Wild third game speculation. Space Lobsters!

[Sequoia]

Say that the third game will, in fact, be science fiction. Maybe Battlefront hasn't decided, but I know they're thinking about it. What sort of sci-fi setting would you like to see? Something like Drop Team? Something based on a license such as Starship Troopers? (The book, not the movie). Any one ever play the board game Bughunter Sniper, something like that? Please no Star Wars of Star Trek suggestions. Such licenses would cost a fortune and the ground combat in those was dumb anyway. What other science fiction that you know of gave a good ground combat model?

[Roter Stern]

Actually all the "decent" Scifi franchises I can think of already have a Strategy Game associated with them ... perhaps Space Lobsters it is...

[imported_mike_the_wino2]

Originally posted by Sequoia:

Please no Star Wars of Star Trek suggestions. Such licenses would cost a fortune and the ground combat in those was dumb anyway.

And who would take 'guy in red shirt' unit versus the uber-Spock unit? Load up on McCoys and Kirks FTW!!!!!

[orwell]

Pretend this is on a space camp, or something. They're aliens, close enough right?

[Other Means]

I can't think of a single Sci-Fi book that would have interesting infantry combat in.

For a grand strategy/ship combat game something from Larry Niven's Known Space would be good.

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by Sequoia:

Say that the third game will, in fact, be science fiction. Maybe Battlefront hasn't decided, but I know they're thinking about it. What sort of sci-fi setting would you like to see? Something like Drop Team? Something based on a license such as Starship Troopers? (The book, not the movie). Any one ever play the board game Bughunter Sniper, something like that? Please no Star Wars of Star Trek suggestions. Such licenses would cost a fortune and the ground combat in those was dumb anyway. What other science fiction that you know of gave a good ground combat model?

I had all the TSR redos of Sniper! except for Bughunter. I did have Wreck of the BSM Pandora, though, which I seem to recall was something similar?

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by The Louch:

Actually all the "decent" Scifi franchises I can think of already have a Strategy Game associated with them ... perhaps Space Lobsters it is...

Why not kill two birds with one stone?

Create your own sci-fi backstory to interest new fans to the CM line.

And at the same time, introduce elements into the storyline to explain away the deficiencies in the CM engine. Sounds perfect. Why do my space lobsters run around their hovercars three times before getting in? How come the space lobsters won't go in through the windows? Having a sci-fi theme means you can explain away all that stuff a lot more elegantly than is the case currently. I mean now, we all have real world experience that tells us it is dumb to see troops shooting through walls, or into berms, or running straight into machine gun fire, or whatever, but in a fictional environment, you can make up explanations for all that which won't assault anyone's intelligence.

Should make it a contest, really. I'll look forward to seeing some ideas posted here.

[M1A1TC]

Id love to see a game based on 3DSF, what was renamed into Ma.K ZbV3000

Here are some links

http://www.fluency.paintedtarget.org/sf3d/

http://www.roboterkampf.com/roboterhtml/htmlmakvis/

http://www006.upp.so-net.ne.jp/Ma_A/

[FAI]

I was hoping for something worthy of the venerable X-COM's successor.

[RuhrRiver]

I wish the world wouldn't give up on Starship Troopers...it wasn't Heinlein's fault that the movie bit the big one. I thought the Avalon Hill board game of starship troopers showed its potential...I'm sure Charles is itching to take his crack at ST and we should give him room!

Right...

[missinginreality]

i used to play the boardgame of Aliens after being such a huge fan of the series [though 3 and 4 were a bot of a let down]. What I liked about Aliens [the second one] was the juxtaposition of SF and the marines - like, a funky drop ship combined with a wheeled grungy APC, projectile weapons not beam weapons, basic helmets but sci-fi video coms, simple body armour, that kind of thing. i reckon a marines based thing like this would be fun but also tactical too.

[Panzerfest]

Originally posted by missinginreality:

i used to play the boardgame of Aliens after being such a huge fan of the series [though 3 and 4 were a bot of a let down]. What I liked about Aliens [the second one] was the juxtaposition of SF and the marines - like, a funky drop ship combined with a wheeled grungy APC, projectile weapons not beam weapons, basic helmets but sci-fi video coms, simple body armour, that kind of thing. i reckon a marines based thing like this would be fun but also tactical too.

There is a book called 'Aliens: Colonial Marines Technical Manual' which is very detailed and goes into many weapon systems including armour, SP arty, and AT weapons not shown in the movie. All are really believably designed with many great diagrams and tech specs including armour values also there are little snippets describing potential OPFOR scenarios. It would be a great reference to create a tactical wargame.

That said the Aliens license probly would cost a fair bit but damn its's one of my fav movies and I would love to see Battlefront tackle it the US Colonial Marines!

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by Sequoia:

Say that the third game will, in fact, be science fiction. Maybe Battlefront hasn't decided, but I know they're thinking about it. What sort of sci-fi setting would you like to see?

Well, if you are doing market research, my answer would be "none".

