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What is left to do once CW is released?


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I have only a passing knowledge of WWII history, and I was wondering what on earth would be included in the 'Market Garden' module that isn't already in CMBN once the CW module is released?

As far as I can recall Market Garden forces included:

Polish paratroopers (CW module?),

British paratroopers (CW),

XXX Corps (Base + CW),

US infantry & engineers (Base),

Waffen SS (CW),

Hitler Youth (??),

Regular German units (CW),

Artillery assets for both sides (Base +CW)

Am I missing something? Perhaps someone with a better understanding of the operation could enlighten me?

Or perhaps the next module will just include new missions and campaigns?

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I have only a passing knowledge of WWII history, and I was wondering what on earth would be included in the 'Market Garden' module that isn't already in CMBN once the CW module is released?

As far as I can recall Market Garden forces included:

Polish paratroopers (CW module?),

British paratroopers (CW),

XXX Corps (Base + CW),

US infantry & engineers (Base),

Waffen SS (CW),

Hitler Youth (??),

Regular German units (CW),

Artillery assets for both sides (Base +CW)

Am I missing something? Perhaps someone with a better understanding of the operation could enlighten me?

Or perhaps the next module will just include new missions and campaigns?

At least German paratroops will be in the Market Garden. Lufwaffe units in CW are only field division units

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Some additional terrain types, dikes and polder ..... Also following the breakout and the pursuit across France, their were some changes to the TO&E of several formations ....

Overall a good question, I have wondered for some time what BF will put in the MG module to make it worthy of another $35.00 .... We shall see .....

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Assuming the "Market Garden" module is intended to expand the game to cover ETO combat in general through September, 1944, and not just the units specifically involved in Operation Market Garden, there are a fair number of less common vehicles that could still be included, especially on the German side.

Off the top of my head, one major Allied vehicle that makes it in once we expand the timeframe a bit is the M18 Hellcat.

As noted, there's also plenty of new terrain & buildings that could be added. Much of this stuff might not add much in the way of new tactical options (though polder especially has some unique attributes), but would certainly add geographical flavor.

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The M36 was just beginning to reach frontline combat units in September 1944... I think whether or not we see it in the Market Garden Module depends on where BFC puts the date cutoff for the module. If they make a hard cutoff at the end of September once Market Garden proper was over, then we might not see it.

However, given that the next game family is Battle of the Bulge, BFC might choose to have the MG module expand the date coverage up though October or November, so that there is no gap between the end of the CMBN family, and the beginning of the CMBotB Family. In this case, we would almost certainly see the M36.

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I think Market Garden actually needs to cover the autumn/early winter (Pre Bulge) campaign on the Siegfried Line. Personally I think Siegfried Line (aka Hanging out the Washing) would be a better title than Market Garden, I would rather see the next two or three games as expansions to Normandy covering the rest of the NW European Campaign. No need to reinvent the wheel which you could better achieve in future releases covering the Russian Front, Mediterranean and early Blitzkrieg campaigns.

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...the Russian Front, Mediterranean and early Blitzkrieg campaigns.

While not disagreeing with you, I recall that BFC was pretty adamant about there being no Mediterranean game this time around and doing the early war was unlikely. On the other hand, if it could be shown that there was sufficient demand for such games, they might change their minds. 'Sufficient demand' being defined as several thousand players willing to commit to paying up front.

Michael

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While not disagreeing with you, I recall that BFC was pretty adamant about there being no Mediterranean game this time around and doing the early war was unlikely. On the other hand, if it could be shown that there was sufficient demand for such games, they might change their minds. 'Sufficient demand' being defined as several thousand players willing to commit to paying up front.

Michael

Also, they may allow 3rd party programmers to build some of those other theaters, a la CM:Afghanistan.

Lucas, IIRC, Siegfried Line will be covered in the Bulge Game Family, since fall/winter conditions and terrain will be needed.

