How Hot is Ukraine Gonna Get?

[TheVulture]

5 hours ago, OldSarge said:

Well, A broken clock is correct twice a day!

This war has exposed the weakness of the U.S. supply chain in a peer to peer conflict as well - 155mm shells, Javelins, microprocessors, etc. And like the European's we're looking into ways to shore up our weak points.

I can see why Xi isn't too happy with Vlad, he surely doesn't want to see both the EU and the US ramping up when his own economy is in a slump.

And simultaneously cutting down on their reliance on Chinese imports to bring critical manufacturing capability back to domestic/ allied locations.

[FancyCat]

Broken clock my ***, the Republican speaker of the House is holding up Ukraine aid, including that essential rearmament funding. Despite the majority of his party being for it, majority of the country for it.

[fireship4]

5 hours ago, Kinophile said:

Most BMP-2 are the BMP-2(K)

I thought that was the command version?

[cesmonkey]

 

[Kinophile]

2 hours ago, fireship4 said:

I thought that was the command version?

Good point. Shall investigate further. 

[fireship4]

Dear oh dear the meme defense network spun up pretty quick regarding some comments the pope apparently made vis a vis Ukraine and negotiation:

Quote

 

Edited March 10 by fireship4

[Kinophile]

1 hour ago, fireship4 said:

Dear oh dear the meme defense network spun up pretty quick regarding some comments the pope apparently made vis a vis Ukraine and negotiation:

 

Not apparently, but he did so in a recorded interview. 

I've long been relative happy with this guy but man oh man, Disconnected Old White Man syndrome strikes down yet another victim. 

[fireship4]

16 minutes ago, Kinophile said:

Not apparently, but he did so in a recorded interview. 

Since he's speaking in Italian, I was hedging my bets, also world leaders can be somewhat "clarificative" to coin a phrase.  What they really mean, their eventual position, is the clarification:

Quote

On Saturday night, the Vatican spokesman, Matteo Bruni, immediately clarified that the pope meant “cease-fire and negotiation,” not surrender, when he said white flag, a universal symbol for giving up.

EDIT:

16 minutes ago, Kinophile said:

Disconnected Old White Man

Italians barely got a generation being white in some people's eyes before succumbing to this racist meme... not that I'm overly sensitive about it here and there but on the whole it gets tiresome.

Edited March 10 by fireship4

[kimbosbread]

There’s a reason he’s called Pope Lenin.

[Fernando]

I think Pope Francisco was speaking in a general way:

Question:
In Ukraine there are those who ask for the courage of surrender, of the white flag. But others say that this would legitimize the strongest. What do you think?

“It's an interpretation. But I believe that those who see the situation, those who think about the people, those who have the courage to raise the white flag and to negotiate are stronger. And today it can be negotiated with the help of international powers. The word negotiate is a courageous word. When you see that you are defeated, that things are not going well, you need to have the courage to negotiate. You are ashamed, but with how many deaths will it end? Negotiate in time, look for some country to act as a mediator. Today, for example in the war in Ukraine, there are many who want to act as mediators. Turkey offered itself for this. And other. Don't be ashamed to negotiate before things get worse."

In Ucraina c’è chi chiede il coraggio della resa, della bandiera bianca. Ma altri dicono che così si legittimerebbe il più forte. Cosa pensa?

“È un’interpretazione. Ma credo che è più forte chi vede la situazione, chi pensa al popolo, chi ha il coraggio della bandiera bianca, di negoziare. E oggi si può negoziare con l’aiuto delle potenze internazionali. La parola negoziare è una parola coraggiosa. Quando vedi che sei sconfitto, che le cose non vanno, occorre avere il coraggio di negoziare. Hai vergogna, ma con quante morti finirà? Negoziare in tempo, cercare qualche paese che faccia da mediatore. Oggi, per esempio nella guerra in Ucraina, ci sono tanti che vogliono fare da mediatore. La Turchia, si è offerta per questo. E altri. Non abbiate vergogna di negoziare prima che la cosa sia peggiore”.

https://www.euronews.com/2024/03/10/pope-francis-ukraine-should-have-courage-of-the-white-flag
 

A white flag has two meanings:

1. I surrender
2. I want to speak/parley/negotiate with you. 

Edited March 10 by Fernando

[Carolus]

Something is moving in the American congress.

