More floating information needed for Real-Time?

[xian]

I've been pretty much exclusively playing in We-Go format since CMBNs release, but just recently I thought I'd have a bash at RT.

Wow - it's hard. I can't move my mouse fast enough to keep up with all the action. I don't have a clue as to the status or condition of any of my units and miss a large proportion of important events.

So. This brings me to two points:

1) Does anyone have any advice?

2) Shouldn't there be more overhead (floating) information in RT mode? I remember that CM1 had a lot of options for overhead info - and it wasn't even a RT game.

[Erwin]

1) Advice: Don't play in RT as it sucks (and if you pause every few seconds to redo orders, it is most unrealistic).

[Mord]

I remember that CM1 had a lot of options for overhead info - and it wasn't even a RT game.

Only overhead info I can think of off hand, that CMX1 had, was hit texts...and CMBN has those.

Mord.

[Guest]

I really enjoy RT. I just try not to micro-manage. Give sweeping orders, make use of pause to adjust them if necessary (which is actually pretty rare unless I make a mistake initially). I find that the AI handles itself well. Yes, I might miss things occasionally, but for me that creates a better illusion of not being 110% in control. And I still get to watch all of the cool stuff, but it feels more frantic. I feel more immersed.

I don't find that I'm lacking for information while playing RT. I suppose compared to being able to check every unit and taking as much time as you need to give orders, you can't possibly access the same amount of information, but I've gotten good at quickly discerning the current gist of a particular unit. Just like managing orders well in WEGO, it takes practice.

[SteveP]

(and if you pause every few seconds to redo orders, it is most unrealistic).

I still don't understand that viewpoint, though it appears to be one shared by a lot of players. Restricting orders to one minute intervals doesn't seem too realistic to me. Also the AI is handicapped by that restriction, since it doesn't know how to optimize orders to deal with the one minute intervals. In RT, the AI is constantly able to update it's orders as needed (as you are, but only if you pause -- the AI doesn't need a pause). To me, that is the most cogent advantage to RT if you play against the AI. The only disadvantage is the inability to replay a turn over and over again. But I don't find that to be a problem as far as giving orders is concerned.

[para]

1) Advice: Don't play in RT as it sucks (and if you pause every few seconds to redo orders, it is most unrealistic).

RT doesn't suck it's quite exciting in my opinion

[Mike Churchmoor]

1) Advice: Don't play in RT as it sucks (and if you pause every few seconds to redo orders, it is most unrealistic).

General rule: if you want challenge, play pbem. Cheers!

[sburke]

you are all wimps, I play blindfolded!!! It saves time worrying about mods and all sorts of stuff. and there are no bugs that I have noticed whatsoever....what's that, there are no DD tanks? Are you sure?

[Destraex1]

I've been pretty much exclusively playing in We-Go format since CMBNs release, but just recently I thought I'd have a bash at RT.

Wow - it's hard. I can't move my mouse fast enough to keep up with all the action. I don't have a clue as to the status or condition of any of my units and miss a large proportion of important events.

So. This brings me to two points:

1) Does anyone have any advice?

2) Shouldn't there be more overhead (floating) information in RT mode? I remember that CM1 had a lot of options for overhead info - and it wasn't even a RT game.

Real time is my primary as well although I am am enjoying WEGO PBEM it is a very very slow slog with 60 second turns.

I have the same problem as you. The mouse control is often just too slow, clunky and innacurate to allow me to get around. I think if the engine used

all CPU cores things would be considerably smoother and easier to control. (I need to get a new computer.. mines an aging q6600 8gig 64bit win7 machine)

I imaging learning hot keys would help a lot.

Of course you can also pause the game at any time to give orders.

[LJFHutch]

RT is awesome, you just have to learn to not micromanage your units.

Focus on the important stuff: your attacking forces, units that are in combat and need adjusting etc. Most of time most units don't need to do anything but wait for orders anyway so it's not much of a problem, especially in meeting engagements.

And as for the realism of RT: player controls all forces because they can't control themselves properly and if they could and the player didn't it would either (A not be fun at all or (B be a first person shooter.

[hoolaman]

Only overhead info I can think of off hand, that CMX1 had, was hit texts...and CMBN has those.

Mord.

