Kwazydog Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 x13th, as I mentioned, chances are you already own 95% of these 'new' CMBO graphics. Guys to be totally honest if youve got CMBO and modded it, chances are that your happier with it than you would be with this new version of CMBO anyways, as everyone has their own mods and styles that they like. You arent missing out on anything, but if you really want your CMBO to look like this new version, all you need to do it to renumber and copy some sounds from CMBB to CMBO...thats about it, hehe. Our only goal here was to bring CMBO up to a similar standard as CMBB, not to totally retexture the game as that would have taken months and that time is certainly better spent on the new engine me thinks. Dan PS : Hehe, yeah Im on a roll...Ive just had a coffee! [ April 23, 2003, 07:16 PM: Message edited by: KwazyDog ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
li Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Well if its just money and not real customers you want, put some RTS graphics on the box then. I think that CMBO is a flawed game. It is not representative of what 'Combat Mission' is anymore. BTS has made many a speech about ethics, the game industry, etc. I really hope they reconsider this move. I would not want a lot of binge buyers out there saying the game sucked. I have a feeling that as many will dislike it as get hooked on it. Face it, this is a niche market and unless you got the war bug to begin with, it isn't your cuppa joe. After all the grand-standing and pontificating put out by BTS, this really does not sit well with me. One has to be careful with marketing people. They have a funny way of laughing real hard at your jokes and whispering non-sense in your ears. Yeah it does irk me I guess. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerDog Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Originally posted by KwazyDog: Guys to be totally honest if youve got CMBO and modded it, chances are that your happier with it than you would be with this new version of CMBO anyways, as everyone has their own mods and styles that they like. You arent missing out on anything, but if you really want your CMBO to look like this new version, all you need to do it to renumber and copy some sounds from CMBB to CMBO...thats about it, hehe. True, but the way I looked at it was simpler. If I can help and motivate a small six person business to continue to develop and sell a specific genre of game style, that gives me untold hours a week of really enjoyable entertainment value with a great bunch of PBEM people, then I have no problems contributing to their continue fiscal health by buying a second, or even a third box. Heck, I'll give it to my grandson... of course, he's only two years old, but at least it will give me a PBEM opponent I can finally beat. I realize that not everyone can financially do that, but I think that everyone here contributes to something we all enjoy in their own way. Some do great mods, some do fabulous technical research and post here, some answer questions from newbies and help them learn the game, while I just take all of that and benefit from everyone. So, I have no problem giving a something back that I can afford, in the hopes that CMAK and CM 2 continue making our Combat Mission gaming world a whole lot more fun for several years to come. Regards, Badger 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSulo Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Maybe I missed it, but will you put CMX2 in retail too? And CMAK for that matter? After a few months (4 maybe?) of online sales in that case, I bet. That's what I would do. I "always" said you would/should go retail, glad to see I was right. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Li, err, Im not really sure what your problem is here as you havnt made a clear argument other than it 'irks' you...fair enough as evenone is entitled to their own descision, but its not a solid foundation for a argument against our descisions. This move has of course been taken to reach more customers. This is what we have done across Europe where CMBO was EXTREMELY well recieved with no great outcry that the game 'sucked'...so why shouldnt we take the extra step and place it on the shelves in the US. If you were making such comments before we placed CMBO on the shelves in Europe I guess you may have a point to make, but all we are doing is taking another step in an ongoing process. There is no great conspiricy here, which is what you seem to be looking for. Its your right to feel CMBO is a flawed game, but as far we, thousands of customers and dozens of great magazine reviews are concerned, it aint. These new customers we are reaching out too can base their descisions on these reviews plus our demo...we arent pulling the wool over anyones eyes and we arent violating our ethics. BadgerDog, thanks for the support, it all really does make a difference ! I hope you do find some new enjoyment in CMBO. I know Ive been enjoying playing it again, hehe. Solo...I honestly have no idea if or when CMAK may be on the shelves, I mainly came in here to answer a couple of questions about textures, hehe. Dan 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
li Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 The fact that extra work is going into CMBO is what really irks me. Its really just a glitz-over too. Its not like someone said "Oh No! We have 8000 CDROMs leftover from that last run, lets unload them on the shelves!" (I would see nothing wrong with this). The fact is that fresh runs of this old product are deliberately being aimed at the wargaming market. I just read the Manifesto. hmmmm. Maybe it needs to be edited. Anyway, suppose its seen that the in-store-CMBB has CMAK type improvements. Multiturreted russian tanks, russian dust, better whatevers. These features not being downloadable to the online-bought CMBB guys due to incompatability. This would irk some people I hope. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNoobie Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 well im cool with it just as long you guys arent planning to upgrade CMBO with CMBB eye candy ie tall grass, scary MG's blah blah blah or i r be angry :mad: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Li, Id like to respond and discuss why you feel the way you do, but as with your previous posts you fail to tell us what your point or reasoning actually is. It makes we wonder what the motivation of your posts really are. CMBO has no new coding, this has been stated, and is being offered at a considerably discounted price because it is an older product. The work that went into it was enough to bring it up closer to a graphical and audio standed of CMBB, thats it. People out there can try our demo, read the reviews and make up their being if they want to buy it...we are not holding guns to their heads as you seem to think we are. If we released CMBB into reatil with those new features you mentioned then yes, I could understand people being concerned. The fact of the matter is that this wont happen as this is not something we would do to our fans. If we did add code changes then guess what, it would be a free download for all. We are simply adding to an ongoing process of getting CM to as many fans out there as possible. MrNoobie, dont worry, we wont be adding such things We would love to add all of CMBB's tweaks and offer it as a free download, but unfortuantely this would take months of work. Once we revisit the western front though, expect a lot more! Dan [ April 23, 2003, 10:51 PM: Message edited by: KwazyDog ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
li Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 REEEAAD MYYY LIIIIPPPPS no new taxes. Hey Kwaz. I just feel like yankin some chain. You seem like a nice enough bloke and being a spin doctor-nebelwerfer-butt ain't your strong suit. No offense. CMBO is a retro move. I wouldn't buy it. Not gonna do it. If its on shelves and people buy it, and BTS needs the money, well; more power to you. If you can't see how it irks me and others thats OK too. I think CMAK is a good idea. I would even say just leave it in Afrika and I would buy it. CMX2 is always a good idea. CMBB on shelves is cool too. Heck, if CMAK improvements can be back coded to CMBB, I might even buy it off the shelf maybe. BUT CMBO? Bleh. Must be the money... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nippy Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 If we released CMBB into retail with those new features you mentioned then yes, I could understand people being concerned. I think what people are afraid of is BTS falling into trap of the "Capcom" syndrome. Countless sequals of the same subject re-hashed over and over again with no real inovation in either gameplay: "See, we put the Zombies in dinosaur costumes! Are we not cutting edge!? Come on, we stuck in some extra cut scenes, isn't that worth another $50?" And lets not forget the infamious early release the game and then six months later comeing out with the "Complete" version and chargeing full price for it. Now has BTS done this? No way! CMBB was a huge leap forward with things like the death clock, improved machine guns, more realistic infantry, and a time span that covered the entire war. Now, I have my reservations about CMAK. But if it has even half the new features that CMBB did, I'll by it in a minute. CMBO is a retro move. And just what is wrong with retro? Here's the thing. Take an old copy of the outdated CM:BO and stick it next to any *ahem* 'War game' on the shelf today. Real War? Sudden Strike 2? Warcraft III? Puts it in a new light doesn't it? The average consumer hasn't been exposed to any mass market wargame since Steel Panthers came out. Also, the some of the "average joes" are interested in more serious war games. Operation Flashpoint has sold over 1 million copies world wide and has a stong mission and mod making community 2 years after release. Even the ill fated and ever nerfed WWII Online, which sold itself as a realistic war simulator, has over 10,000 people trying to log onto the server on the first day. Both the demand and market are there. BTS would be fools not to take advantage of it. After all there is still a reason that you can download ROMS of X-Com UFO Defense in all its turn based glory. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsven Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 I use an iMac. The retail product is not for me. But I will purchase the product and give it to someone who can use it. Why? I have gotten such pleasure from both CM's, that this would be my way of thanking the creators. I wish to also emphasize that I want CMAK and future games to be playable on the Apple operating systems. Old Sven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffsmith Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 OldSven Nominated for Ultimate Lurker Status 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 It was long suspected, but tonight we decided to do some digging: Li = Username (Lewis) Dodging the ban again, which is no surprise since most who are banned make multiple attempts (even if they claim this place is for weenies ) The new incarnation of Lewis is by far the best one of the bunch, but rules are rules and therefore once again (3rd time or 4th, I forget) banned. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevermind Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Originally posted by jeffsmith: OldSven Nominated for Ultimate Lurker Status And then some,almost exaclty one year to the day(missed it by one day!!) since his last post 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gredeker Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Originally posted by KwazyDog: Most people are happy to be able to pick up older titles at a great price which they have missed in the past. Dan Yep. I buy a good chunk of my games from the bargain bin at Costco. I've purchased X-Wing Alliance, Need For Speed: Porsche Unleashed, and most recently Freedom Force there, all for under $15. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vedder Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Any chance of beefing up the CMBB retail edition with the strat guide thrown in? I can't see how you guys can make a SE version of cmbb , as its pretty much damn perfect as is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 If the decision would have been made to bring CMBO up to CMBB/CMAK standards (I expected that to happen after CMAK) everybody would have been happy and delighted to pay the full price for it... And people asked for it often enough. All in all a strange decision. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Guys, thanks for all of the support! Vedder...interesting idea, Ill have to run that past the guys though Im not sure it would fit on the shelf, hehe. Aragorn, that unfortunately isnt possible as it would take months of work to take CMBB's enhancements back into CMBO. Id like to see this too actually, as I really enjoy the Western Front, but I think that maybe you may be missing the point here. All we are doing is releasing CMBO onto the US retail maket at a budget price....the same as has been done with older Quake or Unreal releases or for instance. There is nothing all that strange about that, and no hidden agendas. Dan [ April 24, 2003, 02:01 AM: Message edited by: KwazyDog ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miller41 Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 I happen to think that having CMBO available retail will get more wargamers into what I think is the best WW2 simulation around. I know that when I see someone in EB looking at it and wondering if its worth the price i will speak up for the gameplay and innovation for sure. The more people exposed to this product the more wargamers will buy it. And once they try CMBO and realize CMBB is coming they will be hooked, just like all of us here. I have spent alot of money on computer games that have left my hard drive after one week, your games are still there after 100s of games played!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Okay, I accept that and will stop moaning. I hope you guys make loads of money, so you can take your games to an even higher level. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jKMkIII Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 About fitting strategy guide to shelf, and real manual in future releases, you could take a look at for example Ghost Recon Complete box. It has neat little box that contains 2 normal DVD cases and takes pretty much same space as 2 normal DVD cases ...so it isn't huge like those old time retail boxes. So you can put those in same shelf as normal DVD case sized boxes, but you could fit real manual/strategy guide into it. So wouldn't get complaints about not including real manual And about whole retail thing. I think it is good idea, I have friend who I talked into ordering CMBO&BB pack some months ago and he accused me after he got hooked too much and took too many PBEM games If game would have been on shelfes earlier he propably would have bought it long time ago, and I am sure there are still lot people like him out there in US. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abn Air Cav Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 This sounds like a positive move in a new direction, I'm pleased to hear it! Myself, I still PBEM CMBO alongside CMBB, and enjoy it. Originally posted by KwazyDog: CMBO has no new coding, this has been stated, and is being offered at a considerably discounted price because it is an older product. The work that went into it was enough to bring it up closer to a graphical and audio standed of CMBB, thats it. FWIW, I sure wish there was some way to use this as an opportunity bring the DirectX 5.x API calls (or whatever they are) up to today's reality, too. Since this would also benefit CMAK (which I'm really looking forward to! :cool: ) I personally see this as a big benefit, not just propping up an "old" game. I know it's the hardware vendors' fault that they are not fully supporting the older DirectX 5 calls that are officially still in the newest DirectX's, but the end result is the same ... even if it is just a lack of fog, as in ATI's case. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Balaban Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Originally posted by BadgerDog: Excellent news ....... :eek: I'll have to buy another copy to help the cause when it hits the stores .... Regards, Badger Me to 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgsan Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 Originally posted by KwazyDog: MrNoobie, dont worry, we wont be adding such things We would love to add all of CMBB's tweaks and offer it as a free download, but unfortuantely this would take months of work. Once we revisit the western front though, expect a lot more! Allright, might this be a subtle hint about the subject of the mysterious CMX2! I would assume that here in the States, as well as in a good portion of Western Europe, the Western front has the widest marketing appeal and would make sense for the first game with the new engine. If so, I hope they include the early war campaigns on the West Front as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNoobie Posted April 24, 2003 Share Posted April 24, 2003 DING DING DING! sounds like a hint to me you fell for my elaborate yet clumsy rant Kwazydog! i kid i kid 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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