Bulletpoint Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I'm looking to buy a new computer, and when I do, I will move on from Combat Mission: Battle for Normandy to try some of the other releases. But I don't know if I should go for Fortress Italy, Gustav Line, Market Garden or Red Thunder. Could you give me a brief description of how the campaigns of each theater play out in terms of gameplay and army compositions? For example, I would describe CMBN as something like "US/German Infantry with few tanks, close distance, bocage fields, summer, often puzzle-like "spot, mortar, move on" gameplay. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankster65 Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Or you could just browse the product page for each one and check out listing of features, units etc. It is quite extensive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kohlenklau Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 sounds like wine tasting! "..crisp, with hints of cherry and black oak..." CMRT lots of tanks, big maps, long LOS, summer now but winter with module CMFI mountains, has snow if wanted, interesting forces, not like CMRT or CMBN. Just buy them all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Or you could just browse the product page for each one and check out listing of features, units etc. It is quite extensive. I did read that, but my intention was to ask about the subjective "feel" of each game. How it all comes together in the actual campaigns and missions included. Not too keen on multiplayer or quick battle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baneman Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Tough question - Kohlenkau's description of CMRT is accurate ... unless you end up in forests/woods when major SMG armed Russians make things ...interesting. I haven't had CMFI+GL myself long enough to judge properly, but it gives a taste of non-uber equipment ( funny Italian stuff, PzIII's etc. + learn to cope without Pzschrecks and/or fight Tigers ) and the joy (?) of fighting with a less than stellar TO&E of the Italians ( who can pull out some decent resistance nevertheless if you treat them more carefully ). IMO, Market Garden adds more firepower to the Allied formations otherwise not very different, but it's hard to tell since CMBN is the one product I've kept up to date the longest. CMFI can be more puzzlelike ( esp. if you're playing the Italians or have an Italian component ), but feels very different. More care needed perhaps. CMRT is all about shock and awe ( to borrow the modern term ) - the Russians want to move in fast and blazing to keep the opposition off balance. If the German player can slow them down, it can go very very badly for them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 Tough question - Kohlenkau's description of CMRT is accurate ... unless you end up in forests/woods when major SMG armed Russians make things ...interesting. I haven't had CMFI+GL myself long enough to judge properly, but it gives a taste of non-uber equipment ( funny Italian stuff, PzIII's etc. + learn to cope without Pzschrecks and/or fight Tigers ) and the joy (?) of fighting with a less than stellar TO&E of the Italians ( who can pull out some decent resistance nevertheless if you treat them more carefully ). IMO, Market Garden adds more firepower to the Allied formations otherwise not very different, but it's hard to tell since CMBN is the one product I've kept up to date the longest. CMFI can be more puzzlelike ( esp. if you're playing the Italians or have an Italian component ), but feels very different. More care needed perhaps. CMRT is all about shock and awe ( to borrow the modern term ) - the Russians want to move in fast and blazing to keep the opposition off balance. If the German player can slow them down, it can go very very badly for them. Good answer, thanks. I think I'll go to Italy then. Doing "more with less" sounds good. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niall78 Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Good answer, thanks. I think I'll go to Italy then. Doing "more with less" sounds good. I'm a Eastern Front grog but I have to say I'm back playing CMFI and GL lately and think it is probably the best family balance wise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLSTK Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 A walk in the park. Unless you're the enemy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzz Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 "... I will move on from Combat Mission: Battle for Normandy to try some of the other releases. But I don't know if I should go for Fortress Italy, Gustav Line, Market Garden or Red Thunder...." It would be a shame to sidestep the new modern vintage on offer.... Black Seas My prediction is Black Seas (vintage 2015) will be Big, with a Buttery Bouquet, a Baked Brilliance.... Smooth, Supple, not overly Sweet and a Spicy yet Finessed Finish.