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Lucky Strike's Mods: Hedgerow Hell


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A little preamble to this taster ...  I grew up in rural Dorset in the south of England where our countryside is not so different than that of Normandy (though the Cider may be a bit stronger!).

... and another That's all I seem to be able to upload for now, so for more look at the DropBox folder linked above ... LS

@benpark So, as I'm quite close now to finishing the bocage textures and finally 🤞 releasing the mod, assuming that no other significant discoveries come to light in the meantime, I checked out what w

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13 hours ago, benpark said:

I think flavor objects are cover, but no concealment. I have a bunch of links saved from way back about it, I'll double check that one. But they would seem...excessive to place in a large forest.

Edit, the link:

Thickets would be a good add to the game engine, overall, a proposed new add- The 2 hedges as they are (and will be, with your mod in place) do well with some additional variation in the other terrain stuff that gets deemed (narrator voice) "appropriate for the scene, based upon weather conditions, and specific situations represented in the actual period terrain" kind of stuff. All the region-specific horticultural knowledge.

I'm enjoying the place-holder color schemes- I always wanted to make a game-wide mod that would replace all/most the sound/dialogue with sayings from 1970's TV shows "MISTAH KOTTAH, I"M HIT". The stuff above would fit right in, jacket included.

Thanks @benpark. A useful write-up from Steve.

I did a small experiment last night just to see what hedges look like in a densely wooded terrain. They are not too bad actually. What I found looked best was having a few pieces of various odd shapes, especially the hedge with gap or the corner sections, spread around the edges of the woods. Then, rather than use the forest floor tiles as ground texture I used weeds, long grass or extra long grass, all combined with brush. The results are a very dense periphery to the woods with the hedges being quite hard to distinguish from the rest of the vegetation. It's quite a lot of work to make it look random and natural, but I actually think your solution of hedges as thickets is very workable.

JnUaqZU.jpg

Hedges in woods viewed from a distance ...

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... up close, hedge with gap, can't really be distinguished ...

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... trees off, still not easy to see

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Map of the area, hedges are a tile or two back from the edge of the woods, bright green.

Of course it only really convinces with a fairly wild looking mod, stock textures may be a bit too regular, but nevertheless it's definitely an improvement. It would still be nice, as you say, to have a thicket texture which could be combined with tree or bush tiles in the same way as hedges or bocage can be. It could even use the same boccage bmps just a bit more random and gappy perhaps.

Incidentally, I noticed that the hedge texture is actually the same as used for the bocage, only thinner. I thought it was a separate bmp, I have seen one called hedge that looks completely different - how is that used? Or isn't it used?

xj0wto2.jpg

hedge.bmp

I tried hedges out in the open on a map, but it still uses the bocage texture.

I can't do anymore of the 70's inspired mods for fear of upsetting a certain Puritan Protector. Although ,as a child of the 70's, I'd definitely like to see a 70's mod - lots of brown and beige with splashes of disco colours, pixeltruppen with giant sideburns and too much hair running around in flares with stacked heels, or on roller-skates even ...

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2 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

I can't do anymore of the 70's inspired mods for fear of upsetting a certain Puritan Protector. Although ,as a child of the 70's, I'd definitely like to see a 70's mod - lots of brown and beige with splashes of disco colours, pixeltruppen with giant sideburns and too much hair running around in flares with stacked heels, or on roller-skates even ...

Another great series of pictures. As for the 70's mods, you can do what you like. It gives us a giggle in these grim times.

Edited by Warts 'n' all
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1 hour ago, Warts 'n' all said:

It gives us a giggle in these grim times.

LOL. I'm sure that's what the Lord Protector thought whilst chopping off old Charlie Boy's head

1 hour ago, Warts 'n' all said:

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Nice! Is that Falaise at his local skate-park back in the day?

Must be about time for another of your famed photo competitions, perhaps something to do with non-combat activities in the bocage - rollerblading, making tea, that sort of thing.

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About the Bocage with a big B, because he is the king of the attention today, i will say only OMG OMG hope to see this one, soon finished on my own desk...

... and hope to see soon from @Lucky_Strike and @Falaise a texte similar as, download now...really impressiv and full of hope !

like said @benpark Fantastic stuff !

Titanesk and Headeache work !!

JM

Edited by 3j2m7
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2 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Nice! Is that Falaise at his local skate-park back in the day?

Must be about time for another of your famed photo competitions, perhaps something to do with non-combat activities in the bocage - rollerblading, making tea, that sort of thing.

I'll let M. Falaise answer your first question.

I don't have any new competitions in the pipeline. I think that we have covered Normandy and Market-Garden as much as we can, and the Bulge has been done to death on this and other sites. It might be that we have to wait until a late war western front module before I come up with another one.

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1 hour ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Soon impatient one, soon ... 😉

... sorry can not resist, I drool, in the front of so many differents aspects of colors and aspects of yours (Lucky and Falaise) satane bocage!

take your time, this will be only better and better and better...

JM

Edited by 3j2m7
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1 hour ago, 3j2m7 said:

... sorry can not resist, I drool, in the front of so many differents aspects of colors and aspects of yours (Lucky and Falaise) satane bocage!

take your time, this will be only better and better and better...

JM

Hah! It's so close now I can almost feel the bocage embracing my tired bones ... or somethin'

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Oooh I like the idea of 'tricking' the games for to generate trees with no foliage. Always bugged me when you are trying to create a pre-destroyed landscape to fight over it was impossible to have defoliated trees among the destruction. The flavour objects introduced in some later titles helps a bit but that does take forever to 'plant' an entire forest.

