sburke

Can you define most people as honestly I can't say the response on the forums has shown most responders being upset about this. I do see a very very vocal few. Nothing wrong with that, but to assume the mantle of a "silent majority" needs a little more data. I for one don't see this as the hot button item and I do like the graphics and no I don't purchase call of duty (and I am a looong way from high school unfortunately). Those graphics are really important to those of us who like the immersion factor in WEGO (and have been constantly cited on the forums). RTS style inherently leaves you unable to appreciate the detail in the same way, but that doesn't mean others of us do not like them. Personally I think your dismissal of the graphic quality basically says to the vast majority of posters that what we like doesn't matter. In the same vein an insistence that somehow the MP portion is what the majority wants is simply an assertion. BFC is not going to change their business model off that. This has worked for them for over a decade and sales indications from what they have seen will allow them to continue in this direction. Don't try and do a Babu on BFC and have them open an Indian restaurant.

I believe it will, Normandy had quite a bit of rain that summer so there should be plenty of potential for mud. You'd need a response from the beta testers to know for sure. I believe I have heard them mention the potential for track damage in the bocage but can't be certain.

Yeah I agree though I really am hoping folks will ignore you. You really do waste too much of everyone's time on every forum you log into. Don't get it, but if this is how you get off... You might want to consider dating... no I mean girls. And yes it was expected you would hate it.

Except the part about anchovies. I am pretty certain that it was sardines.

Yep, see this is the true story. Steve and those guys HATE computer games. They actually don't even really have a game, the demo is just a hash of some stuff they threw together. They don't play computer games nor do the beta testers. Instead they simply watch the forums giggling maniacally as we fret like 9 year olds waiting for our red ryder BB rifle. Ahh sweet mother of god are they ever enjoying this thread. Oh yeah and what you get for pre order is a cool metal box! Now how pathetic do we sound? Like Charlie Brown on halloween...I got a game, I got a PC, I got a ...box.

As with a couple other game issues that have been cited it would look like we would need a little more data before reaching any conclusions. I have had this happen a couple times in both CtG and BtB. In Busting the Bocage the panzershreck team that took out the tank then proceeded to gun down the crew in the same turn. Later an American Tk crew came rolling into the sunken lane surprising the handful of men I had left defending the line there. They managed to make the closest landser cower before the other 3 gunned em down. In CtG the couple of German crews that managed to reorganize to attack the town didn't last much longer than the amount of time they were in sight. I do find it more than a little funny though that after all this there are human players who are doing the same as the AI. Maybe there really isn't anything wrong with the AI and it is PERFECTLY emulating human player behavior. :-P Personally I agree, crews from destroyed tanks should high tail it to the rear, but I don't know how that would affect being able to dismount to scout or being able to remount a team that had simply bailed a functional vehicle. I would prefer to keep those and the fanatical behavior rather than lose them.

My tank crews (German or American) have not fared so well. I understand the programming issue as to why they attack and yes historically it is inaccurate, but if Steve, Charles and the gang felt trying to correct it would just create more issues than it would help, I'll just chalk it up to desperation on the part of the AI. It certainly hasn't had much impact on the game for me. I am learning to be a lot more wary of artillery in general. In Closing the gap I took out both Panthers with artillery while my armor sat behind the ridge waiting for an opportunity. Once the Panthers were gone it was all over for the Germans, between my artillery and armor they never stood a chance. Historically I think that situation is pretty accurate. A human player however wouldn't sit still while artillery rounds walked there way up to your most precious item. :-P Lesson for both I think is, if you want to avoid the artillery- close with the enemy. I will say this for the landser, they put up a darned good fight in Bocage and have the weapons for it, great handheld AT and lots of MGs. If you can set up some good lateral lines like a sunken road to reinforce positions it can be deadly for the Amis.

Thanks worth a shot and somewhat embarrassingly obvious. :-P what can I say I got hung up in the hedgerow and lost my glasses..... that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it.

LOL the first time your panther cruises into range and finds that Granny armed with a Bazooka.... (Uncle Jed, Granny keeps stealing my bazooka!) :-P I am actually struggling with this as well, I want to hunt another tank I know is nearby and I can't hunt as there are other known units about and I don't want to just issue another form of movement as odds are I will get burned. I haven't found the happy medium there yet. Any of the playtesters want to comment on tactics that might work here?

Just please please please, no one post a pic of Lady Gag me

I won't and can't say what you have seen isn't true and again I just wish everyone would take it down a notch. I saw the title to this thread and frankly avoided it for quite some time and then figured eventually you see some really good stuff in it once the initial flames die down. As to not getting a reply from BF, well they are pretty busy on the game and the number of threads popping up on items is pretty high. Part of it may be that perhaps BF feels they have already answered it enough times. The engine is actually quite old now just not this theater/period. As an alternative to just putting controversial (and I would actually not consider this thread title controversial, I would include it under the insulting category to be honest) titles on threads is to simply PM the BF folks direct and ask if they can put a sticky up with a succinct reply even if it is just a link to a previously stated case. Where I think you are seeing some of the reaction on this particular items is again the engine isn't new, the particular feature has not been part of it and there is a certain feeling of -"stop trying to rain on our parade, the feature hasn't been here for 4 years and isn't specific to CMBN - do your research and comment not on CMBN, but on the CM2 engine - elsewhere." I am not saying that is necessarily correct or helpful, but there are many many comments about the game that reflect a lack of research on the commentator as if they have found some brand new glaring hole. If I was completely brand new to this product I would have spent quite a bit of time looking at forums on CMSF and trying the demo before I would plop down $60 on a pre order. Kick the tires as it were before complaining my car is an automatic and I wanted a stick AFTER I order it.

