUK said: Really impressive DAR ! Really enjoying it, thanks for the labour of love. 1 hour ago, jamxo said: Also chiming in to say how great this is and that I'm eagerly reading along. The slow methodical build up in the snow is so atmospheric and you are doing a fantastic job documenting it all with some stellar screenshots and descriptions. Thank you both. It is a lot of work but I've got my workflow down now so it doesn't take as long as it did at the start. The planning write-up took me forever as I had to refresh my memory with GIMP and usually I don't write down my analysis other than to draw a sketch and put some arrows on it so it was all from memory. Might be fun to take a picture of my sketch and post it at some point. I'm trying to convey the mystery with lots of over the shoulder views at eye-level so you feel like you're in amongst it. Glad to know that it's somewhat successful. I've got two more turns to write up so I'l try and get that done tonight. MMM Edited November 2, 2021 by Monty's Mighty Moustache 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamxo Posted November 2, 2021 Share Posted November 2, 2021 28 minutes ago, Monty's Mighty Moustache said: I'm trying to convey the mystery with lots of over the shoulder views at eye-level so you feel like you're in amongst it. Glad to know that it's somewhat successful. One of the things I'm enjoying most about it! Also making me appreciate how when you view the maps at ground level the game engine actually does a great job portraying realistic landscapes (considering it's age now!) - hats off to the map designer too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted November 2, 2021 Share Posted November 2, 2021 5 hours ago, Monty's Mighty Moustache said: I've got two more turns to write up so I'l try and get that done tonight. Looking forward to 'em, as others have said you are doing a fine job with this AAR and the tension is definitely building.....It feels like we're still in the prelude phase right now, but the main event seems fairly imminent! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 3, 2021 Author Share Posted November 3, 2021 The Fifty-Seventh Minute Objective ROT A reminder of how we left it last time: SBF The Tiger with LOS take a few shots at the MG gunner in sector D. Ouch, that's got to hurt. He's seen shortly after repositioning. 1st squad are back together, next turn they will be heading out towards Sgt Plucky's last known position in the building ahead, covered by a SPW. It's the only bit of cover around this place so once it's secure I'll bring a MG section up and see what we can uncover around the back of the objective. I suspect he has one more gun out there somewhere. The remainder of that infantry squad we spotted last time reappears and makes a run for it across the road towards the same house in the middle. He doesn't make it. The Assault Element - 1 Kompanie The 251/17 starts to suppress the MG in sector E but not before he can take another man out from 1st squad. That team is down to 1 man now. The SPW quickly suppresses him however. A shot from sector A takes out the gunner in one of the MG sections. We get the spot soon after, it's the same HQ team that we lost sight of after it pulled out of the building at the end of the row. 1st squad's B team sole survivor starts taking more fire from a squad in the second building in sector B, none of it hits as I think he is on a reverse slope from their position. It's SMG fire so it could be a SMG platoon, it would make sense to put them one row back to obliterate anyone who entered the buildings in sector A. The updated SITMAP for the objective: KT4 We lose another man from 1st squad to the MG fire, that squad is down to two men. One of the SPWs starts taking MG fire too, some of it is coming from the Maxims but there is some fire coming in from elsewhere in the same treeline. That fire nicks the gunner and the driver freaks out and starts reversing. I think I hear SMG fire coming from the treeline just ahead too so someone in there is not suppressed. The Ko. HQ gets the spot on the mystery shooter, it's a DP gunner and friend in the treeline flanking the Maxims. I'm not sure if this is a full squad. Something to keep an eye on but if he has split his squads then they will be easier to rout with long range fires. The StuG arrives on station and starts firing on the Maxim positions, they are quickly suppressed. No fire is going toward the DP gunner though and he shifts targets several times, thankfully none of them hit but a number of my infantry are now suppressed. SITMAP I'm going to pull the infantry back out of range of the trees on the right at KT4, they have done their job. I will keep the fire up with vehicles, the 251/17 from this zug will come up and take the DP gunner under fire and see if we can drive him off. The SPWs firing on the nearest treeline will shift their fire slightly to suppress whatever SMG toting maniac is firing at my forces. At the objective I'm going to start moving the Tigers up a bit to try and get a better look into the back of the town. 1st squad will check out the buildings where Sgt Plucky was hold up. I'll be bringing fire onto the new contacts in the objective and pulling all of 2nd zug to the left to advance on the reverse slope by the stream to protect them from any fires from sector B. The MGs and SPWs will continue to provide covering fire. MMM 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted November 3, 2021 Share Posted November 3, 2021 (edited) That road heading north east off the centre of the map.....I forsee T-34/85s coming down it! Ever since you suggested he might have a whole company of tanks I've been