Is it just me, or is it too quiet...

[Rodent]

Is it true that there will be a Lego mode?

[MikeyD]

"...may have something to do with the fact that the majority of the intended audience for CMX2 thought that the idea of bashing Syria with the worlds most powerful army..."

Me, I see this is game is my chance to try out Rumsfeld's (and his predecessors') "lighter-faster" Army concepts through a bit of OPFOR wargaming. The opponent is largely superfluous. Syrian equipment and capabilities are going to roughly mirror any number of potential hot spots. As long as BFC doesn't create problems for the Red force where there are none and doesn't gloss-over potential Blue team issues the game's going to be a valuable learning experience. If you don't like the Syrian opponent take a piece of tape and cover the bit on your screen that will say 'Syria' on the splash screen. You can then instead write 'Yemen" or Khazakatan" on that tape. What difference would it really make?

The reason why this board's drying up is simple enough - too long a lag time between announcement and having anything to actually show us. Sure before this site we were filling the CMAK board with blind CMx2 speculation, but at least it was entertaining! I said this on another thread - I'd kill right now for a decent game engine thread instead of sitting here twiddling my thumbs.

[Cpl Steiner]

I'm looking forward to "Histwar: Les Grognards" as much as to CM:SF. HW:LG seems to be progressing nicely compared to CM:SF. With luck, I will be playing HW:LG soon and can forget about this forum. Once I'm playing HW:LG I will be happy to wait for CM:SF. If anyone hasn't looked in on the HW:LG forum, I recommend that they do as the game is looking more beautiful every day.

[panzermartin]

CMSF...a game too far perhaps?

Cutting edge graphics, numerous new terrain features, real time, relative spotting, modern warfare with zillions of high tech weapons/countermeasures, 1:1 presentation/animations etc..CMx1 was a game too far as well you'd say but this time all these look like a LOT of work for a handful of people.

Well, just a pessimistic thought that crossed my mind...deep down, I know I'm dead wrong

[GSX]

I pop in from month to month now. Sadly, no new news has arrived since the day they announced it.

Hopefully all is going well and I will continue to pop in occassionally in anticipation.

I think this may have been a case of advertising a game too soon, but reading back the forums I can see why it was done.

Hopefully the game will be ready before the 2007 premise passes by, as it will then be a historical game.

I trust the team to deliver a quality product, but then again some snippets would be welcome.

Cheers

[VonWebb]

Originally posted by Moon:

It's really simple: if it's quiet, work is being done

Martin

Not a bone but maybe ear-lobe cartlidge?

a whisper...

[Gromit]

Seems pretty cut and dried to me... a large part of the forum base for CM-whatever is attached at the hip to (wait for it!) World War II, not modern day conflict. So why hang around?

Personally, BFG has nothing for sale or in the works right now that I am even remotely interested in... oh, I understand the reasons behind needing to come out with the current day version first and even agree with them- but it sure makes for a dull time here in the ol' forums eh?

I check in every three months or so just to see if anything new is cooking. Unfortunately I feel like Yukon Cornelius "smack, smack, smack... nothin'!"

Sigh... maybe next year!

[Wodin]

Originally posted by panzermartin:

CMSF...a game too far perhaps?

Cutting edge graphics, numerous new terrain features, real time, relative spotting, modern warfare with zillions of high tech weapons/countermeasures, 1:1 presentation/animations etc..CMx1 was a game too far as well you'd say but this time all these look like a LOT of work for a handful of people.

Well, just a pessimistic thought that crossed my mind...deep down, I know I'm dead wrong

Could well be true.

I just think its a risky setting their making the game on. The development costs for a game of this size would be quite large Im sure and I jusat cant see people buying it in droves unless they are counting on all CM fans buying whether their interested in the game era/setting or not. Well to be honest I dont think they will. I love CM but I would never have bought based on this theatre/era.

Finally this realtime business is for me the hammer hitting the nail in the coffin. CM was so damn successfull due to the WEGO mechanic.

I wait to be proved wrong but Im not optimistic.

I too hope Im wrong. The lads at BAttlefront made a series that for me will always be a wargame classic in every sense of the word.

Fingers crossed.

[REVS]

Owning a Mac and being a wargamer mostly interested in WWII aint much fun right now.

Syria? Not just 'no thanks' but 'never'

Realtime? Not just 'no thanks' but 'never'

Playing CMBB/CMAK on a heritage Mac is all that's left, and that's not a lot of fun when you've got a nice new 20-inch cinema screen hooked up to a non-OS9-bootable machine sitting there unusable for gaming, while you squint at the tiny screen on the heritage model as it clunks away. Grrrrr.

