Berlin CMRT Map

[Lucky_Strike]

1 hour ago, RockinHarry said:

More fun with flavors. Ammo dump and assorted weaponry

great! RockinHarry's Rubbish Mod 

[Warts 'n' all]

1 hour ago, RockinHarry said:

Yup, that makes sense. Some shredded or none at all as optional variation set maybe.

"Never Mind the Flags. Here's the Bolleaux." As Jamie Reid, almost said.

 

[RockinHarry]

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

great! RockinHarry's Rubbish Mod 

True. All my latest lil experiments are based on rubbish.

But could also have exported/saved the ammodump composition as original ammo dump. There´s the light and heavy versions. The first containing just smallarms ammo with the other containing the heavier stuff (shreks, shells etc). Both look the same from the outside (same model & texture) but one could garnish them like the rubbish dump. So you can see at a glance what´s in there. Just some eye candy off course. 

[RockinHarry]

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Hehe, I should have a big check list of stuff to remember before I export a model.

Yup, one can´t keep it all in old brains all the time.

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Trouble is there's sometimes a complete lack of consistency - with my Panzer IV bunker I've been religious about keeping the metadata of the original intact, and so far have been successful with that, except one annoying bug has appeared - the hatches will not open correctly, they fly off through a big 180º arc ending up about 5m under the model.  Absolutely unexplainable - I never touched them, and the same thing happens on a fresh import/export. I've seen stuff like this in BF originals reported as bugs so it's not unique to me.

Just had these bits of trouble with the Faust and MG42 model. Both have a number of (sub) parts that are used for animation as well. Haven´t yet quite figured out where to append what correctly. While it looked all okay in Blender, in CM certain parts just vanished (or maybe were pulled underground as you say). Guess it´s related to certain pivotal or center points maybe hidden in META. Or not setting Blenders Transform orientation correctly before moving/turning stuff. At last I deleted the troublesome childs, as well as unneeded muzzle points. lol 

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

I have managed to at least get the commander's hatch back to looking better when opened, it's opening to the side rather than the rear of the cupola. This was only after a lot of trial and error moving the hatch's origin around.

Aargh... things like that are a heavy burden on nerves and motivation. Cool you got through it til it "worked".

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Another example. The locomotive, didn't touch the base model Protze other than to parent the loco model with it, no hope of exporting it with metadata, just refused to work.

Yup vehicle models seem most sensitive in all regards. Think there always got to be something meaningful in each components META ~70 data fields in order to get it all saved without Blender throwing errors. (and get nothing saved at all)

4 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

I think a key to this Blender work is baby steps. Do one thing save it, make sure it exports and test the model. It's tedious but saves much heartache and head scratching. Also set Blender to have a big undo history and save automatic backups.

Exactly that. Before I learned that, I was lucky to find Blender has a recover last session/autosave function. Also the great CNTRL-Z became my best friend (again).

[Lucky_Strike]

24 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

True. All my latest lil experiments are based on rubbish.

But importantly NOT rubbish.

I really like the unloaded Panzerfaust.

I was looking at some of the piles of debris and thinking it would be quite nice to have a more spread out version, more like a scattering of bricks and bits of smashed wood etc, great for littering roads and other flat areas. Could be based on something like the lettuces flavor object, something that doesn't offer any cover or hinder movement. Would add a bit of interest and 3D to areas around smashed up buildings and complement the existing textures.

[RockinHarry]

4 hours ago, Warts 'n' all said:

"Never Mind the Flags. Here's the Bolleaux." As Jamie Reid, almost said.

 

me no grasp, me german. But I like that grim looks. lol Think CM dusk or dawn with haze or fog setting should come close to this.

Edited October 23, 2022 by RockinHarry

[RockinHarry]

18 minutes ago, Lucky_Strike said:

But importantly NOT rubbish.

I really like the unloaded Panzerfaust.

I was looking at some of the piles of debris and thinking it would be quite nice to have a more spread out version, more like a scattering of bricks and bits of smashed wood etc, great for littering roads and other flat areas. Could be based on something like the lettuces flavor object, something that doesn't offer any cover or hinder movement. Would add a bit of interest and 3D to areas around smashed up buildings and complement the existing textures.

Yup, just kidding as well. Anyway... I´m just experimenting and the stuff I release is for those who like doing the same. (learning Blender and learning CM related modding stuff).

The Faust came out this way for the mentioned troubles with component parts. Wanted it beeing put onto the boxes in assembled version, but couldn´t get it working.

Yeah adding variation and complementary stuff where desired. I want as much dirty devastation and disorder on my battlefields as possible. Unless it´s @George MC making maps I find the stock game ones pretty boring and rather unimaginative most the times. Sorry I got to say that. I very rarely look at and play stock game maps/missions for long time, so I might have missed lots of the better ones maybe.

