DMS Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 This is false dichotomy: you support Putin or you support Ukrainian government! If you note crimes of Ukrainian ultra right government, then you support invasion and destruction of independent state. No. Military threats don't excuse government, that committed many crimes against own people, prohibits opposition political parties and media. But this doesn't justify aggression against this country either. I hope that situation will deescalate. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiduk Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, dbsapp said: Yeah, it's better to repeat for thousand times more how evil Putin is invading peaceful kingdom of Ukraine in your imagination, that won't contradict mass media BS that they feed you daily. "Evil Putin" already invaded in February 2014 (Crimea, regulars), in April 2014 (Sloviansk, Strelkov band), in July-August 2014 (trans-border shellings, Ilovaisk, Luhansk, regulars), in February 2015 (Debaltsevo, regulars). There are no any obstackles for him to achive own goals again with a help of invasion - limited or full-scale. @IMHO Very sad, if you, player of WWII CM titles don't see a difference between SS-divizion and Waffen divizion der SS. No one tribunal didn't condemn "Galychyna" division in warcrimes and all personnel of division found political refuge in Allies countries - UK, Canada, USA. This is our hystory and tragedy of WWII, which we must remember despite all the ambiguity. So I understand Baltic countries, which also honored own Waffen der SS divisions, like a symbol of fight with a Soviet occupation, not a honoring of nazism. Edited February 15, 2022 by Haiduk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) 58 minutes ago, DMS said: If you note crimes of Ukrainian ultra right government Ultra-right, Nazi government with Jewish President and Prime Minister. Right… Or are Russian-speakers the new Jews? Conveniently ignoring that majority of casualties in the war in the Ukrainian military forces have been people who grew-up speaking Russian. Edited February 15, 2022 by akd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danfrodo Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 F-ing Jeebus H Kristo, this all really needs to move to some other kind of forum. This is filling up our CM forum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbsapp Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 28 minutes ago, Haiduk said: Very sad, if you, player of WWII CM titles don't see a difference between SS-divizion and Waffen divizion der SS. No one tribunal didn't condemn "Galychyna" division in warcrimes and all personnel of division found political refuge in Allies countries - UK, Canada, USA. This is our hystory and tragedy of WWII, which we must remember despite all the ambiguity. So I understand Baltic countries, which also honored own Waffen der SS divisions, like a symbol of fight with a Soviet occupation, not a honoring of nazism. That's pure gold. That's Ukraine you are defending from evil Russia, ladies and gentlemen. BBC and CNN prudently hide it from you, but here it is, begging for your attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiduk Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) Ok, back to topic. Russia claimed they started withdrawal of some units of Western and Southern military districts, "which completed own training tasks". But looks like this is biderection movement. Some units really can withdraw back (or move to other directions?), in that time when another continue own moving to Ukrainan borders. Latest photo of arrived 10 Su-34 tactical bombers on Primorsko-Akhtarck airfield in 130 km from Mariupol Novoozerne airfield in occupied Crimea, not enough "populated" recently, now have received 70 helicopters. This is in 160 km from Nova Kakhovka, with hydro energy plant and where North-Crimean canal started. Near village Novaya Nelidovka in 11 km from Ukrainian border, Kharkiv direction newest Russian survivelance radar Kasta 2E2 was spotted. It can spotlight aerial situation on 130-140 km in the deep of Ukrainain territory. Edited February 15, 2022 by Haiduk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbsapp Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 6 minutes ago, Haiduk said: Ok, back to topic Haha. Can you elaborate on your respect to SS? Do you possess and wear any Nazi insignia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiduk Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, dbsapp said: Can you elaborate on your respect to SS? Read at last what a difference between SS-division and Waffen der SS. And why during first enlistment 30 000 volunteers come to enlist to division "Galychyna" and come there like on holiday. Two years of Soviet occupation was enough for them to make own choiсe. Like and for citizems of Baltic states, especially Estonians. Edited February 15, 2022 by Haiduk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbsapp Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 1 minute ago, Haiduk said: Read at last what a difference between SS-division and Waffen der SS. And why during first enlistment 30 000 volunteers come to enlist to division "Galychyna" and come there like on holiday. Two years of Soviet occupation was enough for them to make own choiсe. Like and for citizems of Baltic states, especially Estonians. So do you have any personal SS insignia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiduk Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 1 minute ago, dbsapp said: So do you have any personal SS insignia? No, I like UPA much more ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbsapp Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 6 minutes ago, Haiduk said: No, I like UPA much more ) Then you may be interested in this article: "The OUN, the UPA, and the Nazi Genocide in Ukraine" https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3429340 "The analyses of biographic publications, historical studies, and archival documents show that the majority of the OUN-B and UPA leaders and a very large proportion of members collaborated with Nazi Germany, mainly in the beginning of World War II. A significant percentage of the leaders and members of these organizations served in various police formations. They assisted the Nazi occupational authorities in implementing genocidal policies towards the Jews, Ukrainians, Russians, and Poles by helping to carry out mass executions and create conditions intended for the psychical annihilation of the entire Jewish population and significant numbers of Ukrainians, Russians, and Poles" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 Well, well, well. I came over here to find the same people saying that Russia didn't invade Ukraine, Ukraine is a bunch of Fascists, Russians are the most innocent peace loving people on the planet, NATO is an offensive organization intent on taking Moscow someday, etc. etc. etc. are once again banging on with Putin's messaging like the good little propaganda pawns that they seem to relish being. The Nazi thing... HOLY CRAP would you just let it drop already! The last time we went through this we all had a lot of fun showing how the so-called DPR was run by people from Moscow based pro-Nazi, white supremacist fascist groups. So if some pictures of nutjob right wing extremists are enough to paint an entire nation as fascist, then yup... Russia is fascist, German is fascist, Great Britain is fascist, the US is fascist, Canada is fascist, New Zealand is fascist... every nation on Earth is fascist. But only one of these nations has a history of invading its neighbors and brutally repressing its people. Hint, it isn't New Zealand. And so, with that, I close this thread. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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