The only hope is to get an Intel Mac, buy a Windoze system and a PC version of CMAK, and hope that works – which I have a nasty suspicion it won't, not without some video card carry-on, which I don't want to think about.

[Other Means]

Originally posted by REVS:

Syria? Not just 'no thanks' but 'never'

Realtime? Not just 'no thanks' but 'never'

This seems a little harsh when you've not even seen it. I hate the setting myself but I'll at least read the reviews and see if they change my mind.

To me, CM is about laying plans and gaining tactical advantage by good use of what you've got. CMSF could still have that. The US army is good, but it's not a cartoon foot from on high stamping everything it sees, it can be beaten if you do the right things with the right things.

And the real time is adjustable AFAIK.

The only *real* deal breaker for me is a lack of an asynchronous play option and we haven't heard anything about that yet. If it's pure TCP or even worst, single player then I really don't see the point. Gaining advantage over the AI or some l33t h4><0z kiddy has ZERO appeal. Some of us have kids, you need to be able to take as long as you want over games.

[Cpl Steiner]

The delay and lack of news is a pain but I have no problems at all with the setting. Assuming BFC keep things as real as in the original CM series, I will enjoy learning about how a modern battle-group works. Even if you are adamant that the setting is not for you, it is in your interests for the game to be a commercial success so BFC can make the next game, set in WWII.

I do hope BFC give us all some news soon, as the forum is becoming very despondent and negative at the moment. A simple progress report would be nice, to reassure the doubters that the game hasn't hit insurmountable problems.

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by REVS:

Owning a Mac and being a wargamer mostly interested in WWII aint much fun right now.

The only hope is to get an Intel Mac, buy a Windoze system and a PC version of CMAK, and hope that works – which I have a nasty suspicion it won't, not without some video card carry-on, which I don't want to think about.

I have seen a XP and an INTEL mac and it works great.

I don't have one, but we have one at work running XP and its fast

and the guys there are playing Quake and the other networked PC first person shooter games with NO PROBLEMS. IF you got an intel mac and wanted to run a PC version CMAK on XP my guess is it would be NO problem. I don't have a PC verision of CMAK but if I could "somehow" get a copy could test it at work.

-tom w

[Peter Cairns]

aka_tom_w,

The problem I have is that even if I buy an intel Mac, I'd realy not want to fork out about £70 for an OS that I don't think is that good. I mean how many of you that use PC games would buy a $50 version of UNIX just to play a $25 game, if the reviews said it was a particulaerly bad, if common version.

I can see Bootcamp causing a lot of people on the games side to just say if you want to play it get Bootcamp, and that will be a huge blow to Mac Games.

having said that if the number of Mac Games quickly declines then if someone who by game industry standards is small ( like BFC) makes amac version then they will probably have a hit.

The second option is for a third party who will do conversions once the PC version has peaked. as a Mac owner I am used to having to wait anyway.

Peter.

Peter.

[REVS]

Peter C

I know what you mean about the problem of paying good money for what you think is bad software, but I do love CMBB/CMAK, and I look upon paying a few hundred bucks for a Windoze operating system plus a hundred bucks for a PC version of CMAK to be justified when you think of the cost in terms of dollars, or cents, per hour of fun.

I see things this way because I'm not really a computer game freak. CMAK/CMBB is the only computer game I play. I don't spend many hours gaming, because I'm not only busy with work but I also have numerous other interests in life. But when I want to play a game, it has to be a wargame, and it has to be WWII.

This is what interests me, and for the last 20 or more years, ever since Squad Leader first appeared, my mates and I have been filinging molten TNT (that's the expression, isn't it?) at each other and we've never got sick of it. There's no way some odd decision-making by BFC is going to either change or stop our fun, but if they manage to bugger it all up thorougly and only publish silly realtime games, then it's "so long, and thanks for CMBO/CMBB/CMAK - you were great". If nothing better comes up then I'll keep on playing their games for many years, if I possibly can.

Avalon Hill gave us about 20 years of excellent gaming with their little cardboard counters and that enormous courtroom lawyers rulebook. If BFC can manage the same number of years of fun they'll do me.

I don't think good wargames come every few months. One per decade or so seems to be the current going rate. I'm not going to buy anything more unless it's simply an improvement on CMBO/BB/AK. Same theatre, plus WEGO. That's the bottom line. Oh, almost forgot, PBEM, too.