[missinginreality]

Originally posted by Panzerfest:

There is a book called 'Aliens: Colonial Marines Technical Manual' which is very detailed and goes into many weapon systems including armour, SP arty, and AT weapons not shown in the movie.

oh man oh man oh man i gotta get that. Along with some of that Arcturian poontang

Yup Colonial Marines setting would be the go for me.just the right mix of old vs new y'know? And orbital strikes to boot hehehehe. As long as AI arty WAD's !

[Elmar Bijlsma]

Originally posted by FAI:

I was hoping for something worthy of the venerable X-COM's successor.

That would be good.

[Splinty]

I'd like something like the Manticorian Marines from the Honor Harrington series, Powered armor, plasma rifles, anti-grav HALO drops and big spacecraft to boot!

[Peter Cairns]

The problem with almost everything mentioned is that the combat in most of these novels and films is like in bad WW2 movies.

Saying make it like "Starship Troopers" is a bit like saying the next CM module after Normandy should be "Where Eagles Dare".

I like CM because it's a pretty realistic representation of combat, so given that most Sci fi combat isn't very realistic there would be the real possibility of a contradiction.

I'd go for as original a format as they could come up with and start with the combat and game system and then create the aliens to fit.

The difficulty is to try to create a balance without it being like CM only with Earth as the Syrians.

It's unlikely that we will ever meet Aliens let alone be invaded and it's even more remote that two civilisations would meet who were evenly matched.

I quite like the idea from Starship Troopers of the Aliens being spores or eggs that just seed over millions of years and have them arrive about 2020, so that we could have updated versions of what we have now versus something really alien.

Peter.

[Michael Dorosh]

Interesting points Peter. I would add that it is far easier to come up with new technologies than it is to come up with realistic tactics to use them credibly. Just ask George Lucas. Or for that matter, any commissioned officer who fought in the US Civil War.

[SlapHappy]

Yaquinto's Marine:2002 simulated a fairly realistic space-type warfare based around moon colonization.......Soviet vs. US.

Obviously in 1979 (when the game was published) they had a somewhat ambitious view of technological advancement.

Still a great game, though.

[Dave H]

Originally posted by Michael Dorosh:

Why not kill two birds with one stone?

Create your own sci-fi backstory to interest new fans to the CM line.

And at the same time, introduce elements into the storyline to explain away the deficiencies in the CM engine. Sounds perfect. Why do my space lobsters run around their hovercars three times before getting in? How come the space lobsters won't go in through the windows? Having a sci-fi theme means you can explain away all that stuff a lot more elegantly than is the case currently. I mean now, we all have real world experience that tells us it is dumb to see troops shooting through walls, or into berms, or running straight into machine gun fire, or whatever, but in a fictional environment, you can make up explanations for all that which won't assault anyone's intelligence.

Should make it a contest, really. I'll look forward to seeing some ideas posted here.

Michael, I think I remember the perfect game to take advantage of the CMSF AI. Return to the giddy days of 1979 when Metagaming introduced their pocket games. OGRE was #01. That's not the game. The one I'm thinking of is RIVETS which was #05. Here's the description:

HERE COME THE ROBOTS....OOPS! BOPPERS were mass produced robotic war machines. When the final war ended they were all that was left. Everyone was dead; but, the BOPPERS kept on fighting. After all, with the intelligence of can openers what could you expect. RIVETS is a two player tactical level science fiction game of robotic warfare in the 22nd century. Players select their robot armies, set their programs, and send them out to destroy the enemy computer complex. RIVETS is fast playing and easy to learn with a humorous style. Games are quick even if the robots are a bit dumb.

Don't you think the AI could handle simulating robots with the intelligence of a can opener?

[Michael Dorosh]

For once, DaveH, you and I may agree. Was that the one advertised in comic books with a drawing of an M-16 being fired in a college hallway by an automated machine of some kind? I vaguely remember such an advert but can't recall at all what the ad was for - just remember how well drawn the M-16 was and how the artist was obviously a "rivet man" given the number of expended 5.56mm shell casings he chose to depict...

[SlapHappy]

I had RIVETS. That game definitely had a sense of humor.

[SlapHappy]

Or they could go in the other direction...technology-wise

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/69419

[abneo3sierra]

I would vote for continued realism vs sci-fi. If they could produce a sci-fi title without taking anything away from their main audience, I would say go for it though. However, they would likely not be able to do that, as any dollars and time spent on the one, by the nature of the business, probably come from the other.

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by abneo3sierra:

I would vote for continued realism vs sci-fi. If they could produce a sci-fi title without taking anything away from their main audience, I would say go for it though. However, they would likely not be able to do that, as any dollars and time spent on the one, by the nature of the business, probably come from the other.

They've already stated that keeping their "main audience" is not a concern, so your concerns seem misplaced. CM:SF's change of focus was a deliberate attempt to attract a broader consumer base with the admitted sacrifice of existing customers, so why stop there?