Patience on all sides would probably be a very good thing. Titling a thread "BF you blew it" is sure to incite a reaction and probably blew from the start any ability to have a calm reasonable discussion unfortunately. Respect goes both ways, if you want the beta testers to be reasonable then don't just spit in their faces and act like they have no cause to feel slighted. We are all human here. While I don't have as much interest in RT (though due to some of the posts an AARs I have been trying it, I just really love going back over a turn and watching the drama unfold) I can understand there are a large community who do and pausing would facilitate their enjoyment of the game. Case closed - a reasonable request based on a way to enhance their enjoyment of the product. Whether it is actually capable of being programmed I haven't the foggiest notion. What I did do is a search on the forum (because that is my pet peeve, very few people think to look up what has already been said- what a buddy of mine refers to as the 15 second rule - why spend the time if it only takes me 15 seconds to ask you...I hate it.) to see if I could find a post that would clarify from BFs viewpoint why it was not included in a succinct manner. I am sure something is out there and if anyone knows the link it would be greatly appreciated as it would add a rational presentation to what has become an increasingly irrational thread. What I did find and has me chuckling away is the following. Yes it is off topic, but it is enlightening to see the kinds of reactions BF has to deal with in responding to some of our more um heated discussions.

That would be outstanding. Have played with the CMSF editor quite a bit and learned a lot through simple trial and error, but my satisfaction level is not quite what I think it could be. Really appreciate all your efforts to help us get the most out of CMBN.

Medication wearing off again? We told you to refill the prescription!

One of the conspiracy theories out there says Rommel deliberately built the Normandy defenses the way he did in the hopes the allies would figure out how to use the material in just this way. Umm no I really am kidding, but how long before I get quoted as a source in wikipedia? "Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information." Michael Scott

Don't get me wrong, occasionally I would love to wipe my PC just to completely clean it of all the garbage it collects. The internet is roughly comparable to the space beneath my refrigerator except I can roll out the refrigerator and clean it out periodically. I just find that figuring something out helps me understand how it works better. This knowledge in turn I can build on to help improve my whole experience. Just formatting it removes the ability to learn from the experience. All i have learned is how to format and I picked that up back last century.

beautiful, do I sense a Dompaire scenario in the works?

I think I've got a piece of brain lodged in my head.

absolutely, and if you want to see a bunch of pixel truppen scatter like roaches when the lights come on nothing beats it. Pulled this off in the tutorial along a hedgerow.

rotflmao You remind me of a guy who i used to work with in IT back in the Dot Com glory days. He was support for a small (20 person) office. His answer to everything was to re-image their machine. No offense, but he no longer works in IT. Sometimes you can't just go formatting your machine to deal with an issue with a single application. It just isn't practical.

Just got through Busting the Bocage playing the germans. Pulled a Tactical victory, but to be honest a few minutes in I wasn't even thinking victory conditions. Was too busy fighting a battle. I just can't get over how immersive it is. Even in the first 10 minutes when i thought I was about to get steamrolled, watching the individual efforts just sucks you in. One of my team leaders accounted for 15 of the enemy before finally being gunned down in the sunken roadway trying to retrieve a panzershreck to destroy one of the last few shermans. Another At team was able to sneak up behind a hedgerow bordering the main road. While one of them gunned down an engineer team on the road with his mp, the other nailed the last sherman with a PF, then the two of them machine gunned the Tank crew as they exited. That the tank crew had a thompson didn't do them any good. You guys nailed it, by far the best game I have ever played. And to think this is just the demo! LOL

They weren't by any chance marked M&M Enterprises were they?

Cough cough I feel a bug coming on that will likely hit me full on sometime early next week cough cough.... I knew I was hoarding my sick days for a good reason.

I went the remodel the kitchen route which coincidentally is wrapping up right in time for the game. Far higher price tag, but gives me some clearance to argue for spending the money to upgrade the PC.

it is almost cinematic. Just finished my first run through of the tutorial. Successfully leveraged the Germans out of position and learned how bad it can be to be flanked in a hedgerow. Pretty much a shooting gallery as they flee looking for a way out. However the best part (worst for me) was when two of my squads were pinning a couple fleeing Wehrmacht units in the sunken road at the end of the map. I thought they were pretty much down and out as units were already surrendering. This one team of 5 guys has 4 of them surrender. The last guy who was safe on the other side of the hedgerow tosses a pair of potato mashers, one at each squad and takes out 4 of my men including a squad leader. He wasn't allowed to surrender :-P I have to give my guys credit - they allowed the other 4 to surrender. LOL I had already seen a couple not surrender fast enough and die with their hands in the air. Just absolutely awesome guys, I really can't say much more than that, just absolutely stunning.