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9 hours ago, Ithikial_AU said:

Oooh I like the idea of 'tricking' the games for to generate trees with no foliage. Always bugged me when you are trying to create a pre-destroyed landscape to fight over it was impossible to have defoliated trees among the destruction. The flavour objects introduced in some later titles helps a bit but that does take forever to 'plant' an entire forest.

Should be easy enough to produce one or two tree types with little or no foliage. These could then be swapped into the game to replace existing trees or, probably better still, we should be able to use mod tags so other scenarios aren’t affected.

The only caveat might be that any scorching on the trees may be a bit weird looking because of the way the bark texture is applied and stretched for the trunk and branches. I have figured out how to stop the bark from looking oddly stretched on the main trunk, but branches still suffer from smeared textures. Still we can but try ...

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12 hours ago, Ithikial_AU said:

Oooh I like the idea of 'tricking' the games for to generate trees with no foliage. Always bugged me when you are trying to create a pre-destroyed landscape to fight over it was impossible to have defoliated trees among the destruction. The flavour objects introduced in some later titles helps a bit but that does take forever to 'plant' an entire forest.

Something like this do you mean?:

FQcerMI.jpg

amR91rq.jpg

This one needs less twigs but otherwise one very scorched dead tree. Or maybe this one plus another one that is not so burnt and with a few living leaves?

Now back to bocage ... and please don't anyone suggest a whole landscape of destruction - burnt trees and bushes, scorched grass and brush, uprooted crops, blackened ground, all covered in the dust and debris of explosions ... don't even think it!!!! 🤔🥺

 

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So ... I got a bit distracted after @Ithikial_AU suggested some burnt trees might be nice, started to think about modding the actual 3D models - the .mdr files that we've seen @Aquila-SmartWargames and @37mm amongst others change so radically and effectively. This was mooted some time back by a few of you and I said I would have a go at it once I got done with the textures. As my better half will testify I'm always a good one for moving on to the next project before finishing the current one, so I dove into Blender (more of a belly-flop than a pike 💦) at the end of last week. To cut a long story short, I started with the bocage (of course), I was on the cusp of giving up because I just couldn't get the files to export correctly with all my edits intact - think branches only, floating bushes, displaced bushes lah lah lah 😭🤪 Had one more go today and ... lo and behold - I present some subtly changed bocage:

iZnF7w5.jpg

Can't spot what's different? In the middle, fewer bean poles - will please some of you - I certainly won't miss them, and some more, same again ...

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Here's a pic the actual Blender file ...

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You can just about make out the remaining bean pole branches outlined in orange, there are normally a dozen or so on a larger section of bocage, here we have about half that amount. I also removed a couple of leafy branches, just to see if it would work, they are gone in-game! 

So what does all this mean - I don't know. It took me days to get this far. I can use Blender to make the edits I want, I don't really understand the whole process, why things happen or don't when I export files, but if I can make some edits that make even just the bocage look more natural then I will be one happy lapin.

My plan is to make a fully edited section of bocage - more ragged, less or no bean poles, maybe some better branches and roots - then see how it looks in game. I have a few bocage textures to finish first though, so I can release the Hedgerow Hell mod - otherwise @3j2m7 will be knocking at my door demanding I release them 🥺.

 

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@Lucky_Strike like in the reallity when somebody,  knocking at your  door your have two choices...

Let enter  ...or closing for a while untill you find yourself the right moment !

So believe me I can be patient and like only talking too much sometimes.

... be quiet and drink fresh the savour of the sips can be only better !

I don like and don t want to be a lapin and more have a comment without issues !

JM

Edited by 3j2m7
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3 hours ago, 3j2m7 said:

@Lucky_Strike like in the reallity when somebody,  knocking at your  door your have two choices...

Let enter  ...or closing for a while untill you find yourself the right moment !

So believe me I can be patient and like only talking too much sometimes.

... be quiet and drink fresh the savour of the sips can be only better !

I don like and don t want to be a lapin and more have a comment without issues !

JM

Hah. We might even have something for you by the weekend kind sir. Keep an eye open for more than a sip or two ...

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3 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

Love your 'forest edge hedges' they really do blend in very well (my biggest objection to using hedges in this way was how painfully obvious they were).

Thanks Sgt.

I'm hopeful that I may have an even better solution to the use of normal hedges as forest thickets. Looking at the 3D .mdr files for the bocage I suspect that I may be able to wrangle stuff so that the texture currently used by both bocage and normal hedge - boccage2.bmp I believe - is ONLY used by hedges and not by bocage. That is to say it's perhaps possible to make both low and tall bocage .mdr mods that use boccage.bmp and the other new numbered boccage bmps that I'm making, so that just normal hedges are using the boccage2.bmp. This would then allow for a unique texture to be created for boccage2.bmp / hedges. They could then, with careful management, or perhaps mod tags, be used as the thickets that @benpark, yourself and no doubt others would like to see in game. I don't know how much LOS, cover or concealment hedges provide when used in this way but I would warrant that it's better in some respects than brush and long grass ...

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11 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

I can use Blender to make the edits I want, I don't really understand the whole process, why things happen or don't when I export file

Every experiment I've made to try & change a tree or bush/hedge/fence model (and there have been many over the past year) has been a dismal failure... so good job being the first!

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