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Jack Ripper Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 A few words of wisdom from me: Combat Mission Shock Force: "Oh sh*t the mission briefing DID say I.E.D.s. Whoops. I guess I wasn't using that Abrams anyway." Combat Mission Battle for Normandy: After playing The Blue and the Gray and The Road to Montebourg for three days straight, I emerged from the darkened confines of my bedroom with a thousand-yard stare. I then realized I hadn't eaten for three days. Combat Mission Fortress Italy: It's the one with the Italians in it. That's all I know about that. Combat Mission Red Thunder: This is the one you buy if you're a secret communist, or if you like to shoot communists. Combat Mission Black Sea: If you read Red Storm Rising and think to yourself "I want to do that!" then buy this game! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 It would be a shame to sidestep the new modern vintage on offer.... Black Seas My prediction is Black Seas (vintage 2015) will be Big, with a Buttery Bouquet, a Baked Brilliance.... Smooth, Supple, not overly Sweet and a Spicy yet Finessed Finish.... Maybe so, but I'm not interested in fictional modern conflict. That is, I'm not usually interested in fictional conflicts, and I'm not interested in modern warfare in general. Not saying BS won't be good, just that it's not my cup of tea. If they made Black Seas about the actual conflict in Ukraine, with the Ukrainian Army fighting a group of rebels backed by Russia, then it might be interesting, but I think that would be too controversial right now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzz Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Maybe so, but I'm not interested in fictional modern conflict. That is, I'm not usually interested in fictional conflicts, and I'm not interested in modern warfare in general. Not saying BS won't be good, just that it's not my cup of tea. If they made Black Seas about the actual conflict in Ukraine, with the Ukrainian Army fighting a group of rebels backed by Russia, then it might be interesting, but I think that would be too controversial right now. Understood. You have plenty of great non fictional WWII available. It would be difficult for me to pick one of your candidates Fortress Italy, Gustav Line, Market Garden or Red Thunder. I have them all. I play them all. Having the WWII variety makes for a diversity of gaming enjoyment depending on my mood. Best of luck in your choice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1977 Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Excellent question BulletPoint. Am very glad you asked it as I am in that particular situation right now myself. Limited funds requires me to make sure I buy the correct game so this topic and answers are very interesting to me. I have also read all the product pages and while they are of some use I prefer getting answers from the guys that play the games. Couldn't have worded the question better btw. :-)) Now if I could piggyback the original question I am kinda wondering if either of the add ons to Normandy ( Market Garden/ CommonWealth ) give me a big bang for the bucks or is adding either not really going to change the base game that much? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzz Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Baneman's description is a good one. Normandy Modules, Common Wealth and Market Garden complete the CMBN time frame arena. If you are really into CMBN you can't go wrong with the full package. If you want something different, a more open battlefield with less powerful equipment, Fortress Italy & Gustav Line are a very compelling combination. I enjoy playing CMFI/GL after a heavy engagement in the other games. Red Thunder is interesting because you have powerful WWII equipment for both sides than can make some pretty epic battles in open and urban environments. CMRT just looks really cool too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 in a few words? Best war games ever made by best wargaming company ever. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) CMRT is for Ost Front buffs. doesnt have all the modules that the others have so its not far to compare but it does have two terrain types (Soviet Union and Eastern EU) huge variety of units. and its the Friggin Ost Front. Cmon will yas. Best one. That being said I fell back in love with BN when my buddy Sburke gifted me the modules I didnt have - MG, 3.0 and the battle pack. BN (WITH MG MODULES AND CW MODULE)covers two terrains - france and holland, has Waffen SS, Fallschirmjagers, Kriegsmarine troops, Brits, Canucks, everything. Ost Front will too, but in time, now its Wehrmacht, and Soviet Army. Still, many types of Werhmacht, stragglers etc. Many types of Soviets, including Guards units etc. Air support is different in the games too - realistically in the West Front you can kinda sorta control where your air strikes land, in the East its just roving air support if it shows up at all. And it may hit anything. FI was my least favorite for awhile. Really only Sicily. GL made it a whole new game. It covers the earliest war period in game so far, and has the only winter fighting you'll see so far. Which is really cool. It also really expands the game, going to May 44 from July 