weapon2010 Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 I think an ammo truck or dump for tanks with their appropriate calibre needs be on the "must have list".I just wrapped a 2hr30min scenario. I've played very conservative with the ammo with very short arcs, but all Stugs are out of HE. This does not translate well to a 3hr plus game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimpleSimon Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 (edited) You were continuously engaged with enemy forces for a period of over 2 hours and 30 minutes without achieving a major breakthrough? Which scenario was this? Edited January 14, 2020 by SimpleSimon 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StieliAlpha Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Over this period of time, water supply should be an issue (at least in FI), too. But I was told a loooong time ago, this somehow included. Yep, there are limitations to the scope of CM. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimpleSimon Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 (edited) I could just lack some context here...but the StuG only has around 25-28 rounds of HE for its main gun. It's not designed for prolonged combat and not very good at suppressive fire since it lacks a coaxial machine gun. The MG34 on the roof is really just for self-defense since the gunner has to expose himself to fire it. The Ausf D used to have more ammo....but no one liked that version since the short gun it had couldn't defeat tanks easily. The Ausf G came around because the infantry desperately needed more anti-tank capacity but the StuG suffered a commensurate loss in its usefulness as an Assault-Gun because of this due to the larger size of the StuK L/48's shells and the need to stock more AP rounds. This was a particularly acute problem in the Wehrmacht too because supply lines were so stretched most tanks probably couldn't expect ammunition for days or maybe even weeks at a time. Would a resupply mechanic for tanks in the game be nice? Sure. Is it absolutely critical for us to have? I don't think so. Edited January 15, 2020 by SimpleSimon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Mid-Late production StuGs do have a coaxial mahinegun: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimpleSimon Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Thought only the StuG IV had one. Anyway, I don't think it was too handy since it was locked to the gun's narrow traverse, but it was probably requested by crews anyway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Resupplying tanks In order to do this, the designer would have to manipulate the scenario. Since the game allows intra-platoon ammo leveling, keeping one (or more) of the platoon vehicles behind (or out of battle) is the key. Now, I'm not sure if a designer can specify which vehicle of a platoon can enter separately than the others. Say a full-strength platoon has 5 vehicles. The designer could put 4 on-map and have the 5th appear as a reinforcement at the 90 minute mark. It'd be up to the player to pull his platoon back to that vehicle and perform ammo-leveling. The other approach would be to just feed in a reinforcing platoon at the appropriate point in the battle. Neither approach is perfect. It would be far more interesting to have an ammo truck appear for resupply and to bring your vehicles back to it. Long battles, and campaigns with no/limited resupply, bring up a host of issues that affect tactics. No more shooting HE at suspected locations, for example. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 The question is how long does resupply take in RL and whether that would be attempted in a 2-3 hour battle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 6 hours ago, c3k said: Resupplying tanks In order to do this, the designer would have to manipulate the scenario. Since the game allows intra-platoon ammo leveling, keeping one (or more) of the platoon vehicles behind (or out of battle) is the key. Now, I'm not sure if a designer can specify which vehicle of a platoon can enter separately than the others. Say a full-strength platoon has 5 vehicles. The designer could put 4 on-map and have the 5th appear as a reinforcement at the 90 minute mark. It'd be up to the player to pull his platoon back to that vehicle and perform ammo-leveling. The other approach would be to just feed in a reinforcing platoon at the appropriate point in the battle. Neither approach is perfect. It would be far more interesting to have an ammo truck appear for resupply and to bring your vehicles back to it. Long battles, and campaigns with no/limited resupply, bring up a host of issues that affect tactics. No more shooting HE at suspected locations, for example. You're aware vehicles can't ammo level, right? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weapon2010 Posted January 17, 2020 Author Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) The scenario was Right Hook at Sopockinie.I like the idea of keeping a few Stugs back out of action. In a normal 1-2 hr scenario ammo is not an issue , im just pointing out that a 3hr plus game will present challenges in ammo use. Edited January 17, 2020 by weapon2010 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 It would be helpful if a player was able to select the ammo load-out in the SET-UP phase. We've all experienced scenarios where it was obvious the primary function would be HE support, but the load-out is mostly AT. In RL one would think (assume?) that a more appropriate ammo load-out would be SOP. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 5 hours ago, Bulletpoint said: You're aware vehicles can't ammo level, right? Umm...apparently not. I thought that was supposed to work, but I've never tried it. Hmm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combatintman Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 On 1/17/2020 at 10:37 PM, Erwin said: It would be helpful if a player was able to select the ammo load-out in the SET-UP phase. We've all experienced scenarios where it was obvious the primary function would be HE support, but the load-out is mostly AT. In RL one would think (assume?) that a more appropriate ammo load-out would be SOP. Be a bummer if you guessed wrong though wouldn't it? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 @Combatintman, @Attilaforfun, you guys would know,.....Are AFV supply depots/dumps usually organised like a candy store? Pick & mix ammo for all? I'm guessing no. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Combatintman said: Be a bummer if you guessed wrong though wouldn't it? Did you know that during the set up phase one can examine the map and read the briefing? That way one can get a good idea of what sort of mission one is facing. Usually, it's pretty obvious what sort of ammo load out will be needed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attilaforfun Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 No they come out and deliver what they're going to give you. IDK how much that would breakdown in a major conflict. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 2 hours ago, Attilaforfun said: No they come out and deliver what they're going to give you. Figured as much, cheers for confirming it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combatintman Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 19 hours ago, Erwin said: Did you know that during the set up phase one can examine the map and read the briefing? That way one can get a good idea of what sort of mission one is facing. Usually, it's pretty obvious what sort of ammo load out will be needed. I'm vaguely familiar with that concept yes ... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Combatintman said: I'm vaguely familiar with that concept yes ... Thought you intel boys just guessed anyways? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attilaforfun Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 We used to joke that MI had a wheel they'd spin everyday. 'Be on the lookout for a yellow Subaru containing Muhamad Muhamad Ali.' Name and cars were always different. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combatintman Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 On 1/23/2020 at 5:38 PM, Attilaforfun said: We used to joke that MI had a wheel they'd spin everyday. 'Be on the lookout for a yellow Subaru containing Muhamad Muhamad Ali.' Name and cars were always different. Toyota Corolla you mean ... http://community.battlefront.com/topic/126763-winter-mod-for-afghanistan/?do=findComment&comment=1811595 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougPhresh Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 (edited) Loading ammo for a AFV, while not an all-day affair is not something you want to do while in action. For example: Quote The Leopard 1 stores most of it's ammunition in the hull, and is very vulnerable during the transfer of rounds from the secondary storage into the ready racks, as the turret must be rotated to the flank and the vehicle cannot observe or fight. The smaller ammunition allows higher rates of fire than the 120mm armed tanks, and the brass cases afford some protection to the ammunition which the combustible cased 120/125mm rounds lack. Within SB this allows a loaded round to be replaced without being expended first, allowing more suitable ammunition selection when facing multiple target types. That's just moving ammo already on the AFV to the ready rack. Taking on ammo involves a lot of time with your hatches open doing everything but effectively fighting your AFV. Having said that, there are some situations like on-map mortars on the defending side of an assault where I can see a 200% ammo count at scenario start making sense, to simulate having a prepared position. Edited January 26, 2020 by DougPhresh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, DougPhresh said: Having said that, there are some situations like on-map mortars on the defending side of an assault where I can see a 200% ammo count at scenario start making sense, to simulate having a prepared position. Just deploy 'em next to an ammo dump (dismounted mortar supply truck). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 15 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: Just deploy 'em next to an ammo dump (dismounted mortar supply truck). THIS!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weapon2010 Posted January 31, 2020 Author Share Posted January 31, 2020 where do you find a mortar supply truck? i see supply platoons 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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