3 reasons to get CMBB if everything else was unchanged

[Juju]

Cuz I wanna!

[JonS]

The MGs. In Yelnia I am routinely dislocating the Russian advance using just the MGs. The other infantry squads are just taking a nap.

I've had a play with the artillery in the demo and a better look at it during the preview, and it all looks much better The setup-barrage in particular – when combined with a well designed scenario and a good briefing – has me all giddy with excitement.

One minor quibble though,

From the Improvements and Changes page:

Minefields can be reduced or eliminated by shellfire (though this will not be explicitly shown - you just have to judge roughly by how many craters you see, and hope).

I would be interested to hear the rationale behind this. While it might seem obvious that artillery could/should breach minefields, everything I have seen, read, and heard indicates that while technically possibly, it was operationally extremely impractical. Sample sources are Pemberton (1951) The development of artillery tactics and equipment, and Salt’s Snippets (Thanks John)

Regards

JonS

Edit: to point out that I do realise there is a 'can' in there, which probably indicates less than 100% reliability for artillery breaching minefields.

[ September 10, 2002, 05:19 PM: Message edited by: JonS ]

[Moon]

Way less than 100% Basically, when you see a line of overlapping craters through a minefield, it's probably ok to crawl through this gap. That much less than 100%

[Old Dog]

The ability to load custom maps in QBs

Rarity option introduced into unit cost

The ISU152 *makes "here, kitty, kitty" sounds*

- Old Dog

[Spook]

Originally posted by Andreas:

The following three reasons would have made me shell out money, even if all else had stayed the same between CMBB and CMBO. They are the reasons I will never go back to CMBO.

Same here. CMBO gave me lots of play value, and was an outstanding product for its time. But what all has been added to CMBB has rendered CMBO obsolescent to me for all intents.

1. Completely revamped penetration model for rounds. No longer will a 2-pdr take out a Panther from the side with one shot

I don't know if this has been paralleled with any significant changes to shell trajectory models, but yes, any improvements on penetration were welcome.

I will also note that the added speciality LATW's like molotov's and ATM's seem reasonably modelled, though more play later on will confirm.

2. Completely revamped artillery model. Different size batteries, pre-barrages, different modelling of rocket barrages, time counter between volleys, radio/wire FOOs.

Yep, great stuff altogether. Even at this tactical scale, artillery is often a critical weapon. (Yelnia Scenario SPOILER STATEMENT: The Yelnia scenario also demonstrates an added potential difference in "flexibility" where the Soviet spotter can't adjust an initially chosen target point.)

3. Changed MG modelling. HMGs are now the killers that they really were.

Geez, Andreas, you've nailed down the other key factor before I could.

What are yours?

I will add the following:

4. Modeling of "covered arcs." First off, providing separate arcs, based on "armored target" or "soft target," go some way to help also model a fire "standard operational procedure" or SOP. Second, the player isn't constrained to defining a true arc, but can instead effectively "triangulate" a fire zone. Much more flexible.

5. The added movement commands for infantry. I think their sum value fairly compares with that for the other key features cited earlier. Also, some like "assault" are tied to unit experience. That is not only historically appropriate, but puts an added constraint on CM QB gamers who think that buying lots of conscript or green SMG squads is a good idea.

(Some will probably still do so; but the consequence will be more pronounced. )

[Liebchen]

Originally posted by DrAlimantado:

It depicts the East front.

This, alone, would do it from me. :cool:

[Treeburst155]

I need reasons to buy CMBB?! How 'bout, it's a Mutha Beautiful Game and it will soon be available.

Treeburst155 out.

[Danzig]

There's a new Combat Mission game coming out?

How could you NOT buy the sequel to the best WW2 wargame simulator ever?

[gunnergoz]

Because- It's your destiny, Luke Skywalker...

(heavy breathing)

Because- I can't NOT buy it...

Because my Russian wife and her mom will go nuts watching me pulverize Fritzes for them...

Mainly because I think that Charles, Steve, MadMatt, Moon and I were actually Separated AT Birth and so, well, I gotta have it, they'r my bro's, ya know...

[GriffinCheng+]

As a "cheerleader", I guess I will buy any CM in the series as long as they are anything not worse than CMBO Beta Demo.

Well, I guess everyone has said my part. I would add the new muzzle flash.

[Berlichtingen]

Originally posted by Silvio Manuel:

DO you mean that you never held down Shift while mouse-scrolling? It locks the screen view, much like how in CMBB you get the screen-lock/side-scroll by using the mouse in the lower parts of the screen.

Exactly... I don't use the keyboard during movies

[tabpub]

Originally posted by Berlichtingen:

qb]

Exactly... I don't use the keyboard during movies[/QB]

[Cameroon]

(As Spook said, Yelnia Spoiler alert)

Originally posted by Spook:

Yep, great stuff altogether. Even at this tactical scale, artillery is often a critical weapon. (Yelnia Scenario SPOILER STATEMENT: The Yelnia scenario also demonstrates an added potential difference in "flexibility" where the Soviet spotter can't adjust an initially chosen target point.)

This is not just for Soviet FOOs. Any artillery plotted on the first turn is defined as a prep-barrage and cannot be altered. If you do not add delay time to the barrage it will begin falling immeadiately on turn one, otherwise it starts after the set delay.

[flamingknives]

Wow, With all these positive waves, I'm thinking that we can do anything...

[Bastables]

Because in some indirect way I'll be helping BTS, which pisses off Gunny Bunny.

[Berlichtingen]

Originally posted by Bastables:

Because in some indirect way I'll be helping BTS, which pisses off Gunny Bunny.

Oh my god! I wish I had thought of that!

[Micheal Wittman]

ahem..... It's the best dang "WW2" game out there!!!that I've been waiting 40 Years for!

Maybe we'll get "WW1" The Meatgrinder one day ?!

Hopefully they put the Battlefront Battlewagon

in with a 15cm canon on it in "CMBB"

CheerZ!

[Lars]

Because I'll have two years of fun with it till the next one comes out.

[Jarmo]

Originally posted by Silvio Manuel:

DO you mean that you never held down Shift while mouse-scrolling?

AARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!! :mad: :eek:

I suppose it's in the manual as well....

[Ligur]

Originally posted by Prinz Eugen:

1. Them bloodthirsty FINNS ! :eek:

JÄÄKÄRIT RYNNÄKKÖÖN !!! :mad:

YES

Also:

2) Reworked armor penetrations and damage/destroying armor.

3) Machineguns.

[Poobear]

Originally posted by Andreas:

[QB]The following three reasons would have made me shell out money, even if all else had stayed the same between CMBB and CMBO. They are the reasons I will never go back to CMBO.

1. Completely revamped penetration model for rounds. No longer will a 2-pdr take out a Panther from the side with one shot

QB]

If thats the case then I want my pre-order $ back!

[Nabla]

Originally posted by Treeburst155:

I need reasons to buy CMBB?! How 'bout, it's a Mutha Beautiful Game and it will soon be available.

That's only 2 reasons, TB.

[Apache]

In addition to the MGs and more effective infantry commands it will definitely be the control of AFVs, esp tanks with HQ units, weapon arcs and move to contact/seek hull down. It will make their use much more realistic and will allow players to more accurately model EFFECTIVE tank tactics.