[Kinophile]

1 hour ago, fireship4 said:

Since he's speaking in Italian, I was hedging my bets, also world leaders can be somewhat "clarificative" to coin a phrase.  What they really mean, their eventual position, is the clarification:

EDIT:

Italians barely got a generation being white in some people's eyes before succumbing to this racist meme... not that I'm overly sensitive about it here and there but on the whole it gets tiresome.

Certainly wasn't meant in a racist fashion!

More in dispair that so many (not all) of the world's ills are caused by or could be fixed by Disconnected Old (Whichever Ethnicity) Men. Just when you think one Old Man in power is more realistic or empathetic along comes a moment like this.

Sure, clarification sorta helps, but he's still utterly unrealistic about both the nature of this war and of Putin in particular. 

And by old I mean past retirement. It's not the fact of being old, but it's the tendency to be both old And disconnected And wielding significant power. 

[Fernando]

1 hour ago, fireship4 said:

Italians barely got a generation being white in some people's eyes before succumbing to this racist meme... not that I'm overly sensitive about it here and there but on the whole it gets tiresome.

Pope Francisco is not Italian, but full Argentine. He was born and he lived in Argentina until he was elected Pope. If you speaks Spanish you can even detect some of his Argentinian accent when he speaks Italian.

Edited March 10 by Fernando

[fireship4]

28 minutes ago, Kinophile said:

Disconnected Old (Whichever Ethnicity) Men.

Ageist & sexist heheh

 

17 minutes ago, Fernando said:

Pope Francisco is not Italian, but Argentine. He was born and he lived in Argentina until he was elected Pope.

sipo, es verdad pero:

Quote

Pope Francis granted an interview to Radio Télévision Suisse (RTS), a Swiss public station broadcasting in French, a portion of which was released on Saturday afternoon.

The full interview with Lorenzo Buccella of the cultural programme “Cliché” was recorded in early February and will air on the Swiss TV station on March 20.

(https://www.vaticannews.va/en/pope/news/2024-03/pope-francis-swiss-tv-interview-gaza-ukraine-wars.html)

suggests the interviewer may have been Italian/the interview conducted in Italian.

EDIT: Sorry, somehow I thought you meant about the interview language, yes you are right my comment made it look like I thought the pope was Italian, I just didn't think hard enough about it, it was in my brain somewhere I'm sure.  In any case being white only being a recent thing according to some goes for South Americans too.

Edited March 10 by fireship4

[Fernando]

8 minutes ago, fireship4 said:

 

(https://www.vaticannews.va/en/pope/news/2024-03/pope-francis-swiss-tv-interview-gaza-ukraine-wars.html)

suggests the interviewer may have been Italian.

It was done in Italian indeed

I have posted above the transcription in English and Italian of the relevant excerpt. 

You can watch the relevant fragment of the interview here:
https://www.rsi.ch/play/tv/-/video/un-estratto-dellintervista-a-papa-francesco-1?urn=urn:rsi:video:2091800

Edited March 10 by Fernando

[masc]

 

[JonS]

19 minutes ago, masc said:

 

Well, much better that than the money /actually/ going to the Russian armed forces

As an aside - that shell looks sketchy as sh!t.

 

Edit: as a second aside, this really isn't a specifically Russian behaviour. You see exactly the same thing after every natural disaster, and I doubt you'd have to do much scratching to find the same scam being worked supposedly for the Ukrainians. Basically: people suck. Really. Just the worst.

Edited March 10 by JonS

[poesel]

1 hour ago, Fernando said:

I think Pope Francisco was speaking in a general way:

Question:
In Ukraine there are those who ask for the courage of surrender, of the white flag. But others say that this would legitimize the strongest. What do you think?

