slysniper

I am actually impressed that Pelican Pal has managed to stay around here for 173 post. He must really love these games. I mean , when one has 400 games and a itch to scratch about once a week to get something new. he has pushed himself way out of his comfort zone. That money spent for the 3.0 updates really should have bought him something else. I think we should start placing bets as to how long he can hang in until he just move on and get back to buying and playing games to get to that 500 number.

Well, then there is people like me, who loves to place units close to a building the enemy is collapsing, when it then happens, I move them troops in normally under all the smoke it creates. So talk about mind games.

Well, if you want control of your air units, best keep a version of 2.12 on your machine. That appears to be all that you can do

I am looking forward to the Black Sea game. Since I never did the CMSF series, I can see myself getting way too involved in that game, since maybe it will be the first time I can set up some different battles where there is a challenge to the forces that face each other. Also a little more flexibility in what the maps will let us model. I cannot believe I still do not own any modern war stuff through BF, But I am sure this will finally fit my needs as to what I can and will do with it.

All I know is the forum was dead for awhile, then along comes Pelican Pal. What a chap he is, he sure knows how to get every ones panties all tied up in a knot. And he just cannot stop once he starts either. He just keeps retyping the same things over and over and by some magic he will brain wash us all to believe in his ways of how things should be. We will riot, we will swarm, we will force BF to conform to the will Of Pelican Pal. Well at least he has kept some activity going on the site for awhile, but he is really getting old and it is sad that we cannot get some decent threads going instead of this junk.

Yes there is two groups of thought. The problem is, you cannot expect what you see in the gaming industry to play out here. Two basic reasons. The size of the company and how much profit is being made is one factor. When you sell millions of copies of something. Yes you can aford to set a budget for a few updates and support to a game for free as to trying to keep your customers loyal. You do realize that this company is a handful of guys working likely from their homes and that they have budgeted for living and to keep the company afloat and that is because of the sells level of the game, they are making a living. But It is not like they are getting rich doing this. ( And it is amazing they are doing that since most small companys go broke within a very short period.) Second Reason, this game is actually very intence in the amount of programming and how it works, Please show me something in that ball park from a small company with a handful of guys. Not the firms with Hundreds of people working on it, and then lets compare again. Face it, you keep trying to place these guys in a basket that they do not belong in. You cannot compare apples to orenges, it does not work. So accept what they are willing to offer, or not. It does not matter, but yes it reflects on your IQ when you keep suggesting that they should change. How they run their bussiness is their decision, not yours.

Still not even close to what I paid for ASL many, many ,many years ago, with its modules. Oh wait a minute, not a good example, since I sold them and got my money back plus some when I finally was willing to part with them. People do really show their IQ level on this forum at times. You would think if they played this type of game they were smart, but I see below 60 scores with their attitudes at times. (Childish and think the world owes them something) Anyway, let them whine, if they cannot see the benifits so be it. Just the feature to run bigger maps and more features is worth the added cost. Now I will agree that what it is providing right now might seem minimal, but given time it will show its value with what is created because of the new features. For once I am in no hurry to get it, since it adds little to my needs, but I hope that when the next module comes out that I can maybe pick it up at that point and then I might get it for $5 as a bundle. Now that would be a shame.

Yes, they are pretty good at that, but playing the German side I did find they were not immune. I am pretty sure I lost one to the guns from the front and the cats sure can take them out also. Plus they are likely to take flanking shots. Now after playing it from this side, back when the game came out I played it as the Americans. I think this could be a pretty interesting h2h scenario. I wished I would have played it in the format. I lost 4 tanks, One was a Panther to a front shot, I know two were Mk4's but I am not sure what the other tank was. But I also lost a gun on another Panther. If it was a human player, the assault would be much more challenging. because the flank would adjust to the threat much better. and the cats would be used in a better manor.

As I recall the designer mentions this should be played as the Allies, Not the Germans Thus the reason I do not pay attention to the orders on briefings much. Half of the time the designer is trying to get you to do the worst thing. Send scouts up on rail, draw fire to their direction, then slide leader unit into a viewing position. make spot, immedietly slide back down off rail and wait for spotting rounds. Repeat. When spotting rounds drop. yes they still toke fire, yes a few guys died, yes the first mission was off target and had to be cancelled. and what else did I have to do than to keep the enemy honest since I did not know they would not attack and my scouts were spotting the AT guns and I had the time to use. I was not trying to insult you ability, sorry that the game is boring from the German side, not like I designed it. Sorry I did not know what the AI would do, only played the thing once and that was years ago when it was first released. As for exploiting the game, no. I made the decisions any intellegent leader would do. Why would you piece meal yourself when you dont need to because you have great terrain to hold the enemy off until all your forces are available. patience and timing is one of the most important skills in combat. Not vidio game action from start to finish. Plus the assault was very enjoyable and is challenging to do well when the time comes. It is no cake walk. So it was worth the wait.