worrying about their continued non-appearance.....If he's got that many, he's definitely holding them back to clobber you with them en-masse and the road seems the easiest way to route them into the battle. How visible is that road from your current/projected positions? EDIT - Just looked back at the initial posts.....Big map! Which is probably good news as there are plenty more places those tanks could be (the cropped map had rather confused me). Edited November 3, 2021 by Sgt.Squarehead 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 3, 2021 Author Share Posted November 3, 2021 12 minutes ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: That road heading north east off the centre of the map.....I forsee T-34/85s coming down it! Ever since you suggested he might have a whole company of tanks I've been worrying about their continued non-appearance.....If he's got that many, he's definitely holding them back to clobber you with them en-masse and the road seems the easiest way to route them into the battle. How visible is that road from your current/projected positions? EDIT - Just looked back at the initial posts.....Big map! Which is probably good news as there are plenty more places those tanks could be (the cropped map had rather confused me). Yeah I crop the map to the relevant areas due to the size of it. If he’s got them held back it will take a while to get them up to the objective If he is going to reinforce the objective then that road makes the most sense to me too, he knows I have forces on the left and right and I don’t actually have eyes on that road beyond the objective. It’s why I’m moving the infantry up to the buildings to try and get some warning. If he does come from that direction though I have confidence in my Tigers and Panthers in the open. If he comes the other ways I’ll have enough time to do something about it even though the forces I have on the flanks won’t offer much resistance against a massed attack. I have a new turn from him that I haven’t watched yet so we’ll see what happens MMM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted November 3, 2021 Share Posted November 3, 2021 I was under the impression that this was the primary objective.....Now I've looked back it all looks a lot less worrying! I might take a look at the scenario in Preview Mode in the editor, so I can get a proper feel for the terrain.....Promise not to look at the '85s'! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 3, 2021 Author Share Posted November 3, 2021 It is the highest value objective so I figured it would be the best defended, most of the points come from destroying his forces. He may decide to keep them around Objective GRAU and lure me into the woods, it depends how bad he wants to hold onto this objective I guess. MMM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 3, 2021 Author Share Posted November 3, 2021 If it was me defending in the current situation I would probably give this objective up and pull as many forces as so could back into the trees and try and suck them in. Then launch a counterattack when the panzers aren’t out in the open MMM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted November 3, 2021 Share Posted November 3, 2021 Am glad this is one place where folks discuss tactics and strategy... It is fascinating to see how other players see the situation and make their plans and then see how they do. This is a wonderful DAR. It's motivating me to start a SFTH game vs the AI. Re the German strategy, I will probably focus everything on the town and only have recon forces probe elsewhere along with some AT assets to guard the flanks while the town assault is implemented. Only after the town is safely occupied will substantial assault forces be allocated towards other objectives. My experience (in CM) is that focusing everything on one attack at a time is (usually) the key to winning (in CM games). Attempting multiple attacks is (usually) not a good idea as it enables the oppo to focus on one's weaknesses. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted November 3, 2021 Share Posted November 3, 2021 10 minutes ago, Erwin said: Am glad this is one place where folks discuss tactics and strategy... It is fascinating to see how other players see the situation and make their plans and then see how they do. This is a wonderful DAR. It's motivating me to start a SFTH game vs the AI. +1. Interesting stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 3, 2021 Author Share Posted November 3, 2021 20 minutes ago, Erwin said: Re the German strategy, I will probably focus everything on the town and only have recon forces probe elsewhere along with some AT assets to guard the flanks while the town assault is implemented. Only after the town is safely occupied will substantial assault forces be allocated towards other objectives. My experience (in CM) is that focusing everything on one attack at a time is (usually) the key to winning (in CM games). Attempting multiple attacks is (usually) not a good idea as it enables the oppo to focus on one's weaknesses. That’s pretty much my strategy, albeit the recon forces are quite sizeable, but it still amounts to one platoon on the left and 2 on the right, each with a StuG for anti-tank work. The one on the left has done it’s job so I’m actually thinking of leaving a small force over there as a screen and sending the rest of 2 Ko over to join the SBF and aid in the assault. But we’ll see, the assault is going well with the forces allocated thus far. The rest are attacking the town, once I have that objective then I can envisage a couple of Kampfgruppe being created and going off to capture the other objectives but I’m