Edited October 23, 2022 by RockinHarry

[Lucky_Strike]

10 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

Just had these bits of trouble with the Faust and MG42 model. Both have a number of (sub) parts that are used for animation as well. Haven´t yet quite figured out where to append what correctly. While it looked all okay in Blender, in CM certain parts just vanished (or maybe were pulled underground as you say). Guess it´s related to certain pivotal or center points maybe hidden in META. Or not setting Blenders Transform orientation correctly before moving/turning stuff. At last I deleted the troublesome childs, as well as unneeded muzzle points. lol 

Do you use the Object > Apply > Location and Object > Apply > Rotation commands? With an object selected, one which you have moved, using these two commands seems to fix most of the jumping issues. It resets the origin and confirms your transformations. Object > Apply > Rotation & Scale is also useful but I find that really only works properly on newly imported NON CM textures, stuff one has found online for example. Applying Rotation & Scale to CM items that have been manipulated can actually wreck things like action points and undo work.

18 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

Aargh... things like that are a heavy burden on nerves and motivation. Cool you got through it til it "worked".

It's a real pain. Took me ages to figure out where the hatch was disappearing to; it would spin off like a frisbee. I had to put the Pz IV on a bridge in the end to see where it had gone. Have only fixed the commanders hatch as I figured the only reason the rest of the hatches are going to be opened is when the bunker is hit and the crew bail out, then it just looks like the hatches were blown off.

22 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

Yup vehicle models seem most sensitive in all regards. Think there always got to be something meaningful in each components META ~70 data fields in order to get it all saved without Blender throwing errors. (and get nothing saved at all)

Getting anything out of Blender becomes a game of chance! 

23 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

Exactly that. Before I learned that, I was lucky to find Blender has a recover last session/autosave function. Also the great CNTRL-Z became my best friend (again).

For sure!

[Lucky_Strike]

4 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

The Faust came out this way for the mentioned troubles with component parts. Wanted it beeing put onto the boxes in assembled version, but couldn´t get it working.

Happy accident 

5 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

Yeah adding variation and complementary stuff where desired. I want as much dirty devastation and disorder on my battlefields as possible. Unless it´s @George MC making maps I find the stock game ones pretty boring and rather unimaginative most the times. Sorry I got to say that. I very rarely look at and play stock game maps/missions for long time, so I might have missed lots of the better ones maybe.

So true. War is a very messy business! George's maps are excellent; I just spend hours wandering around his maps enjoying how well made they are. I'm always thinking about ways to add more detritus to maps, simply can't get enough of it! 

[RockinHarry]

7 minutes ago, Lucky_Strike said:

It's a real pain. Took me ages to figure out where the hatch was disappearing to; it would spin off like a frisbee. I had to put the Pz IV on a bridge in the end to see where it had gone. Have only fixed the commanders hatch as I figured the only reason the rest of the hatches are going to be opened is when the bunker is hit and the crew bail out, then it just looks like the hatches were blown off.

lol ..but nice trick for figuring out where the vanished stuff went to actually. "Making note..."

Would be nice if one gets it all working perfectly, but getting to this stage is quite an achievement already IMO. For us non beta team outsiders at least.

12 minutes ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Do you use the Object > Apply > Location and Object > Apply > Rotation commands? With an object selected, one which you have moved, using these two commands seems to fix most of the jumping issues. It resets the origin and confirms your transformations. Object > Apply > Rotation & Scale is also useful but I find that really only works properly on newly imported NON CM textures, stuff one has found online for example. Applying Rotation & Scale to CM items that have been manipulated can actually wreck things like action points and undo work.

Ah big thanks! No. Didn´t try yet. (saved to my notes now) So at least my thinking was on the right path then. And yep, figured out Rotation/Scale quirks when I tried making a CM tree bigger. While it exported perfectly, it was nothing but a mess in game lol Though I haven´t had exported any the LOD models yet. Anyway, only makes sense if the base model works without problems.

15 minutes ago, Lucky_Strike said:

So true. War is a very messy business! George's maps are excellent; I just spend hours wandering around his maps enjoying how well made they are. I'm always thinking about ways to add more detritus to maps, simply can't get enough of it! 

Yes, there were times when a landscape was totally unaffected by a war´s destructive terrain shaping effects. But most our battles are within some tactical battle zones and thus one can always expect seeing some damage and devastation, as well as dirt. That´s what makes a battle map look credible and "natural" looking  IMHO.

And yes, George´s maps are always a feast for the eyes. Usually I recognize them at a glance when I see some. If it´s natural and realistic looking, it´s his (style) for sure.