I played the German side of the battle vs the AI on elite tonight to see what is needed. First, as the German, you have no need to try and attack until you have all your reinforcements available. Second you need to hold the farm and RR tracks and that is enough for a win. The last thing is to cut the roadway off, you do not need to take the whole thing. Just cut it off to the Allies and you have a major win. So you set all your support weapons in the forest line on the back of your area and cover the tracks and wait, go ahead and move the infantry up to the tracks at the 3 important areas along it and let them help secure your side of the tracks. Now I tried while I waited for the 35 minutes to get all my armor to have the HQ's sneak up and order arty on some of them AT gun locations. It Did not work all that well. but I managed to get some damage on two guns at the cost of a couple of men in the HQ units. If the allies attack the tracks, you have a nice welcoming force for them to wreck their day. (but that did not happen in my game.) Once my armor was all there. I let the arty drop a smoke screen on the tracks just left of the far right flank and then attacked with four Panthers, 6 Mk4 and an platoon of infantry up that wooded road on that flank. The smoke and woods cut off the view of the allies on the far side of the map to your attack and I had plenty of firepower to clear the tanks, guns and infantry on that side only. It is costly, but all I need is to get to the road and the battle is mine. After that the Allies on the far side attacked the RR tracks. But I still had a good size fire group waiting on my side of the track and I also had the flanking shots from the ground force I had whick had cut off the road, So the American moved into a meat grinder and pretty much destroys the majority of their units. If I get a chance I will post a screen shot if you need any more clarity.

CAN I WHINE ABOUT THE WHINER'S HERE OR DO I NEED TO GO START ANOTHER UN-OFFICIAL THREAD TO DO THAT. The only thing I have to say, if you dont have the money to buy the product at the present price. No matter what your issue is then move on. Find something else instead of trying your hardest to get them to change their pricing here. I really have no pity for someone that wants it to cost the same as some other games, because they want to own 20 crappy games and this one also. If you like this game at all, pretty much you dont need to be wasting your money on anything else. Plus if you have all that time to play so many games, no wonder you dont have the money for this one. If you dont have a job, limited income (that is no excuse) In this country anyway, anyone that really wants a job can still get one - the problem is not that there is no jobs, the problem is people who will not accept some types of work or that they really want to work (exspecially since they can get a goverment check, sit on their ass and play computer games all day). :eek: I only have pity for those that have real issues as to why they have limited income. And few that be that fit real challenges in their life that prevents them from working, but some there are and I take no offence towards them if they should read this.

Yes, to all the above. But I like to run these test often to see what is good engagement ranges for tank to tank duels. It is typical to see a side consistantly take the advantage and win. Normally the losses vary alot, but swinging a victory is seldom unless there is some equality. To get such drastic different results in such a few games, that only comes when there is some equility in the match up.

ok, ok I need to re-qualify my statements.( which were wrong) I just did some quick testing but found a very interesting thing out. As for the units, it is a real toss up as to who has the advantage at range. I did a test battle at 1300 meters with all the armed units in the game, just 4 times to see what would happen. There is (15) T34-85 against (8) Pv4 with some misc. other equip. The results game 1 kills: 8 German tanks to 1 Russian tank in 2 minutes game 2 kills: 4 German tanks to 13 Russian tank in 4 minutes game 3 kills: 4 German tanks to 15 Russian tank in 3.5 minutes game 4 kills: 8 German tanks to 8 Russian tank in 3 minutes So in just 4 test I had the battle swing both ways twice in just a few minutes I selected 1300 in that it was the distance approx. of the duel in the game I played. So actually, it is a great game as to the match up of units. I still think the Russians have the Terrain advantage, plus with more units it also can be a advantage as to getting flanking positions. but it can also be a disadvantage if you cannot coordinate enough units at once into proper firing position. So this battle is likely one of the more balanced scenarios out there.

In MY H2H match. I tried just that with the Germans. I went for a long range engagement and hoped that would help my armor. I tried to locate in hulled down positions and to have all 8 tanks in a position to particibate in any fire fight that might occur. My opponent did a good job of moving up on his right flank and setting his armor in the woods and small village on his portion of the map in that area. That was where my battle began, with the extra armor he had I was not getting in more hits and I was finding his rounds finding and hitting targets at range were doing just fine. Plus many of my rounds were bouncing off armor where as few of his deflected. Needless to say. I think I lost 3 tanks to 2 in the first minute or two, then 2 more before I coulnd disengage totally to maybe one of his. So now I had 3 tanks vs 9 tanks after have lost 5 to 3 in the first part of the battle. So I am not sure I would preach that Long range German fire is going to win the battle for anyone. It sure would not be my approach to it again. But I have not sat down and tested to see if there is a perfect range that the panzer's might have the advantage that shows up well in the game.

