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Defending in buildings


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Cover is much better in buildings. I noticed it when i tested snipers against tank commander.

I was able to defend buildings with only 3 snipers and 2 Hmgs and had only 2 casualties for one hmg in a soft building. the snipers (2 regular, 1 green) took 22, 17 and 12 men to the attacker and hmg 2 and 10 for a total of 63 casualties !

Then the ai attacked on one flank were i had 1 squad in buildings, same punition with only 2 casualties for me.

It seems that less bullets go through windows.

Buildings offer more cover against light artillery and mortars too.

I played germans against English troops, polish, and US with the same results.

For me, much more realistic. Very hard to attack strong buildings without strong support. I tested in attack with Germans and i won the battle because of arty support and strong firebase + flanking movement of squads.

In general, i think the game is much better with the new module and patch.

Thanks to BFC team for their great work :)

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I've noticed that soldiers bunch up less at windows.

Yes, observing that behavior more and more. But there's a caveat. In interest of absolute realism, a goal to which BFC aspires, lower experience formations- greens, conscripts- *should* crowd the windows in a heedless rush. Suicidal battle noobs that they are. ;)

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Cover is much better in buildings. I noticed it when i tested snipers against tank commander.

I was able to defend buildings with only 3 snipers and 2 Hmgs and had only 2 casualties for one hmg in a soft building. the snipers (2 regular, 1 green) took 22, 17 and 12 men to the attacker and hmg 2 and 10 for a total of 63 casualties !

Then the ai attacked on one flank were i had 1 squad in buildings, same punition with only 2 casualties for me.

It seems that less bullets go through windows.

Buildings offer more cover against light artillery and mortars too.

I played germans against English troops, polish, and US with the same results.

For me, much more realistic. Very hard to attack strong buildings without strong support. I tested in attack with Germans and i won the battle because of arty support and strong firebase + flanking movement of squads.

In general, i think the game is much better with the new module and patch.

Thanks to BFC team for their great work :)

This is great news, Now I need to find a battle to play where there is street fighting and see how hard it will be to clear bldgs. It was a piece of cake before

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Now its bugging me in the other direction! :D

In the scottish Corridor I had 2 platoons of infantry with Brens firing against a german HMG in the roof of a building for more then 10mins and the damn jerries didn't want to leave!

I had to bring up a 6pdr and after 2 HE shots they were persuaded to left the building! :D

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But it's likely they were cowering on the floor. Time for an inf assault?

I just laid a medium/medium 81mm mortar mission on a three storey building where a MG team were position in the attic. After the bombardment none of the 5 or so crew had so much as a scratch on them. Have the buildings been toughened up or just the way soldiers use them?

I remember a bug in CMSF where you couldn't kill troops with artillery through the roofs of buildings.

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Please dont start complaining about how building now offer too much protection. There was a ton of pressure from players to make them better. They wanted them to provide protection, even though it might not be as true as we the player might want to think. There was plenty of data and thoughts about it.

So play with it as it is, let time tell if the new programming makes the game better.

Sounds like it is going to be a bigger challenge to deal with the enemy within buildings . So we are warned, so play appropriately.

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Is there a difference between structures that have been prepared (mouseholes, loopholes etc) and those that are just as they were in civilian days? With time and some basic engineering tools a house can be substantially fortified, farmhouses, in this region were often turned into virtual bunkers and often extracted a high price to be taken.

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I uploaded a scenario months ago that demonstrated, imo, that the hue and cry over 'fire porous' buildings was overblown. Units in modular buildings did more than hold their own although they did crowd around windows. What bugs me a little in my screenshot of the SS team shrugging off the attacking Brit squad is that the German team was in a plain, apparently stucco house. The kind of single family dwelling that WW2 small arms fire should penetrate like Swiss cheese.

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I uploaded a scenario months ago that demonstrated, imo, that the hue and cry over 'fire porous' buildings was overblown. Units in modular buildings did more than hold their own although they did crowd around windows. What bugs me a little in my screenshot of the SS team shrugging off the attacking Brit squad is that the German team was in a plain, apparently stucco house. The kind of single family dwelling that WW2 small arms fire should penetrate like Swiss cheese.

Afaik, the textures on buildings do not correspond to protection. In many cases the same building model can have brick, stone and stucco textures at the scenario designers discretion.

You could, however, have stucco over brick or stone, so even there you can't assume poor protection.

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I really like the additional cover that buildings provide. When playing against AI, many British pixletruppen lost their 1's and 0's in discovering this the hard way.

However, does anyone know if this also applies to wooden buildings. (I'm too lazy to make a test myself because I'm not very good at the scenario editor)

I like the additional cover for concrete and especially stone buildings ... but I wouldn't want it to be that way for wooden barns and structures of that sort.

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I ran some tests several months ago on the value of buildings for cover. I used individual buildings only. I found that several buildings provided good cover and several buildings didn't. In fact some buildings were so bad that a squad was better off laying down in the open. The problem is to identify the building before you use it or attack it. The realism is there there is just an identification problem. I doubt it that BF changed anything building structure wise. The troops don't bunch up at the windows with the patch v1.10 and the scenario designers selected a more bullet proof building for the new scenarios. At least thats what I think happened.

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