[Warts 'n' all]

11 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

me no grasp, me german. 

Don't worry about not grasping it because you're German. It an obscure reference to Limey punk band the Sex Pistols. Jamie Reid was a graphic designer who did the covers of their singles and album "Never Mind the Bollocks".

[RockinHarry]

40 minutes ago, Warts 'n' all said:

Don't worry about not grasping it because you're German. It an obscure reference to Limey punk band the Sex Pistols. Jamie Reid was a graphic designer who did the covers of their singles and album "Never Mind the Bollocks".

Lol okay At least that Sex pistols album I do know. IIRC I´d heard it first time near end of the 70ies when my elder brother owned and listened to it.

[RockinHarry]

11 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

12 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

The Faust came out this way for the mentioned troubles with component parts. Wanted it beeing put onto the boxes in assembled version, but couldn´t get it working.

Happy accident 

So finally got it working. Though by different means. I´ve "joined" all small components to their immediate parents. That got them stick to where I wanted. It´s good for those compositions of which single components I don´t want changing anymore.

Left is the "accident/workaround" and right what I wanted doing initially.

Me stupido also forgot turning off my movie shader, since it´s defeating anti aliasing. So back to better looking sreenshots now.

Edited October 23, 2022 by RockinHarry

[Warts 'n' all]

In the meantime I'm about 30mins into my replay of "Neues Reichskanlei". And it is certainly more fun without the flyboys bombing my own tanks.

[Aragorn2002]

56 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

So finally got it working. Though by different means. I´ve "joined" all small components to their immediate parents. That got them stick to where I wanted. It´s good for those compositions of which single components I don´t want changing anymore.

Left is the "accident/workaround" and right what I wanted doing initially.

Me stupido also forgot turning off my movie shader, since it´s defeating anti aliasing. So back to better looking sreenshots now.

Looking good, RockinHarry!

[RockinHarry]

8 minutes ago, Aragorn2002 said:

Looking good, RockinHarry!

Thanks. At last found a solution for that small things that caused me problems. Now one step closer to start on making decent looking junk mods. For the screen above I got to hit Fraps screenshot key (F11) real fast, as just 1-2 seconds later the game engine turns off shadow casting for close up scenes. Bugs me for many years already.

[JM Stuff]

@Lucky_Strike @RockinHarry @NPye Hold down guys you are making a lot of beauties here, supporting by @Warts 'n' all comments and infos.

I don't need news paper in Holiday I have the CM Forum.

There is so much to read and to check only of this threat that I hope to don't missing nothing, but hope also that a mod pack will see the light one day.

@Aragorn2002 yes I am working on the dead bodies don't worry but is difficult to apply some textures because the models dont have any, I will let you a view after the holidays.

Crossing fingers to yours job's  guy's ✌

JM

[JM Stuff]

15 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Yup, one can´t keep it all in old brains all the time.

Just had these bits of trouble with the Faust and MG42 model. Both have a number of (sub) parts that are used for animation as well. Haven´t yet quite figured out where to append what correctly. While it looked all okay in Blender, in CM certain parts just vanished (or maybe were pulled underground as you say). Guess it´s related to certain pivotal or center points maybe hidden in META. Or not setting Blenders Transform orientation correctly before moving/turning stuff. At last I deleted the troublesome childs, as well as unneeded muzzle points. lol 

Aargh... things like that are a heavy burden on nerves and motivation. Cool you got through it til it "worked".

Yup vehicle models seem most sensitive in all regards. Think there always got to be something meaningful in each components META ~70 data fields in order to get it all saved without Blender throwing errors. (and get nothing saved at all)

Exactly that. Before I learned that, I was lucky to find Blender has a recover last session/autosave function. Also the great CNTRL-Z became my best friend (again).

CNTRL-Z is a must to know almost everywhere is used also in ps gimp... but in blender is a necessity also make  x copy of your jobs to avoid bats moments or crashes ...

JM

[Combatintman]

16 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Yeah adding variation and complementary stuff where desired. I want as much dirty devastation and disorder on my battlefields as possible. Unless it´s @George MC making maps I find the stock game ones pretty boring and rather unimaginative most the times. Sorry I got to say that. I very rarely look at and play stock game maps/missions for long time, so I might have missed lots of the better ones maybe.

Your opinion obviously and what makes a good map is horses for courses but dragging this back to Berlin, @benpark   the creator of the stock maps for Berlin had started work on them sometime before January 19, 2015, and in March 2018 was unhappy enough with them that he scrubbed his work and started again.  Modding is modding and there is great work done by modders as this threat amply demonstrates but "pretty boring" in stock releases is pretty much what has to be the standard because everybody has to be able to experience the game unmodded and stock scenario designers and map makers have to work within those constraints.