“It's an interpretation. But I believe that those who see the situation, those who think about the people, those who have the courage to raise the white flag and to negotiate are stronger. And today it can be negotiated with the help of international powers. The word negotiate is a courageous word. When you see that you are defeated, that things are not going well, you need to have the courage to negotiate. You are ashamed, but with how many deaths will it end? Negotiate in time, look for some country to act as a mediator. Today, for example in the war in Ukraine, there are many who want to act as mediators. Turkey offered itself for this. And other. Don't be ashamed to negotiate before things get worse."

In Ucraina c’è chi chiede il coraggio della resa, della bandiera bianca. Ma altri dicono che così si legittimerebbe il più forte. Cosa pensa?

“È un’interpretazione. Ma credo che è più forte chi vede la situazione, chi pensa al popolo, chi ha il coraggio della bandiera bianca, di negoziare. E oggi si può negoziare con l’aiuto delle potenze internazionali. La parola negoziare è una parola coraggiosa. Quando vedi che sei sconfitto, che le cose non vanno, occorre avere il coraggio di negoziare. Hai vergogna, ma con quante morti finirà? Negoziare in tempo, cercare qualche paese che faccia da mediatore. Oggi, per esempio nella guerra in Ucraina, ci sono tanti che vogliono fare da mediatore. La Turchia, si è offerta per questo. E altri. Non abbiate vergogna di negoziare prima che la cosa sia peggiore”.

https://www.euronews.com/2024/03/10/pope-francis-ukraine-should-have-courage-of-the-white-flag
 

A white flag has two meanings:

1. I surrender
2. I want to speak/parley/negotiate with you. 

The way this is phrased could mean either Ukraine or Russia. Most people do just assume he meant Ukraine.

Very well phrased in the sense of "a great empire will fall".

[Vet 0369]

On 3/9/2024 at 5:30 AM, Kraft said:

@Battlefront.com I think this is the highest quality upload of your favorite river crossing, sadly quite short and not while they attempted it, the carnage must've surpassed what any movie could ever portait.

 

Wasn’t this attempted crossing like a year or two ago? This old brain vaguely remembers the same pictures, of course not of the same quality. Am I wrong? If I am, it’s time to retire. ….Wait a minute, I’m already retired for more than seven years!

[Letter from Prague]

8 minutes ago, poesel said:

The way this is phrased could mean either Ukraine or Russia. Most people do just assume he meant Ukraine.

Very well phrased in the sense of "a great empire will fall".

So you're telling me this is inaccurate?

[Fernando]

14 minutes ago, poesel said:

 

 

3 minutes ago, Letter from Prague said:

So you're telling me this is inaccurate?

Pope's message is directed to BOTH countries. He does not even mention the words "Russia" or "Ukraine" as countries. He speaks of the "war in Ukraine" as a geographical location. "Raise the flag to negotiate" can be understood as an expression which means that both countries should negotiate rather than fight a war until the end.

 

Edited March 10 by Fernando

[Battlefront.com]

3 minutes ago, Vet 0369 said:

Wasn’t this attempted crossing like a year or two ago? This old brain vaguely remembers the same pictures, of course not of the same quality. Am I wrong? If I am, it’s time to retire. ….Wait a minute, I’m already retired for more than seven years!

Nearly two years ago   This was part of the multiple failed attempts to cross the Siverskyi Donets river in early May of 2022.  This particular Crossing, which was the worst of all, was Bilohorivka.  The video posted is "new" in the sense it hasn't been circulated (or noticed) until now.  It looks like it was taken very shortly after the Russians abandoned the bridgehead.

Steve

[Astrophel]

Pope Francis is 87.  Surely there should be a retirement age for people claiming to be world leaders.

[Fernando]

9 minutes ago, Astrophel said:

Pope Francis is 87.  Surely there should be a retirement age for people claiming to be world leaders.

I usually don't defend the Pope, but it seems to me that this time he has been very careful in what he has said. The problem is people without a basic level of verbal or reading comprehension. That's a BIG problem. Nowadays, you have to speak for fools, or you will not be understood by a lot of people.

Edited March 10 by Fernando

[fireship4]

6 minutes ago, Astrophel said:

Surely there should be a retirement age for people claiming to be world leaders.

It's the pope... you might as well get rid of the red shoes.  Shout out to The Young Pope, great series.