43. Monte Cassino, Ortona, Anzio, etc. GL really made FI What it is, not FI. The Italians, for me, were fun for five minutes. Yea I like a challenge, but theyre just not my thing. Edited January 25, 2015 by Sublime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Jack Ripper Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I thought you meant new game, not new module. In all honesty, if you already own CMBN you might as well pick up Commonwealth and Market Garden modules. First of all, they're cheap if you buy the bundle pack, and they hook up with CMBN which you already own anyway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) I thought you meant new game, not new module. Well, either/or. I'm basically asking "where do I go from here". I like the Normandy setting, but I think I've just about had enough bocage for a while now after playing through Road to Montebourg two times and most of the scenarios. Not so much into the entire paratrooper spiel, so Market Garden is out of my list. And I read that the British campaign in the Commonwealth module, "Scottish Corridor", is extremely frustrating... I like a challenge, but replaying a mission over and over to memorise the location of all enemy forces is not really my thing. Not sure if I got the right impression of it. Edited January 26, 2015 by Bulletpoint 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agusto Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 The following is by no means and objective description or analysis but only my subjective perception: CMSF: Coalition forces massacring Syrian forces. Difficulty comes from trying to achieve your goal with minimal casualties. In some of the NATO campaigns you get 4 tanks and a company of mech infantry for 10 battles without reinforcements. Lots of user generated content at the Repository. Engine is not updated to 2.0 or 3.0. CMBN: Close range, bloody bocage-fighting. Stock maps are usually of average size, often with woods and village son them (besides the omnipresent bocage, of course). Lots of user generated content. CMFI: Interesting, unusual units. Mountainous, mediterran terrain. Lots of user generated content, but less than the above two titles. CMRT: Large scale, epic tank and infantry battles. Often huge, flat, open maps. Often you will see long range duels between tanks or soviet human wave tactics. Very bloody. Still relatively new, so there arent as many mods as for the other Cmx2 titles. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 Some very good replies in this thread, very helpful. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Excellent question BulletPoint. Am very glad you asked it as I am in that particular situation right now myself.Well I don't think I have anything to add for @Bulletpoint but based on your discussion about trees being annoying in the CMBN threads I would recommend Fortress Italy - and add on Gustov Line.Lets put it this way CMBN and CMRT I play with trees set to show trunks mode so I can actually see what my guys are up to. With CMFI I have trees fully on and for the most part I do not have to turn them off to see what is what. Edited January 26, 2015 by IanL 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1977 Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Well I don't know what Bulletpoint has decided but it sounds like CMFI is right up my ally. I too appreciate all the replies. They were all very helpful. Some may be asking themselves - why'd he decide that. :-)) Well, I like the lesser powerful tanks, lack of forests or trees and mountains sound fun plus unusual units. That unusual units got me. :-)) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 People sneer at the Italians, but they have the most potent TD on Sicily, and squillions of light mortars. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Well I don't know what Bulletpoint has decided but it sounds like CMFI is right up my ally. I too appreciate all the replies. They were all very helpful. Some may be asking themselves - why'd he decide that. :-)) Well, I like the lesser powerful tanks, lack of forests or trees and mountains sound fun plus unusual units. That unusual units got me. :-)) Another thing that CMFI has, that I like, is winter/snow settings wich creates an entirely different atmosphere/landscape. @womble: which TD is that? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) The http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semovente_90/53Rocketman. 90mm gun is a Sherman killer. O'course, it's an egshell armed with a sledgehammer, but it's a very big hammer... It's also pretty small, and relatively easy to hide.Edit: Note, I'm sure the Germans have better gear once you're into GL content on the mainland, but in Sicily, the 90/53 is to be compared with the US T30 half-track TD and its own little brother the Semovente 47/32 (which is execrable rubbish, and loses fights with HMGs...). Still the 90/53 is the only gun in Sicily that matches up to Tiger armour, that's not German... Edited January 27, 2015 by womble 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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