Vinnart Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 According to the features list the special equipment boxes have been reduced from 12 to 6 using numbers to now show how many of an item. I think this was a smart way to consolidate the info to open up space for more things. So, far this is a mystery as to the changes it makes to the GUI as there has been no screen shot I know of of the GUI for CMFI. I predict the special equipment will now occupy the first top 6 boxes, and the new box underneath will now contain a graphic depicting the base terrain tile/building, and floor/passenger/open information! Either that, or more ammo for infantry, but the former is what my combat antenna is leaning toward. What do you guys think? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisND Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 According to the features list the special equipment boxes have been reduced from 12 to 6 using numbers to now show how many of an item. I think this was a smart way to consolidate the info to open up space for more things. So, far this is a mystery as to the changes it makes to the GUI as there has been no screen shot I know of of the GUI for CMFI. Check this, second picture: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showpost.php?p=1375073&postcount=95 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Man, I am a sucky Beta tester. I've been playing the game and didn't notice the change! Makes you wonder what else I'm missing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinnart Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 Thanks N.Dude, I haven’t been following your battle with Bill regularly so I missed that. Thought they were keeping the GUI a surprise. As far as space goes I feel it can have been used better in the sense that we really did not gain anything more such as I described . I still will continue in the sensible wanting of floor/passenger/open status shown in the GUI. This would be more helpful rather than just having larger icons. Basically the special equipment icons are just bigger. A little disappointed in that regard. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baneman Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I would hope you're right, Vinnart, but from the pic, it appears they just made them bigger ... But it's not too late to include that information ... right, BFC ???? Hello ?? That's funny, Steve was here a minute ago ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinnart Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 I really didn't care about terrain tiles being show personally as I described since I got that down long ago. Looking at the space I thought they would have did that to mimic how it was shown in CMx1 to help the noobs. I haven’t heard much bitching about not knowing what terrain a unit is in awhile so hopefully most have got comfortable in understanding the terrain. As far as the info I want in the floor/passenger/open status I could post plenty of camera views that nobody could tell for sure unless they moved the camera to different angles, which is needless micro management. It is so much quicker, and easier to just get that info in the GUI. CMx1 had it better on that one. I hope they plan it down the road. Be all you can be. (I thought that was one of the U.S. Army’s best slogans.) Another good one I like to say that is similar is why have Miss Walmart, when you can have Miss November? Be the best, and have the best! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I haven’t heard much bitching about not knowing what terrain a unit is in awhile so hopefully most have got comfortable in understanding the terrain. I still wish, multiple times in every game, that some info on the construction of the tile could be displayed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatoichi Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I like the fact that special weapons etc. will now just have one icon each and the number of pieces/rounds remaining will be displayed as a number instead of multiple tiny icons. It's definitely a step in the right direction - I believe the real change to the UI will be implemented in the next 'family' after CM:FI. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 A quick thought: as much as I'd like to know what terrain type my unit is in, how can that be done if I have a 12 man squad spread over 3 action spots? Within those action spots, is there any "micro-terrain"? What if one my guys is in a shell-hole, another behind a wall, some in Type-E brush, others in woods? Ken 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 A quick thought: as much as I'd like to know what terrain type my unit is in, how can that be done if I have a 12 man squad spread over 3 action spots? Within those action spots, is there any "micro-terrain"? What if one my guys is in a shell-hole, another behind a wall, some in Type-E brush, others in woods? Ken Not a question I often ask, since the only time my squads aren't split is during setup, or if I muff a move order and they accidentally recombine (which I undo ASAP, and for the period of that combination, they're all in the same AS. Still a good point though. Most of the time, it's the AS under the cursor that I'd like to know about. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinnart Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 I like the fact that special weapons etc. will now just have one icon each and the number of pieces/rounds remaining will be displayed as a number instead of multiple tiny icons. It's definitely a step in the right direction - I believe the real change to the UI will be implemented in the next 'family' after CM:FI. I agree too as I said, it is a step in the right direction in that it consolidates that information, and assures 6 different special equipments can always be shown at once. This makes sense. It wouldn’t be good design if 100 little bullets were shown instead of an integer now would it? What they did looks as if it could have been done in smaller boxes opening space at the bottom for the info I describe mainly to make room for 1 line of text to show floor status ect.. In regard to a terrain graphic being shown in that box too I thought of that as something to fill some open space that would be there in the design I mention. The words “4th floor/Passner/Open” would only take up one line. The terrain is much more complex now in layers, and infantry dispersion so it does not fit in a neat little box. The leader however, can only be in one type of terrain at a time so I thought they might be basing it on that to try to make that fit for new guys in a general way. Again though I do not find that important info for the GUI ala Cmx1. The main thing I would like to see is the floor status, passenger/open, which is practical in reducing dealing with camera management. There was a big thread I recall about the terrain confusion in the early days, but I think most have got the hang of it as we told them they would with a little patience and experience. If the desire is to have terrain ratings in the cursor, which is the only sensible way with the terrain complexity I think it could be reduced to a number for the noobs, and perhaps to help the color blind as I am expecting this is why womble would like that. How would you compare Miss Walmart to Miss November on a scale of 1 to 10? You see one can make a rating scale in comparison for almost anything in a general way albeit not perfectly scientific. Even here if it a colorblind issues all terrains can be modded to be monochromatic color scheme. Staying on topic though my first impressions is this GUI design could use its space more efficiently. The biggest killer in eating up horizontal space is hot keys due to the words, and only a few long words at that. They are the biggest hot keys I ever seen in a game. If there just a little more horizontal space the integers could have been worked in differently using the smaller special equipment icons. