cool breeze

Do the USA squads have an extra officer/leader?

Two ideas, sorry I'm just throwing em out instead of checking. Does the 3 teams of the USA squads provide one more binocular than the Nazis? Is the position of the sun perfectly fair? if one teams looking into the sun it would make a difference.

Its late and im tired and i know this is in bad taste and what have you, along with being a couple pages late, but.... Stiener14, always good for a laugh.... oh wait hes not funny

When ever I do that kind of thing I only notice once the whole platoon or company or whatever has already ran into the open and started taking fir.

Word. Always great to have all your biggest guns ready to fire if not firing.

Y'all already covered this one well but I wanted to add that you especially had to keep an eye out for it in Shock Force because there were a lot of tanks with remote control 50 cal.s that would go gray when they ran out of ammo until you unbuttoned to reload.

I was going to hurry out of here for safer territory, hoping to make it out before catching any flak. But then Nidan1 HAD to go and bring up my dangly bits and talk smack about THE BEST CITY ON THE PLANET. So now I gotta stay in these foreign part a bit while I think about who to challenge.... ..... BWAHAHAHAHA! ....

Uh just a little lost and accidentally wandered in here, read this, and now i cant stop laughing and grinning ridiculously. Better get out of here while I can!

"I would still like to see, on one of my scenario maps, dense forest on heavy forest terrain having a bigger impact on concealment/cover than orchard trees on dirt. Maybe I will some day (perhaps when I figure out what I am doing wrong)." "perhaps when I figure out what I am doing wrong" Implied that you might be trying to figure out what. But I guess I was mistaken. Your just here to tell us how it 100% definitely is.

Wait hang on I just read the whole thread and nobody said anything like that stuff? You say you want to figure out what your doing wrong but your putting words in every ones mouth, discouraging them from helping. I guess your using too big of trees too close together. I remember from Shock Force that orchards work like you'd expect, you can see well straight down the rows and columns and a bit down some diagonals too. I see you think the soldiers should be seeing quite clearly all around because of the dirt... I think this is a product of modern farming with mechanical terrain leveling. I think an orchard on natural ground would probably have ground uneven enough that you cant just lie down and see through the bottom 1 foot all over the place because the bottom one foot is at different heights.

Cats vs. Dogs is the perfect size for your first one and was my funnest so far. It was super fun from both sides. I played USA first, it was a blast, its easier than the German side. Platoon Patrol is good and the right size too and it was fun but some of the germans were one the wrong sides of the hedges which made it too easy. but maybe that was a fluke.

v is also good for "gamey" area fire. see a enemy unit. click on it to move camera over it. press v, select friendlies, and give area fire.

like a jeep that fits a whole squad?! I want one! lol oh wait i mean armored jeep

LOl! Yeah! Its always good to check the crown molding before deciding how thoroughly you wanna trash someone. And is it cheating for me to use my super skills that don't give you a chance? Slysniper, when you invite out your friends and or associates to a game and catch them cheating, what do you do next? Do you talk to them about it or pretend you didn't notice but then stop asking them out or what?

But out of curiosity I ask y'all, If your playing poker and you seem to be the only one who saw or at least noticed what card one was (for example you barely see someone get tossed a queen of hearts) as the dealer is dishing them out, do you tell everybody and have em re deal? Or what? I just try not to notice such thing cause I don't wanna be making people redeal to much....

I just meant having quick eyes in poker, not trying to look over their shoulder or whatever. But anyways I was just joshin ya.

If I win some extra money in a poker game cause I saw your cards when you accidentally showed em with out noticing, does that mean Ill forget to pick you up at the airport? How will I cheat or be untrust worthy next?

I want to use my first PBEM US half tracks backwards on my future first opponent so I get both mgs firing right away. So what law am I likely to break or friend will I cheat (and how) after that??

I heard that in CMSF there was a tinny chance a soldier COULD go from red to yellow from buddy aid. But it was very rare.

Yup. Sometimes i think its even worth the risk of stacking guys extra thick if you really need the extra firepower from THAT spot. Like you can do at the edge of a hedge row where the 3 team squad gathers on 2 spots.

I think they will move within an action spot or a floor of a building but not beyond.

