Is there a way to disable tank APS/Laser Warning?

[DerKommissar]

I've been messing around with CM:BS Quick Battles for my campaign system prototype.

When a T90 emerges from a hilltop and begins to identify targets and compute firing solution, an M1A2 SEP or a M2A2/M2A3 gets a LASER WARNING. They automatically pop IR blocking smoke and reverse. This can save your skin, as I've seen T90s penetrate M1A2's lower glacis and cupola.

However, I've had AFVs reverse in a weird way that exposes their side armour to the T90s. This happens often when there are trees, buildings or the edge of the map behind my AFV. The AFV will steer to the side, and become more vulnerable as a result. Sometimes, the automatic smoke launchers are triggered for a trivial threat -- leaving those charges spent, while a serious threat approaches.

Is it possible to prevent my AFVs from automatically reversing and/or popping smoke on LASER WARNINGs? Or is this immutable TC protocol IRL?

[Michael Emrys]

This is something I've wondered about too. Sometimes I've wished that instead my tank would pop off a shot before the enemy can. This is especially the case when the enemy shot is going to be a command guidance missile and you could kill the shooter before the missile arrives.

Michael

[A Canadian Cat]

4 hours ago, DerKommissar said:

Is it possible to prevent my AFVs from automatically reversing and/or popping smoke on LASER WARNINGs?

No but you can influence things a bit.

4 hours ago, DerKommissar said:

Or is this immutable TC protocol IRL?

It is standard protocol - as advised by RL tank commanders.

Early in development we were seeing this triggered as tanks were moving - this caused a problem because sometimes the better thing was to complete the move (moving to cover). So, things were changed, this protocol will not be executed if your TC has ordered a Fast move. If your tank is still or moving something other than Fast they will trigger this protocol.

Fair warning, the laser warning and the protocol are there for a reason. Finding ways to circumvent it can yield burning wrecks.

[Chibot Mk IX]

Maybe, you should hit "Pop smoke" twice before the contact, this will deplete smoke grenade. Make you AFV occupy a position, then hit "pause"

Hopefully this will solve the problem  

[Attilaforfun]

Know this...smoke dischargers cause fires in training areas. They are thus simulated and rarely actually used in training events. Result? When engaged in gunfights with insurgents armed with RPGs the troops do what they've been trained to do...not use the smoke. Ask me how I know. Think of all the Iraq footage you've seen. How often do you see clouds of manufactured smoke? Hint...you don't. Looking back it should have been SOP at contact...we have thermal sights.

This is something near and dear to my heart. Should any of you have any influence with those in training command DEMAND they use smoke at all training events. The Mech soldiers here know what I'm talking about. This is a real deficiency.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Attilaforfun

[MikeyD]

Automatic response to being painted by a targeting laser is meant to save lives. There's no time to ponder if you can forgo popping smoke this one time. Because in a couple seconds you may experience a big BOOM! CMBS is functionally 'near future'. The more automated and sensor-driven the vehicle systems get the more troublesome the unintended consequences are.

[DerKommissar]

On 11/18/2019 at 4:33 PM, IanL said:

No but you can influence things a bit.

It is standard protocol - as advised by RL tank commanders.

Thanks for the tip, I may have tested it out by sending a Bradley IFV hurling through into the enemy line. Once the FAST order was completed, they saw a tandem warhead RPG pointed at them and retreated. They survived. TCs have self-preservation instincts, apparently.

21 hours ago, Attilaforfun said:

When engaged in gunfights with insurgents armed with RPGs the troops do what they've been trained to do...not use the smoke. Ask me how I know. Think of all the Iraq footage you've seen. How often do you see clouds of manufactured smoke? Hint...you don't. Looking back it should have been SOP at contact...we have thermal sights.

Now that you mention it, in most tank combat footage I've seen (Syria, Iraq) -- AFVs almost never pop smoke. Even under fire. Be it an M1, Leo 2, BMP2 or T-72 -- they all carry smoke discharges, why not use them? Training issues are something one does not consider.

[Rinaldi]

I used to hate the laser warning receiver (LWR) too - and I know of one other skilled player here that still detests it for the same reasons I did - but I've come to love them. If you're able to stop fighting it and let it do its job it saves lives. Especially now with the hull down command - rather than having to manually screw around finding a perfect hull-down and then have to weigh the risks of how long I want a tank to pause there, I just give the hull down with full confidence that the LWR will make the tanks back down the slope into cover if they get painted before they spot a threat. 

[Vergeltungswaffe]

On 11/23/2019 at 5:44 AM, Rinaldi said:

...I just give the hull down with full confidence that the LWR will make the tanks back down the slope into cover if they get painted before they spot a threat. 

Ding ding ding...we have a winner.

[Pelican Pal]

Yea, this is one of the recurring problems with TacAI that we have. It has no context for the actions that it takes - creating situations where a lazed vehicle will reverse itself into certain death. High on my CMx3 wishlist is an honest to god SOP system so we can edit orders to fit the context a unit is in. IIRC, a vehicle will ignore a laze warning if you give it a pause command. Although it has a been a while since .I played through CM:BS.