Wodin Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I've read a few posts now from people who tried CMSF and didn't really like it and yet are awaiting with anticipation CMBN. I have to say I have no interest in post WW2 games and the fictional battle in CMSF does nothing for me at all. HOWEVER I love tactical wargames and my love for them made me fall for CMSF (though I held off for along time because of the theatre\era). When I'm playing I forget the supposed backdrop to the War and the fact it's set in a time and conflict I have no interest in...the tactical fight with it's highs and lows, the excitement of waiting for the replay to start then watching the battle unfold from as many perspectives as needed takes over. The 1:1 scale helps so much and for the first time in a very long time a really became attached to my Pixeltruppen. This is why I know CMBN is for myself going to be my all time favourite tactical game. However I feel that if the overall game mechanics in CMSF is what certain people didn't like then I can't see them suddenly falling for CMBN when released...I wonder what it is they think will make CMBN a totally different experience...yes the weapons are different....but the overall mechanics will be the same. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stikkypixie Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 They still have CMx1. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lets_All_Fight Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I love SF as much as any of the earlier games and I was someone who never thought the setting would do much for me. I'm awaiting SF2 with the same hunger as a lot of people are showing for BN - and I'm mad keen for that one too. I especially love urban maps against well trained and equipped irregulars; MOUT warfare can be a great leveller in SF, especially when, like me, you suck at it.. I suspect that it IS the setting that turned a lot of people off, for whatever reason. The simple fact is that toys like Tigers, Shermans and MG42s occupy that space in their heads that had been fed over the years by movies, comic books, stories from relatives and the first wargames or toy soldiers people had. Nostalgia - even for something never experienced first hand - is a potent thing. For myself, I know that WW2 games like this tie into the same impulse that made the games I played with a box load of WW2 airfix soldiers so much fun. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Some were complaining in advance about the lack of SS uniforms in the initial release, which makes you wonder if their interest has less to do with tactical combat simulation and more to do with...em... fashion assessories of the S&M variety. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I think the SS interest in generational. Back in the day you practically had to PAY someone to play the Allies. EVERYONE wanted to play the big bad Germans esp the SS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkEzra Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I always play Allies for WW2 (and Syria for Shock Force!?) I've been told I lack fashion sense. Could this really be my problem? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baneman Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 However I feel that if the overall game mechanics in CMSF is what certain people didn't like then I can't see them suddenly falling for CMBN when released...I wonder what it is they think will make CMBN a totally different experience...yes the weapons are different....but the overall mechanics will be the same. Got nothing against the mechanics - especially after seeing the AAR battle, I'm positively drooling over the mechanics. I'm just one of those wargamers who kinda loses interest in the periods post WWII. I'm assuming that a lot of the guys who've stuck with CMx1 are the same. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I've been told I lack fashion sense. Could this really be my problem? Could be. The Germans had the best looking uniforms in that war, hands down. That in turn was a part of their propaganda skills, which was probably the thing they did best of all. A lot of the still existing belief in their battlefield prowess and technological superiority is the product of those same propaganda skills. They knew how to sell themselves. They were just never able to close the deal. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 One more thing regarding uniforms: Years ago I came across an observation by someone whose name I have long forgotten that the snappier and more elegant the uniforms worn by a country's armed services, the lousier their government. I've found that to be almost infallibly true. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottie Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Never though i would hear myself say it after the disastrous release of CMSF (minus any patches) + i dont care for the fictional war at all ether or indeed the desert terrain .... but i cannot go back to CMx1 now (too disappointing), hooked to CMSF + all pacthes + all modules. I dont even play the campaigns/battles any more, i make my own battles and enjoy the tactical combat infantry on infantry. The 1:1 mapping , the balistic modelling over every round, reading the "how infatry combat in CMx2 is different" thread. Its a very special game indeed for the game engine alone , never mind the other stuff it comes with ... so in a nutshell this is why CMBN for my will be almost the ultimate. Its CMSF on European terrain with weapon and armour rules i understand 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodin Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 scottie...great to hear...just like myself... was it your goodself not long ago who was worried about going back to try CMSF out? If so I'm glad it got you like me... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 We've covered this many times before, but it never hurts to repeat two facts: 1. The major reason for CMx1 fans to not like CM:SF is the timeframe/setting. Some tried the modern setting, with doubts, and wound up really liking it. However, I think that's a fairly small number. The majority who don't have interest in the CM:SF setting still don't like it. Never will, probably. Which is fine with us because we never expected that type of customer to purchase/support CM:SF. 2. The initial release was, as we all know, not what any of us wanted it to be. Most people who bought CM:SF upgraded as time went on and changed their opinion of the game. The ones who fit into the above category (i.e. did not like the setting) may still have their impressions of CM:SF from 2007 because they weren't happy we made CM:SF in the first place, and therefore haven't really updated their sense of what the game engine has to offer. It's outdated information and probably tainted with a fair amount of bias against the setting rather than the game system itself. In reality CM:SF has actually sold a bit better than we expected it would when we made the decision in 2003 to do Modern. The Modules have all exceeded sales expectations. The obvious conclusion we've come to is that the reception to the setting, mechanics, etc. of CM:SF has actually been quite good from our perspective. There will always be some that won't like the changes CM:BN has over CMBO. Which is fine, because that's unavoidable. There are still HUGE numbers of Steel Panthers and Close Combat fans that hate all forms of Combat Mission. They were disappointed with CM as a whole and feel we should never have made it. Sometimes we're quite content to disappoint Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce90 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 One more thing regarding uniforms: Years ago I came across an observation by someone whose name I have long forgotten that the snappier and more elegant the uniforms worn by a country's armed services, the lousier their government. I've found that to be almost infallibly true. Michael Mmm. British army WW2 era uniforms were woeful, especially for lower ranks compared to German AND US ones. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredrock1957 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Having played all the CMx1 games and now I have played CM:SF for the last 20 months. My personal feelings are the CMx2 game engine is just awesome. Modern Combat is not really my favorite, but with the additional features added to CM:BN that I have read about, and the WWII era. This game will rock. For those who haven't tried the CMx2 engine but enjoyed CMx1, I say download a copy of CM:SF Demo and start brusing up on the interface. All I am hoping is the editor in CM:BN uses the same interface as CM:SF with the additional features I have heard of: Water, Hedgerows, Bridges, etc.... Tune it up and bring it on, I cant wait for the release. That is all... -FR 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottie Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 scottie...great to hear...just like myself... was it your goodself not long ago who was worried about going back to try CMSF out? If so I'm glad it got you like me... Yes that was indeed me i have yourself and some other good people of this forum to thank for that 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottie Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 There are still HUGE numbers of Steel Panthers and Close Combat fans that hate all forms of Combat Mission. They were disappointed with CM as a whole and feel we should never have made it. Sometimes we're quite content to disappoint Steve I came from the Close Combat back ground too , the reasons i latched onto CMBO was because of the 3D modelling and all the tactical advantages that that entails. I cannot understand why any user would prefer any Close Combat derivative over the corresponding Combat Mission as far as the actual combat phases are concerned. Granted CC has a strategic layer but that's another argument 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Mmm. British army WW2 era uniforms were woeful, especially for lower ranks compared to German AND US ones. Depends on which uniforms we are comparing. I actually rather like the British battledress better than the US, although the germans still come out on top. But the US surpasses them when we get to full dress (exception: some british units with long pedigrees, like the Life Guards for instance, put on a fine show when fully decked out). In another case, the battledress of the USMC was esthetically awful, they look like tramps. But their full dress uniforms, the blues, are utterly gorgeous. This probably represented a fairly rational decision on somebody's part. When you are in combat, there is little point in expending energy and resources on trying to look good. Those uniforms are going to get filthy, torn and bloody anyway, and as soon as you get back to a rest area are going to be burned. But you want to look sharp when you are parading before the president. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce90 Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Seems to me put a man in a German Army Schutzes' uniform, he looks ready for a parade. Put him in a US Army PFCs' uniform he looks ready to jitterbug. Put him in a British Army privates' uniform, he looks ready to service your car. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodin Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 Yes that was indeed me i have yourself and some other good people of this forum to thank for that I'm happy to have played a small part in your return to CMx2 and that you enjoyed it so much. To often you can bang on about a game to someone who goes and tries it and hates it..then resents you for making them spend money on it. Very happy indeed. CMBN is going to be a a major game I feel in my wargaimng career...really feel it will be a classic for me basing it on CMSF. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJFHutch Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 However I feel that if the overall game mechanics in CMSF is what certain people didn't like then I can't see them suddenly falling for CMBN when released...I wonder what it is they think will make CMBN a totally different experience...yes the weapons are different....but the overall mechanics will be the same. I think they will like CMBN - even though I'm sure it'll be very very similar to SF - just for the fact that it's back in Normandy. The feeling I got was there was a lot of hate just for the fact that it was no longer WW2. Edit: ok was all said and said better already XD 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theFightingSeabee Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 There will be a lot of improvements over CMSF as far as mechanics. I can't go into detail, but a lot of people who didn't like CMSF will like CMBN. For the rest of 'em... tough shatz. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sixxkiller Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 If you guys dont like CMBN, you may as well go live w/o gaming. Hopefully the previews that are coming will help show how good this game is already. Personally I love CMSF but nothing on earth can be as addictive as any WWII setting. This really is a step in a direction most should be happy with. I cant stop playing QB's myself especially the Germans vs the Germans. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kulik Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 For me lack of TCP/IP wego in CMSF was an absolute killer. I tried really hard to adapt, but the file sharing was too distracting and dragged the game down. There was only handful of games i actually finished. Then i went for realtime...oh god i was clumsy at it. And the worst thing was i didn't enjoy it, i couldn't stop to watch my troops fight and couldn't enjoy those small details the game had to offer. It got better with time, i got used to enjoy the stressful kind of gameplay CMSF offers in RT. Company level battle is the max i can handle and that's a shame cause the best battles i remember from CMx1 was battalion level. So to sum it up im looking forward to CMBN, but much more im looking forward to what CMBN will become over time when autopauserealtime or similar stuff will be added so i can have my big battles. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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