Jonny(FGM) Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 Actually after a bit of playing in RT (WEGO player myself) in CMBN i have discovered a behaviour change in the blast command. I ran a breach team up the bocage and then plotted a blast command accross the bocage on the side i was currently on, the blasted a hole then ran away! Tried the same thing in CMSF and they just ran away with no hole made, interesting 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haggard Sketchy Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 That's odd, RT in my experience has the same quick order across the obstacle. The "Busting the Bocage" briefing describes a tactic of using a rhino and then a breach team on the same hedge...this confuses me. What's the point of explosives when a rhino already went through? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunnergoz Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 I have seen two nice videos of the real thing in action but they are from a commercial site selling videos so I cannot post them here. I simply googled "Cullin hedgerow cutter video." The first video shows ordnance troops building and installing the cutters on an M-4 and then the M-4 busting through a hedgerow with it. The second video starts with artillery but quickly switches to an M-5 light with the Cullins cutter trying its hand at a hedgerow. The much lighter M-5 clearly has its work cut out for it compared to the Sherman. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Amherst Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Technically possible, but extremely risky. Not only did it expose the tank's belly, but there was a very high chance of immobilization. AIUI, attempting this was strongly discouraged. That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunnergoz Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. You'd think someone's life depended upon the answer. "Everyone stand clear - I'm waiting for an answer from the oracle!" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. Sorry; I didn't realize we had a Ph.D in WWII Military History in the room. Please, do carry on and elucidate the rest of us. And the more bolding you use to make your point, the better; that way it's very clear to the rest of us just how smart you are. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadekster88 Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. Good job coming across like a jerk if that's what you were attempting to do. Fact 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiram Sedai Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. Lord knows that bolding makes me a bit tingly and I do love rampant egocentricity but I'd respectfully remind you that I remember Fionn and you are no Fionn. Tell me to stay out too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Here's a couple photos to remind up precisely what we're discussing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 That is not the point, stop making excuses! I sent a large infantry force over the low bocage, the area was clear, the Sherman would not cross the low bocage. It is a Glitch. Stop making excuses for Real Problems. The fanbois on this forum do more harm then good. If you don't know the answer stay out of the discussion. If You don't work for BFC, don't answer for BFC. Do not excuse away Real Game Problems with pseudo-history you Know Nothing about. In Normandy in June-July 1944 M4 Shermans did indeed cross low bocage if it was proven clear and safe. Fact. Medication wearing off again? We told you to refill the prescription! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuka Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Marshall Butthurts you're my hero 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetchez la Vache Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Why not make it possible for non-Rhino tanks to cross low bocage but make it very slooooooow and with a significant probability of bogging? If I understand the problem, it's the earthbank part of the bocage that causes AFV's trouble whereas it's the hedgerow that causes infantry trouble. In which case we could perhaps do with 4 different types of bocage: 1) Low hedgerow, with earthbank 2) High hedgerow, with earthbank 3) Low hedgerow only 4) High hedgerow only ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Hi, simple old guy request ... what's the best method for blowing tank-sized holes in bocage in the tutorial? A simple point by point explanation of the best one or two methods please would be most helpful, if someone could help me out, thanks! I think the reasons there are no Bocage-busting tools in the tutorial are: You don't need them. There are enough gaps for you to be able to advance without them against the opposition in this scenario if you apply any suppressive fire. Having Rhinos would make it toooo easy on the right. The claustrophobia of the Bocage would be mostly missing. Having people try and use demo charges in the introductory scenario would be cruel and wicked 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glukx Ouglouk Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 @ Fetchez: I don't think there's really a need for 4 different types in Normandy - AFAIK, the bocage hedgerows there pretty much always have some sort of earthbank anyway. I guess that bocage hedgerows without earthbanks might be useful in some other places though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Here's a couple photos to remind up precisely what we're discussing. MikeyD This is probably an example of the worst you might find - which I thought ought to be compared to MikeyD' example of the lesser bocage hedge. So when people talk about Cuilin plows busting the bocage just bear in mind that it is perhaps an overstatment or possibly a convenient piece of propaganda and that the real benefits came from improved tactics and infantry armour co-operation. A training issue? One CO saying there were 34 hedges to bust in a 1.5mile advance and I suspect a mix of heights depths and widths would be found. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodin Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Not sure if it's mentioned but you do have to get the camera low to see the hole...I was pounding away thinking nothing had happened utnill I gave up and gave my infnatry a move command and they ran through a hole I couldn't see... Oh and the remark by Marshal Amherst is precisely why I'm trying to avoid this forum...I do see many bans on people in the near furture...shame....a great community here pre demo...I only hope it stays that way.....but I'm having my doubts... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Oooo! I wonder if that's what happened to me? I would love a "simplify bocage" button. Sometimes when I task-swap back to CMBN, the bocage is all drawn as flat green walls with gaps at the holes, till the graphics card catches up. It'd be great to be able to select that way of drawing it at will, so you can see where the holes are... GaJ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvthudson Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 Do you put the area target right on TOP of the bocage graphical image or before it? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glukx Ouglouk Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 Oooo! I wonder if that's what happened to me? I would love a "simplify bocage" button. Sometimes when I task-swap back to CMBN, the bocage is all drawn as flat green walls with gaps at the holes, till the graphics card catches up. It'd be great to be able to select that way of drawing it at will, so you can see where the holes are... GaJ You can change the 3D model detail level on-the-fly with some keyboard shortcuts (though I don't remember what they are by default, I changed mine in the shortcut.txt file). If you lower the detail level and set the camera to look from relatively far away, everything will be nice and blocky. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theFightingSeabee Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 I have found that if you put your Blast command line across the bocage at an oblique angle, you will usually blast a hole big enough for a tank with only one charge! Also, as soon as the explosion occurs, just cancel the movement order and your engineers won't run to the other side of the bocage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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