CMx1 had an option called "labels" with a text status like "routed" "low ammo" hovering above the units and displayed in various colours. It was quite useful but hella ugly and I don't think many people used it.

[Otto Dixlesic]

I do find it also very difficult to play H2H real time; A "show all fire lines" like in CM1 would be very useful so we don't have to click one by one all mortars, spotters, Mg's etc every time. It's very easy to miss them when doing an area target.

One thing that IMHO would improve the game enormously would be to create a colour code for the icons to check for morale, physical condition, number of casualties, ammunition, etc. click on morale for example and OK units have green icons, nervous yellow, panic red. that would help : )

In CM1 we had the option of showing the units bigger; I used that a lot to give me an idea of where the action was happening in big battles, you could see a unit covering or shooting immediately that way, in CMBN takes much longer.

My experience in multiplayer is that the lack of visual clues (and sound clues as well, since many weapons share sounds) make it go very chaotic very quickly: You want to advance a platoon, you can't select the whole platoon and give them an order of moving without having to go squad by squad and give them a waypoint, while you're doing this, enemy artillery is falling somewhere else you go there and get your units out of the area, in the meantime the platoon you were moving previously has become separated you get them together again if nothing else happens for a bit.

I think CMBN right now is a real time game with a turn-based UI.

Enemy contacts not seen by the player, disappearing in nanoseconds and creating an unclickable icon does not help either.

[Erwin]

How do you reckon "very few people" used "Labels?" Personally, I had it on all the time and liked the feature.

I agree, the removal of some CM1 features in CM2 make CM2 harder and more time-consuming to play. It's weird to see a system go backwards in some aspects.

[Otto Dixlesic]

I used labels in CMx1 a lot as well, although it used to get confusing when there was lots of damaged buildings also showing their own labels.

I hope BFC will fix that some day

[Vinnart]

I dabble in RT, but prefer CM in WEGO. I agree that just a few more features in this area would make for major improvements for RT play. I think we would all agree that some of the features for improving situational awareness that have been added since the beginning of CMx2 have been steps in the right direction, and do make all the difference. I am referring to the addition of the FLICKERING ICON for casualties, and the FADED ICON for when units are in the RED that were later added. What is missing now is a marker to show when a unit is in the YELLOW. I could see this being done graphically a few ways that would have to be experimented with to see which effect works best. Yellow markers would appear if unit are TIRED, SHAKEN ect.., and would disappear when unit is fine again. Here are some possible ways:

A yellow outline appears around icon.

A small yellow bar appears over icon

A yellow dot appears inside of the icon perhaps either in the center of the black silhouette, or within the icons negative space.

Another thing that has been suggested is a RADIO TRAFFIC LOG much like TOW has. This would put RT play more on an even playing field with WEGO where the player can stop, pause, and rewind to gather a clearer picture of recon information. Much of this type of info can be missed by the RT player, which takes away from realism IMO. Imagine you were leading a recon platoon and the only thing they were allowed to report back to you all the time is the generic “We spotted an enemy”. In real life the leader would want to know what type of weapons did you see? Was it a tank? A machine gun? What? One cannot make many intelligent decisions for proper tactics without the info that the WEGO player gets. In looking at the GUI this may be a sensible place to put it as shown in this quick thumbnail sketch. The precision of the info would coincide with the playing mode from basic to iron. Double clicking on unit brings camera to unit. Double clicking on enemy brings camera to that enemy or contact icon.

Other improvements that would improve the situational awareness at a GLANCE is to bring back some color indicators for the AMMO. In comparing CMSF to CMBN, CMSF is quicker at a glance to getting the ammo picture for the unit. Integers are good for when you want or need precise information, but color indicators give a much quicker processing of the general situation. Perhaps done up like this:

The fact of the matter is RT play no matter what game I have played has had levels of frustration connected with it. This frustration takes away from the fun part, which is the concentration on tactics and strategy. The idea is to take as much of that frustration element out as possible, and concepts such as these do that.

[Mord]

CMx1 had an option called "labels" with a text status like "routed" "low ammo" hovering above the units and displayed in various colours. It was quite useful but hella ugly and I don't think many people used it.

LOL...wow, all these years...when did they start? CMBB? I don't recall ever seeing them.

Mord.