Shoot and Scoot

[Jaws]

Shoot and Scoot... plz give it back When 9x T-72 are bypassing 2x Bradleys I want too reload my AT rockets at a save spot.

Well I managed to kill 4x T-72 but I am sure with Shoot and Scoot I would have killed 9

[Primarch]

I second that however for BMP-1 vs bradley reason

[Exel]

It needs no other reason than Shoot & Scoot being the norm fighting method for all armored vehicles. You just don't stay exposed when you are not firing.

[Zipuli]

I second that. Steel Beasts has a nice way of doing it for AI - they search for hull-down pos whenever they stop, then if no enemy visible they go to turret-down. When enemy is spotted, they go to hull-down, BLAM, reverse back to safety. And if that can be done in SB, it sure can be done with CM:SF! SB afterall has next to no AI at all

Zip

[thewood]

Didn't CM originally have it?

[Childress]

Speaking of S&S, is there a seek Hull Down command in the game? Is it even modelled?

[Elmar Bijlsma]

There's no specific hull down command.

And hull down is modelled, but not like in CMx1 but rather what you see is what you get. If only the turret sticks out you only get to shoot at the turret. So shots on a hull down target won't be reduced by an artificial modifier like before but you get the same effect since the projectile needs to hit a smaller target.

[thewood]

As a battalion or companmy commander during a RT game, you are going to spend precious decision cycles screwing around with getting an M2 squared away in hull down. That is why you need hull doen and shoot & scoot commands. It is the same issue TOW had. Why remove something that was actually quite useful.

btw, WYSIWYG is really WYSICloseToWYG. I think the terrain is accurate 1m (a lot for a tank) and 8M for objects)

[Redwolf]

Originally posted by thewood:

Didn't CM originally have it?

CMBO didn't, but demand got it into CMBB and CMAK.

As people pointed out, and here I pick up quotes from the "infantry speed thread" , the vets win. In the real world armored vehicles do scoot and shoot, when they have reload times and enemy threats are present End of discussion.

[Exel]

Originally posted by thewood:

btw, WYSIWYG is really WYSICloseToWYG. I think the terrain is accurate 1m (a lot for a tank) and 8M for objects)

Thanks to the terrain texture scaling, it's accurate to 1m. If you are looking at it from any distance, the terrain deforms and no longer looks like what it really is - the tank you thought to have line-of-sight doesn't, the enemy you thought was exposed is in fact hull-down, etc.

[dfritch]

First, I love this game, but it is VERY IRRITATING that they took out things that are HIGHLY IMPORTANT such as the hull down command and shoot and scoot command. It really makes it next to impossible to fight a battle properly, especially when protecting your outnumbered units is a premium.

Why, why, why did they do this!!!!?????

[Melnibone]

IMHO the CM1 Hulldown command was flawed anyway - Better results were always achieved by judging it manually. I never used it. Shoot and scoot, however, is a loss.

[J Ruddy]

Originally posted by Melnibone:

IMHO the CM1 Hulldown command was flawed anyway - Better results were always achieved by judging it manually. I never used it. Shoot and scoot, however, is a loss.

I agree - hull down in CMx1 is wonky - shoot in scoot is quite handy...

[z1812]

Hi All,

I also never used the hull down command in CMX1. Much better to give the hunt command below a hill crest or to judge it manually as Melnibone has said.

In terms of shoot and scoot try a move, pause, and reverse command.

Regards John

[M1A1TC]

I dont think Hull Down should be a command. As a past tank commander in RL, it was my job to seek hull down position, not my platoon or company commander's job. This game is company or battalion size C&C, so why does the player have to do simple tank commander's job? It should be done automatically by TacAI.

[Dirtweasle]

Originally posted by dfritch:

...it is VERY IRRITATING that they took out things that are HIGHLY IMPORTANT such as the hull down command and shoot and scoot command. It really makes it next to impossible to fight a battle properly, especially when protecting your outnumbered units is a premium.

Why, why, why did they do this!!!!?????

Good question, seems like a step backwards to me too.

[Dirtweasle]

Originally posted by M1A1TankCommander:

It should be done automatically by TacAI.

Is it in the game that way now? I don't think so, but could be wrong.

I've used the hunt command as a makeshift same as I did in early CMx1 days btw...

[Crimguy]

I never thought either command was very good in CM1. Shoot and scoot only allowed one shot. With a 1 minute turn, a tank could shoot, scoot, and shoot/scoot again, so a lot of time was wasted sitting behind a hill.

[Dirtweasle]

Better than a KO'd tank though all the same.

Plus with what seems like a busted "pause" command you cannot even have a unit look over a crest a few seconds and back off. ...or maybe I have not mastered getting that to work either?

[M1A1TC]

I real life normally I would order driver forward to hull down untill gunner has sight picture,fire a couple of shots before going back to turret down position, or even going to alternate Battle Position.

A good loader can load a round in 3 seconds, so 3 seconds exposed in a hull down is not bad

[pad152]

I would like to see more of the detailed command options from TacOps available, for modern warfare it's really needed. The limited options of move and shoot just don't seem to work well for siming modern armored warefare.

[Darkmath]

Theoritically, CMSF does feature a pause command on a specificl waypoint : you would see the pause timing on that waypoint, like it was in Tacops.

Unfortunately, the unit seem to simply ignore that order . Another bug I guess.