Observations and oddities part3

[drrowley]

Picture, driving blind: so Stuart runs thru and uncovers a mine field. Right arrow points to 2 mines that exploded and down arrow points to ‘mine’ sign that pop up. Clicking on the jeep shows that it (they?) did see the mines, or at least the mine sign;

So:

WHY THE HELL DID THE JEEP DRIVE INTO THE POSTED MINE FIELD??????????????? :mad:

[Boche]

was it the AI or a human?

[GreenAsJade]

I presume it was in the middle of a WeGo turn: the OP is saying "when the tank found the mine, the jeep TacAI should have cancelled its orders to enter the minefield".

The problem with this is that it is relatively straighforwards to imagine a scenario where someone will complain "I ordered this jeep to go through this minefield because I wanted to take the chance: why does it keep cancelling my orders?"

GaJ

[Boche]

thats why I asked jaja,

If its the AI, well its an AI its not human it can only do what the AI plan tells it to do.

if its Human,if it all happened in the same turn, tough luck is what comes if you play WEGO, if not and the human missed it, his error!

[BletchleyGeek]

The problem with this is that it is relatively straighforwards to imagine a scenario where someone will complain "I ordered this jeep to go through this minefield because I wanted to take the chance: why does it keep cancelling my orders?"

That would have a pretty simple answer: "Because the jeep driver wants to eventually go back with his family in Vermont in one piece".

[John1966]

That would have a pretty simple answer: "Because the jeep driver wants to eventually go back with his family in Vermont in one piece".

Quite. I, too, have experienced the frustration of vehicles in WEGO driving straight into the minefield that the vehicle in front of them just identified (the hard way). Surely the TacAI should at least override the initial move order in these circumstances? Even if it just does it the once so that you can override it yourself in later turns if you wish.

[BletchleyGeek]

Quite. I, too, have experienced the frustration of vehicles in WEGO driving straight into the minefield that the vehicle in front of them just identified (the hard way). Surely the TacAI should at least override the initial move order in these circumstances? Even if it just does it the once so that you can override it yourself in later turns if you wish.

Does/would the AI act differently when it's RT?

[John1966]

Does/would the AI act differently when it's RT?

Probably not (I don't know as I don't do RT) but at least you might just get the chance to stop the said vehicle before it continues into the minefield.

Mind you, it would still a problem in RT as you might not spot it yourself. But on the assumption that the vehicle crew have spotted the minefield revealed in front of them by a bloody big bang, then it is reasonable to expect them to at least stop and have a ponder as to whether continuing along the planned route really is a "Good Idea".

[Fredrock1957]

Quite. I, too, have experienced the frustration of vehicles in WEGO driving straight into the minefield that the vehicle in front of them just identified (the hard way). Surely the TacAI should at least override the initial move order in these circumstances? Even if it just does it the once so that you can override it yourself in later turns if you wish.

When running units down an uncleared road or path/trial in a column, With vehicle 2 thru X, I use hunt command, lead vehilce I will run at Move or Quick... solves problem of multiple vehicles hitting minefields.

[Pak40]

I'm not sure if this is the case, but it's a classic example of the C2 engine at work. The tank discovers the mines but it can't magically tell the jeep that the mines are there. Just like spotting units, the tank can only inform other units if they are in C2.

[Erwin]

All one has to do is watch video of IED's blowing up lead vehicles in Iraq or Afghanistan and you can see the reactions of the guys right behind.

[slysniper]

You just need the sound track to this event. The driver was saying. I feel lucky, watch me as I drive in the track prints through that mind field.

[Pak40]

All one has to do is watch video of IED's blowing up lead vehicles in Iraq or Afghanistan and you can see the reactions of the guys right behind.

True, but it's quite obvious from the screen shot that the jeep didn't see the explosion of the mine. It looks like they're rounding the corner of a hedgerow just after the explosion. But, I'd wager that even if they saw the mine explode the jeep still would have attempted to go across the mines. I'm not sure if the CMx2 engine actually takes all of this into account.

[drrowley]

so couldn't it be a moral thing; (driver 'hell no i'm not going thru there'). or, if not seen the turn before and now see it, 'stop'. then on next turn, if orderd to enter 'known' mine field "ok".

[Pak40]

Actually, now that I think about it, the AI will always attempt to cross the mines if that's the movement order that you gave it. Otherwise, your vehicles would never cross marked mines. And, depending on scenario design, your vehicles could be trapped for the duration of the scenario. Therefore, they designed CM to give the player the choice of whether to cross mines or not. I think a slow command will give an increased chance to navigate a known mine field but I'm not sure.

[Erwin]

"True, but it's quite obvious from the screen shot that the jeep didn't see the explosion of the mine..."

I assume you are joking lol. You'd HEAR that explosion a mile away. And there would still be plenty of time after rounding the corner to jam the brakes on, or drive off the road for that matter.

Infantry will also blindly follow their blown up mates into a minefield to be also blown up.

It's simply a "feature" of the game lol.

[Pak40]

Speaking realistically, just because you hear an explosion it doesn't mean that the driver will deduce exactly where it came from and where it hit. Besides, the explosion just as well could have been from a number of other sources such as mortar round, faust/shreck, etc.

I agree with you, as I stated in my follow up post, that they will follow blindly in CMBN.

However, even if CMBN vehicles didn't follow blindly, that jeep still would have done the exact same thing because it didn't see the explosion and sound isn't modeled so he wouldn't have heard it either. The magical sign that appears when a mine field is discovered also wouldn't have mattered because of there isn't borg spotting like in CMx1.

[LongLeftFlank]

Maybe the minefield, once triggered, could set off a 1 minute series of "aftershocks" that while producing no damage, visual or audible effect, could trigger the self-protective TacAI reflex and "warn off" other units, at least for the rest of a WeGo turn (after that it's up to you to keep your guys out of the minefield). Just an idea.

[General Jack Ripper]

I think this should be posted in a new "best screenshot" thread, if there is one... I can't help but laugh.

[Pak40]

Slim, I agree. It's a great shot. I hope all those flying bits aren't the crew because I can't see them anywhere.

[drrowley]

btw: at the top, is a red cross: no one survived.