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Though the earlier Siegfried Line battles around Stolberg, Aachen and earlier operations in the Hurtgen Forest should be possible with the introduction of new organisations like the Volksgrenadiers. This part of the campaign might cover the September and October time frame. The November Offensive might be a Bulge option or it might be included with Market Garden if they stick with the 3 month format. Covering the forgotten campagns to clear the Scheldt, Overloon and the Channel Ports would be good particularly if they could find a ay to do "funnies" like the flail tanks which would be really nice although maybe hard to program and get the graphics right,

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It will be interesting to see how BFC handles all the motley assortments of depleted German units that got thrown together to make the ad-hoc battle groups in OMG.

Actually, they happened in so many different ways that it might just be best to help players with a good manual section that gives good historical OOB info, and explains how to create, say, a Luftwaffe "stomach and ear" company or a Security company using the various options for equipment and soft factors already in the editor.

To me, the most important part of the OMG module would be any terrain and building changes needed to make Holland maps play realistically and be as authentic-looking as the ones we can make now for Normandy.

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German side as far as vehicles we could be seeing the Hetzer and Nashorn and maybe some new halftrack variants. Allied side we might also see the Sherman Jumbo and Challenger.

The Fallshirmjaegers should bring some Recoilless Rifles with them. Also if they have ground to air coded by then-which imho is more likely then fire- we could have all sorts of new stuff like Wirblewinds and quad halftracks not to mention aa arty pieces.

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It will be interesting to see how BFC handles all the motley assortments of depleted German units that got thrown together to make the ad-hoc battle groups in OMG.

Actually, they happened in so many different ways that it might just be best to help players with a good manual section that gives good historical OOB info, and explains how to create, say, a Luftwaffe "stomach and ear" company or a Security company using the various options for equipment and soft factors already in the editor.

To me, the most important part of the OMG module would be any terrain and building changes needed to make Holland maps play realistically and be as authentic-looking as the ones we can make now for Normandy.

I hope they implement the option in the editor to simply add a squad or even a platoon to a formation from the "Specialist Team" section. I like the current Formation system, but when you simply want to add a platoon of Sherman's or a pioneer squad, it's a little unwieldy. And that option would almost be a necessity with the German Orbat.

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German side as far as vehicles we could be seeing the Hetzer and Nashorn and maybe some new halftrack variants. Allied side we might also see the Sherman Jumbo and Challenger.

The Fallshirmjaegers should bring some Recoilless Rifles with them. Also if they have ground to air coded by then-which imho is more likely then fire- we could have all sorts of new stuff like Wirblewinds and quad halftracks not to mention aa arty pieces.

Amen to AAA, especially for use in ground combat.

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Market Garden will add a month to the title which for the American side will push the fighting into Hurtgen forest territory. Lets not forget modules aren't just the equipment, there's the scenarios and campaigns too. Some might say they're primarily the scenarios and campaigns. If Commonwealth perhaps doubles the number of scenarios avaliable to play, Market Garden will probably do the same.

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I thought that additional modules will not include any additional terrain?

Units - YES

Scenarios/campaigns - YES

Terrain - NO

UI upgrades (including armour arcs) - NO

New types of unit behavior (e.g. Flamethrowers) - NO

Weather (e.g. Snow) - NO

So, I am also a little confused as to what beyond a few additional units, MG will introduce. Maybe they can combine MG and Odd & Sods into one for a richer module and get on to the next family of games sooner.

Not sure.

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Market Garden will add a month to the title which for the American side will push the fighting into Hurtgen forest territory. Lets not forget modules aren't just the equipment, there's the scenarios and campaigns too. Some might say they're primarily the scenarios and campaigns. If Commonwealth perhaps doubles the number of scenarios avaliable to play, Market Garden will probably do the same.

The Heurtgen campaign lasted from September 1944 to February 1945. So the BFC version will just show the opening moves. Denser Fog than currently exists may prove necessary. It's sobering to remember that both Market Garden and the Huertgen Forest are widely considered Allied defeats. But that may not bother, uh, certain posters to this forum.

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