Quote: Originally Posted by Broadsword56 Kneeling and firing over the top of a low stone wall might have worked at Bunker Hill or Gettysburg, but it would have been a dumb thing for a trained infantryman to do in WWII. This is how the basic 1940 infantry manual FM-100 taught soldiers to use cover: Apples to oranges. I'm not testing guys behind a wall vs. guys prone in cover. It's guys behind a wall vs. guys with no cover. Quote: Testing a bad tactic and then saying it's the game's fault that the troops die isn't really fair to the game or its designers. Completely missing the point isn't fair to me. The question isn't is whether shooting from behind a wall is be best possible tactic, but if it is a better alternative to no cover. __________________ the test you wanted trys to get rid of all the main advantages of the wall. The wall give you great cover while your hiding behind it. Its also a bit better to be crouching behind it while being shot at from multiple directions than it is to be lying in the open while shot at from multiple directions (now this is a guess only, based on how a prone soldier is a much bigger target from the side than a crouching guy behind a wall is from the side). One of the big advantages is not that its way better to be staying up crouching behind a wall while you trade shots with a guy 100 meters away who is lying down and pointing right at you than it is to be that guy. Similar amounts of your body are exposed without cover but the guy lying down is gonna be aiming better on average. So why are you having them only shoot straight across? I think most people find that being shot at from multiple angles and shooting at stuff from multiple angles in more the norm in these battles than everybody doin like you want with your new targeting light straight across plan. Can we try the test with a wider map and or less men plus having guys with no rifle grenades instead of using target light orders? And I dont think broadswords point was that prone in cover was better than behind a wall in the open, I think it was that the army didn't consider low walls to be among proper cover to be using to fight. His point was that your test was about a Gettysberg style battle using ww2 weapons with 2 companies of troops that were most probably more fanatical (and definitely mindless) than any 2 US companies.... isn't lying in the open a more ww2 era tactic than putting a whole company shoulder to shoulder at a wall to fight some dudes 100 meters away?

@ Vanir, answering from last to first. Sorry Vanir I didnt really mean to suggest that you rigged it on purpose, I hadn't even thought about who had made the test. That the test mighta been made to show the desired result was just a stupid though that flashed through my head. Sure the soldiers would prefer the wall, it gives them somewhere to hide, in real life they can intelligently know when to be up and when to hide when to move. But that doesnt mean that the game isnt doing a good simulation of what you are asking for. If you set this up in real life just like in the game, but all the soldiers are insane fanatics told to fight as hard as they can or die trying, and not duck unless they are being pathetic sissies cause they werent ordered to duck or move, it might well play out just like your test. and no matter how fanatical the troops I think some are gonna duck when they have the wall, while the guys lying down have no where to duck. if they weren't fanatic they just poop pants and stop fighting (cause this fire is intense enough to make even fanatics want to duck) but they are fanatic so they just keep fighting. The guys at the wall are brave as hell and barely duck (not as much as they prolly should) but they still do duck anyway. when they duck they lose their targets and aim. The prone guys arnt Fing around like that they are just aiming and firing and reloading. What a soldier wants is not always what is good for him or for his team in the battle being fought. The unit density looks different. The guys at the wall are all shoulder to shoulder on the wall, the guys lying down are somewhat spread out. It seems like they might even have 2 or more action spots spread in distance from enemies but I cant tell. And finally thanks a lot for taking the time to test this in the first place and then to try again to make the testing more complete. i suggest you also try dramatically reducing the unit density. I think the walls work kinda like buildings in that when your all spread out they offer good protection but as density increases they start being liability. You might have to blow down the whole house just to injure the one guy hiding in it but if you pack that same house full of men one big HMG burst or a single HE round might have a hard time NOT killing anybody. Plus the more spread out it is the more vulnerable the prone guys are cause of the flanking. Oh and in CMSF grenade launchers rocked as in murdertown, and in RL arn't the ww2 rifle grenades much more powerful than their 40mm modern grenade launcher counterpart? I dont know cause I havent played CMBN much yet but it seems like those rifle grenades would be do a lot of damage. No?

Honestly the test seemed so bad to me I wondered if it had been build for that special result. Thanks for straightening things out ASL veteran.

LOL at Stiener making ANOTHER THREAD! Seems you want ALL the attention. You order your men across the field toward the enemy. You men thinks its probably suicide. They go anyway cause its their job. 20 seconds later half of them are dead and the other half are peeing themselves and are now sure about that suicide thing. They are no longer following your orders, they are sure its suicide. Why should it be different for hide? They will stop hiding once they KNOW its suicide, they will stop charging the enemy in the same kinda way. Every body just really wants to do what you told them to do. Your the BOSS.