not going to get ahead of myself. I am slightly nervous about armour coming around the right side of the town as they could appear on 1 Kompanie’s flank and cause chaos and there wouldn’t be much the zug from 3 Kompanie that is watching that area could do about it. I haven’t mentioned it in a while but the panzer platoon HQ Tiger is actually following 1 Kompanie along AoA2 and is there as an emergency reserve should the infantry need support in such a situation. It’s quite far back though so I think I need to bring it up a bit. MMM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozowans Posted November 3, 2021 Share Posted November 3, 2021 3 hours ago, Monty's Mighty Moustache said: If it was me defending in the current situation I would probably give this objective up and pull as many forces as so could back into the trees and try and suck them in. Then launch a counterattack when the panzers aren’t out in the open MMM That does seem like the best strategy for him. That first objective is terribly exposed. There is still the road to Konigsberg, the church, and Waldburg objectives, and it looks like those would be far more difficult to take. Together they would be worth 600 points, while Wardienen (ROT) is 400. So if you only take ROT, he still wins (unless you destroy his whole force I guess). That road leading from ROT to GRAU looks like it would be a horrible nightmare to go down. You would be channeled into a narrow chokepoint, and there are a million great ambush points around those woods above KT2. If I was him I would put lots of tanks and AT guns all over there, hidden in the woods and facing the road. The blizzard would help hide them until they are ready to open fire on your flanks as you move up the road. With all the time it took to secure ROT and move out again, the spotting info about your tanks would probably already be distributed throughout the Soviet C2 network, so they would know you are coming while they themselves are still masked by the blizzard. There is also a little bridge across a stream you would have to cross, and it would be easy for him to have guns trained on that bridge from keyhole positions in the woods to the flanks and rear. You would have no choice but to painstakingly clear the woods on foot, putting you at a huge disadvantage. I'm not really sure how I would attack in this situation. Maybe go way around the far right side of the map? It's more open there at least. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 8 hours ago, Bozowans said: That does seem like the best strategy for him. That first objective is terribly exposed. There is still the road to Konigsberg, the church, and Waldburg objectives, and it looks like those would be far more difficult to take. Together they would be worth 600 points, while Wardienen (ROT) is 400. So if you only take ROT, he still wins (unless you destroy his whole force I guess). That road leading from ROT to GRAU looks like it would be a horrible nightmare to go down. You would be channeled into a narrow chokepoint, and there are a million great ambush points around those woods above KT2. If I was him I would put lots of tanks and AT guns all over there, hidden in the woods and facing the road. The blizzard would help hide them until they are ready to open fire on your flanks as you move up the road. With all the time it took to secure ROT and move out again, the spotting info about your tanks would probably already be distributed throughout the Soviet C2 network, so they would know you are coming while they themselves are still masked by the blizzard. There is also a little bridge across a stream you would have to cross, and it would be easy for him to have guns trained on that bridge from keyhole positions in the woods to the flanks and rear. You would have no choice but to painstakingly clear the woods on foot, putting you at a huge disadvantage. I'm not really sure how I would attack in this situation. Maybe go way around the far right side of the map? It's more open there at least. I would do the same if I were him, in fact I think I would probably only have a very small force in objective ROT and pull it back as soon as contact is made and line the trees with as much stuff as I could. Make the Germans wrong no matter what they did. Of course this presumes the Soviets have enough forces to make this viable When I first saw the map I was tempted to just command-push up the right flank to the back of the map. It still might be the best way to get to GRAU but the presents don’t of the tank and at least a platoon of infantry at what essentially looks like an OP gives me second thoughts, I agree that the road to the NE does not look attractive at all. Far too many pinch points and places for the Ivans to hide. By attacking objective ROT first I hope to destroy a large part of his force and maybe draw him out from the trees and fight on my terms. MMM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 I finally got round to watching yesterday’s turn. I’ll post a report soon but let’s just say that things have changed… MMM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 The Fifty-Eighth and Fifty-Ninth Minutes - KT4 A lot happened in these two turns so I'll start with KT4. As I was bringing up the 251/17 to fire on the treeline he spots the AT rifle team member off to the right again. He's on a reverse slope still and doesn't seem to be doing much so I will deal with him in a bit. The infantry are pulling back under the suppressive fire of the vehicles. We get a confirmed spot on the person firing the SMG, looks like there is indeed another squad in there. The suppressive fires soon make him go to ground and it looks like they've