Well, after playing it h2h, I did run it as the Germans vs the AI and it made for a pretty good battle. I won as the Germans playing it that way, but i also knew what I was facing and what I needed to do with my Armor, so I think this battle is designed well to play as a German vs the AI for a first run. But It is not a balenced situation for H2h. But as is pointed out. Given the decisions, skill levels and so forth of players. There is always a chance someone can win from the challenging side. So whoever that was playing as the Germans, they can feel real good about the win.

HOLOGRAPHIC images that I can climb into that lets me feel like I am really in the game. (oh, am I stretching just a little too far as to what to expect) Well since this a dream thread, why not go Big

Losing as the Russians is not a good thing. I think the scenario favors them. They have the terrain advantage and the ability to get into flanking shot positions. They have the armor advantage. So Maybe the Germans have a infanty advantage, but in a tank duel scenario, that does not mean much. I sure like to hear someone explain how this scenario does not favor the Russians

Well, that is not the AI's fault there. But that is not what I am taking about. Since cm2 has came out I can only recall one time the AI made an attack that was actually challenging and it somewhat made sense what it was doing. I just don't think it is worth wasting time on, it is not well programmed. It might be worse than CMX1, at least there I could count on it doing a pretty good job if you let it play the defensive side and gave it extra troops. For some players it might be good still for learning how to play. But even then, it really is not teaching them anything they need to play a person. Face it, they are not trying to spend time in that part of the programming anymore. Too much effort for no real return as far as making money.

Well, as I mentioned, I played both sides H2H. So I thought that king Tiger seemed pretty tough and I was looking for a way to turn the battle for the Germans, so I tried to duel with it against a group of 6 T34/85's at about 1100 meters. Figuring my odds were ok as to nothing bad happening. Managed to kill 2 tanks and had received about 20 hits by that point. But the dreaded malfuction gun occured, which ended any thoughts of it going on to glory. I am starting to think the odds of gun damage increase the father away the enemy is. Since the AI always aim center mass. There is more rounds hitting in the area of the gun as the range increases. Just a concept, I have not tested it out.

Except in CM2 we have been limited, The best one so far has been CMFI and the module. At least there was some units and troops that were unusual or challenging to play with. Italians were hard for me at first to learn to play with. Winning some h2h matches with them make you fill pretty good. :eek:

The only way I use it is by going in and selecting the units and the map. That is about the only way I have found to make it interesting at all and there is the issue of AI unit placement of troops and how they are used. So in general, I cannot play it blind and when I play it, the Ai is non - existant. So QB's are pretty much only good for h2h, and I will take the maps now over the old concept of a computer generated one. (some of them were terrible in the old format) So I dont get why so many think the maps are the issue - it is the other aspects of it. The maps are ok in my book (except the cmbn original ones) And they can be fixed if you invest some time

Forget the Puma's, I get sooooo Tired of almost every German battle having Tiger 1's I am certain I have destroyed 10 times the total number ever made just in the scenarios I have played over the same amount of years.

Well, I did the proper thing and killed the King Tiger with an ass shot. Only required one round from that direction

I am just finishing this battle in HtoH play and we played each other from both sides. First if the players are both good I would say the chances of winning from the German side is about 0%. The terrain favors the Russians, the scoring favors the Russians, the equipment and men favor the Russians , mostly because of the numerical advantage. Panthers are not hard to take out with the 85's. You just need the numbers, or first shots or shots from the side. The only thing the Germans have going for them is that King Tiger. Which Is pretty invincable to 85's from the front ( I only did a test run of about 200 shots in total but never have seen anything other than a damaged gun and yes that was even at close ranges of 100 meters.) The only suggestion I have is get German Armor on that left flank hill and make it hard for the Russians.) Against the AI, it is easy to win as the Germans (again taking the left hill is the key, vs the AI it becomes a Turkey shoot once there and they start to expose their flanks.

You are very correct. I hate most conversions that many tried to make. I did a few myself that worked out but I had to forget the scale of the map in many ways, exspecially if towns or citys are involved. IN CM you need to down size the distances in city maps to make it work right. Plus as you pointed out, to get balence in play you just cannot throw the same troops into the battle and get the same feel of a game. You need to go in and adjust the units some also. But that can be done without having to change the number of troops. Just the aspects, leadership,morale, weapons and supplies and such. If you try to just match it, it is trash. That map that is created, is way too large for what you want, if you are trying to match the feel of the old game. And dont forget objectives, you have to rethink a different approach as to how to score it also. Needless to say, get creative and use the old game as a very rough template and dont get caught up in trying to match it much other than the general concept and it would turn out much better.