To use CMFB as an example, the maps created by @benpark and @Pete Wenman(and others I'm sure probably) were absolutely superb - I have walked that ground on numerous occasions and the boring stock maps are superbly realistic which give you a sense of actually being there.  

@Pete Wenmanmade the map discussed in this thread for the Market Garden Module in which @Free Whiskyhad high praise for the quality of the mapping and a similar sense of "visiting history".

 

Sometimes real ground is "boring," but it is what it is ...

[Artkin]

I have to say, the Berlin maps are nice, but the attention to detail for the scenario "A Night at the Opera" is lacking. The museum has no inside doors, so the whole thing is entirely useless. And there's another building to the front right across the empty field (From the Soviet perspective) which also has a room with no doors, making it inaccessible.

I'm not blaming Ben because the number of hours that went into that map is probably mind numbing. But SOMEONE should have proofread his work and tested the scenario.

Were the buildings barricaded? Probably not, considering there were no defenders placed inside these rooms.

I had the same criticism of NPye's maps too.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Artkin

[JM Stuff]

On 10/22/2022 at 6:53 PM, Lucky_Strike said:

Nice. As Harry says we could try moving the fire action point to adjust where the smoke comes from.

I think I'll have a go at some of this once I get a couple other things out.

This is interresting !!

JM

[JM Stuff]

On 10/22/2022 at 6:59 PM, RockinHarry said:

Think it´s named "Exhaust", "Exhaust2" etc. Moving them should be no problem as is maybe adding more to "thicken up" smoke output? Haven´t tried yet but that seems beeing the basic principle.

I was trying to change the colour of the "smok" from the engine more black (because a tank make more black), but I couldn't do anything... I guess this have to do with the famous files shaders .frag .vert that I don't have any knowledges.

JM

[Lucky_Strike]

17 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Would be nice if one gets it all working perfectly, but getting to this stage is quite an achievement already IMO. For us non beta team outsiders at least.

Too true, I wish we had secret sauce, but in the meantime it does encourage us to think out of the box.

17 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Ah big thanks! No. Didn´t try yet. (saved to my notes now) So at least my thinking was on the right path then. And yep, figured out Rotation/Scale quirks when I tried making a CM tree bigger. While it exported perfectly, it was nothing but a mess in game lol Though I haven´t had exported any the LOD models yet. Anyway, only makes sense if the base model works without problems.

Yes LODS ... can be a real pain to get right. For tanks and the like I tend to just make copies of the main mdr and rename for LODs works pretty much as expected. Can't do that for trees and stuff though, just cripples the CPU/GPU.

17 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Yes, there were times when a landscape was totally unaffected by a war´s destructive terrain shaping effects. But most our battles are within some tactical battle zones and thus one can always expect seeing some damage and devastation, as well as dirt. That´s what makes a battle map look credible and "natural" looking  IMHO.

Yes - it would be very cool if in CMx3 they could introduce permanent destructibility in landscapes for campaigns. It really adds to the emersion. One only has to look at some of the scenes in Ukraine (Slava Ukraini) revealed on our TVs to see what war does VERY quickly to a landscape. Just having a touch of that in game can really enhance a scenario.

5 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

So finally got it working. Though by different means. I´ve "joined" all small components to their immediate parents. That got them stick to where I wanted. It´s good for those compositions of which single components I don´t want changing anymore.

Left is the "accident/workaround" and right what I wanted doing initially.

Great - you're joining the children to the parents mesh? You can still edit them if needs be, just carefully selecting will allow you to move them etc; wireframe mode is your friend and limiting the section to what you can see.

[Lucky_Strike]

Just posted a load of pics of the Panzer IV bunker in the screen shots thread, it's very close to release, this week all being well ...

It adds quite an interesting feature for a small scenario. I ran a quick scenario against the AI with one by itself against a large armoured frontal attack and it lasted enough time to inflict serious casualties. So one or two of these on a junction supported by a few squads of heavily armed, well placed infantry can cause mayhem.

[Lucky_Strike]

3 hours ago, JM Stuff said:

@Lucky_Strike @RockinHarry @NPye Hold down guys you are making a lot of beauties here, supporting by @Warts 'n' all comments and infos.

I don't need news paper in Holiday I have the CM Forum.

There is so much to read and to check only of this threat that I hope to don't missing nothing, but hope also that a mod pack will see the light one day.

@Aragorn2002 yes I am working on the dead bodies don't worry but is difficult to apply some textures because the models dont have any, I will let you a view after the holidays.

Crossing fingers to yours job's  guy's ✌

JM

Thanks JM, better than the news in our Sunday papers no doubt!