started retreating. That's their contact icon on the right, heading away. They all make it back without taking further casualties. Now they are all back out of range of the MGs in the woods I'll pull the vehicles back and keep up harassing fire on the trees by the highway. The infantry will regroup and take up defensive positions. MMM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Mighty Moustache Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 (edited) The Fifty-Eighth and Fifty-Ninth Minutes - Objective ROT A reminder of the enemy dispositions at the end of the last turn: SBF - Panzers and 2 Kompanie (-) 1st squad reach Sgt Plucky's house, alas he is no more. The vehicles and MGs are keeping up the fire on the objective as the Tigers start to move up a bit closer. They get a spot in another building in sector B, it's a HQ unit so I assume that it's the platoon HQ for the squad I spotted in the other building in that sector. They manage to take out a man from the HQ unit that was firing from sector A. Another Maxim team pops up in sector D and is quickly suppressed. It's marked as knocked out so I'm not sure if this was the guy that was in the building behind that the Tiger was firing at or if it's the remnants of some other team. If it is another as yet unseen team then that's 4 maxims spotted and there shouldn't be any more. I'll mark it as a new team for now until we get more information. A look at the dispositions of the SBF forces. The Tigers are pushing up to get eyes on the back of the objective and the infantry is continuing to advance. The Assault Element - 1 Kompanie The remaining man in B team, 1st squad goes full Rambo and suppresses the squad in sector B all by himself. I bring fire from a SPW too and he goes about tending to his fallen comrades. The rest of 2nd zug are moving across to the left into some defilade from sector B to advance up the stream bank. The HQ unit in sector A takes out a man in A team of 1st squad but the advance continues. Two of the zug's SPWs are rushing forward to support the advance from close range now that I'm fairly confident anything that can do them real harm is either knocked out or suppressed. The squad in sector B pop their heads up again and this time one of the MG sections from 4th zug get a spot and fill his face with lead. 3rd squad are closing on the objective... when they get some sound contacts moving into the objective - ACHTUNG! PANZER! It looks like he's decided to reinforce the objective with armour. It doesn't appear to be a full on counterattack as they came into the back of the objective and stopped behind some buildings in sectors D and F, the full weight of the attack may be about to come. I assume he used the road from GRAU to bring them down undetected as all other avenues that he could use are covered. Either way I am pleased to see this, it means I may not have to go into the trees to destroy these forces and I can use my advantages in the open. I love the way the C2 works in this game, by the end of the turn the info had filtered all the way up to the Bn HQ and has already started filtering down, the panzers don't have the info yet but they will soon. I have to assume that he has another one tank at least (assuming they are T34s) and that he had tank riders on the back. Where he has stopped he has no LOS to any of my forces but if he nudges the leftmost vehicle forward a bit he will be able to get LOS on the left flank of my SBF position and the SPW over there so I need to do some rearranging. I'll be pulling the SPWs back behind the panzers where they aren't already and rearranging the panzers so that he will have difficulty isolating any of them and they can mutually support one another. I'll continue the assault, but my guard is definitely up. 1st zug are currently still mounted, I'll be dismounting them and bringing them up as support just in case he's debussed a platoon of tankodesantniki. One thing that does worry me, that I mentioned before, is that 1 Kompanie do have panzerfausts and shreks but no real armour support and he could wheel around the right of the objective and hit them in the flank. The HQ Tiger has been hanging back just in case further down AoA2 but now is the time to bring it forward to support the assault and protect the right flank. The objective at the end of the turn with the new contacts marked. SITMAP Here we go! It's about to get tasty! He has a few choices with the armour he brought to the fight as far as I can see: He can use them to try and get some nice keyhole positions from the objective onto my SBF forces and try and take them out one at a time. This would be difficult to pull off, there aren't that many places he could place them that my armour couldn't see him move into. He could wheel around the objective into 1 Kompanie's right flank and disrupt the attack. He could leave them where they are as infantry support, but that would be risky as my infantry are well equipped for close quarters battles with armour. He could be using them as transportation to bring more troops up to defend the objective and then pull them back. He could be bringing them up to evacuate troops back to the lines. They might not have any organic transport of their own and will be hitching a ride? They are part of a larger force/counterattack from as yet undetermined directions. The tension is palpable, you could cut it with a knife. MMM Edited November 4, 2021 by Monty's Mighty Moustache 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamxo Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 Popcorn at the ready... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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