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpabrams Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Man, I am a sucky Beta tester. I've been playing the game and didn't notice the change! Makes you wonder what else I'm missing. It's obvious you have "playtesting fatigue". You have been working hard, take a break. I will sub for you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinnart Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 It's obvious you have "playtesting fatigue". You have been working hard, take a break. I will sub for you. It could be that, or no offence, but some people are just more observant than others. I think I would make a good beta tester if a position opened as I have been dealing with design, use of space, color, and composition in an occupational way for over 25 yrs with credentials to back it up. If a position opens up Battlefront please give me a try as I would love to work with you. This has become a passion of mine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Most of the time, it's the AS under the cursor that I'd like to know about. I think you may have made an interesting point there. Instead of showing terrain type in the unit info box, supposing the player was to press a key not used for anything else (Option?, Control?) and a pop-up box would appear next to the cursor with the name of the terrain type in that AS. Would that present undue difficulties to program? With that, a player could quickly examine several action spots on an area of the map. Or is this just something for which most player experience no real need? Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I think you may have made an interesting point there. Instead of showing terrain type in the unit info box, supposing the player was to press a key not used for anything else (Option?, Control?) and a pop-up box would appear next to the cursor with the name of the terrain type in that AS. Would that present undue difficulties to program? With that, a player could quickly examine several action spots on an area of the map. Or is this just something for which most player experience no real need? Michael I find it's most confusing when you're looking at an isolated piece of "rough" looking terrain. Is that Heavy or Light Woods, or just "scrub" or is it actually Marsh? If there are terrain types near each other, it's not near so difficult to tell. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steiner14 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I agree it would be very, very nice to have a an optional terrain description a the cursor. Also the suggestions from Vinart seem a good improvement. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfhand Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 So what do you propose for this situation, which can arise with a rifle platoon, where each squad is occupying a different action spot, and each action spot is a different terrain type? As one who has been advocating for moveable waypoints since CMSF, this is not an issue for me. I pay close attention to terrain when I play and have never not known which type of terrain my units are on or are crossing. Which is, I guess, the long way of saying I play WEGO not RT... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steiner14 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 As one who has been advocating for moveable waypoints since CMSF, this is not an issue for me. I pay close attention to terrain when I play and have never not known which type of terrain my units are on or are crossing. Which is, I guess, the long way of saying I play WEGO not RT... I'm not a girl, too, but nevertheless it would be handy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 ^^^ ??? Back to the initial off-topic thought: a floating cursor box (opened via special key-command) would be useful. Even more useful would be an annotation if that terrain type is prohibited to certain units. E.g., "Deep Mud: No wheeled vehicles" or somesuch. Ken 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 an annotation if that terrain type is prohibited to certain units. E.g., "Deep Mud: No wheeled vehicles" or somesuch. That's already in - the movement arrow turns into a circle with a slash through it (or sumfink like that) when you hold it over prohibited terrain. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Ah, so true, and so tried. Also, so tired. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Man, I am a sucky Beta tester. I've been playing the game and didn't notice the change! Makes you wonder what else I'm missing. I'll be glad to take your place 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Just chiming in here... the amount of space that could be freed up by keeping the icons the same size as before, but halving the number of icons, is tiny. Not much would fit in there and I'd never advocate trying to either. More stuff in the UI is a bad thing unless something else gets taken out. There's already "too much" information in there for a large segment of our potential audience. The reason for making the icons larger is twofold: 1. Makes it easier for an artist to convey to the user what the item is. 2. It helps reduce the visual clutter of the UI. Less to look at = easier to look at. It's a subtle change in some ways, but it does alter the feeling of the UI in a good way. We will never have a visual display of the "current terrain" like we had for CMBB/CMAK. Just isn't possible to do as per comments already made. Remember, even a single Team can be in more than one Action Spot at a particular moment, not to mention Squads. Having some sort of "mouse over" helper is problematic too since there can be upwards of 6 or more elements to a single Action Spot. The UI has to be designed for the worst case possibility, so a system that doesn't work for the extremes isn't workable. Having said that, we can probably do something with this in the future. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 ...we can probably do something with this in the future. That's as much as I could have reasonably hoped for. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baneman Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Just chiming in here... the amount of space that could be freed up by keeping the icons the same size as before, but halving the number of icons, is tiny. Not much would fit in there and I'd never advocate trying to either. More stuff in the UI is a bad thing unless something else gets taken out. There's already "too much" information in there for a large segment of our potential audience. The reason for making the icons larger is twofold: 1. Makes it easier for an artist to convey to the user what the item is. 2. It helps reduce the visual clutter of the UI. Less to look at = easier to look at. It's a subtle change in some ways, but it does alter the feeling of the UI in a good way. We will never have a visual display of the "current terrain" like we had for CMBB/CMAK. Just isn't possible to do as per comments already made. Remember, even a single Team can be in more than one Action Spot at a particular moment, not to mention Squads. Having some sort of "mouse over" helper is problematic too since there can be upwards of 6 or more elements to a single Action Spot. The UI has to be designed for the worst case possibility, so a system that doesn't work for the extremes isn't workable. Having said that, we can probably do something with this in the future. Steve Good to know --- but any chance of a Passenger/Floor/Buttoned info word in the UI ? I know it's "more in the UI", but it is/would be extremely helpful info to have available at a glance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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