[aka_tom_w]

I'm not really a computer game freak. CMAK/CMBB is the only computer game I play. I don't spend many hours gaming, because I'm not only busy with work but I also have numerous other interests in life. But when I want to play a game, it has to be a wargame, and it has to be WWII.

This EXACT demographic (circumstance or whatever) applies me too. In fact I would suggest it describes the situation for most of the folks I have PBEMd and have met through this board.

I would guess Steve et. al. are more than aware of this demographic.

(I hope)

" I'm not really a computer game freak. CMAK/CMBB is the only computer game I play. I don't spend many hours gaming, because I'm not only busy with work but I also have numerous other interests in life. But when I want to play a game, it has to be a wargame, and it has to be WWII. "

Well put!

-tom w

[MikeyD]

BFC may be going after a different demographic than us regular "queer-for-WWII" hobbyists with CMSF. There's a lot of people who are going to be passing through the new 'lighter-faster-smarter' Army and a highly accurate tactical sim could be a great teaching aid for them. If you just entered 3-2nd Stryker Brigade as a private wouldn't you want to get in a little combat practice on your PC before seeing the real thing? Like the old slogan "A chicken in every pot" BFC might be hoping to see a copy of CMSF on every military laptop. And just imagine the sales potential for CMSF in Syria, Iran, Pakistan,Yemen, Cuba, Burma,etc. etc.!

[flamingknives]

Apart from that, there are some who are interested in modern mechanised combat, not just that which occured between 1941 and 1945.

It's the conflicts that never occured that are where simulations are really valuable. True, you need to do ones that happened to validate the results, but there are so many variables that even a WW2 scenario devolves into pure fiction very quickly.

[Peter Cairns]

CM:SF will give us 1 to 1, plus a PBEM system that will be better than CMx1, added to that that a system that can handle modern warfare from airstrikes to ATGM's will be more than up to the task of WW2, which we are going to get within a year anyway.

I don't think it's a different demographic at all, so much as creating a game engine that takes advantage of all the things that have come on stream since CMBO was designed.

Peter.

[Michael Emrys]

Plus, I suspect that there are a lot of young and very young gamers for whom WW II is only a vague notion and even Viet Nam is ancient history, something that happened in Grandfather's time, but who are into the whole Blackhawk Down, OIF mystique. BFC no doubt has eyes on tapping into that market. I can't estimate how successful they will be. Time will tell.

Michael

[Coaxial_Puppet]

Myself being on the younger part of the age spectrum here. I can easily say that myself and any friends that have played any combat mission game are not looking to much forward to a modern day game.

It's not really my cup of tea. I do hope it gets released and they get me hooked on it until they can get another world war 2 release out.

But world war 2 is where it is at for me.

Grandfather's time? Yes

but grandfather was a hero.

The war he fought used tactics to its finest.

man vs. man with machinery added.

The slow death of this board is saddening. Although i mostly lurk around.

Ive been doing so since the alpha battles of CMBO.

Any one who was there remembers all the excitement.

This board was a jive.

The famous Alpha battle had me wanting more when i didnt think i could possibly want any more.

thats whats missing right now.

[Cpl Steiner]

Coaxial_Puppet,

I must be a late comer to CM as I don't know what the "Alpha Battles" were. Please enlighten me!

I agree that there is probably some marketing strategy involved in the choice of theatres. For the average gamer, in his 20s (largely), the war in Iraq is what war is. Anything before is for the history books. A 20-year-old would not have been alive long enough to have anything to compare the current Iraq war to. In such a climate it would seem almost perverse to set the next CM game in WWII - from a purely commercial point of view.

Having said that, I think we could all benefit from something a little different to the usual staple of Panzers and Panzerfausts. Even if we tire of it quickly, it will still be a welcome change. I think BFC are hoping that the younger audience will be brought on board with the Modern Middle-East setting, and will then join us all for the ride when CMx2 moves to WWII..

..which can't be too bad!

[Moronic Max]

I suspect that there are a lot of young and very young gamers for whom WW II is only a vague notion and even Viet Nam is ancient history, something that happened in Grandfather's time, but who are into the whole Blackhawk Down, OIF mystique.

From my time at a community college a few years back, I can say you're absolutely correct there.

Somewhat frightening, really. An exchange in one of Dan Simmons' recent scifi novels (Olympos, I think it was) summed it up rather nicely. A history prof told Odysseus (yes, that Odysseus) the story of the battle for Okinawa, and his father's role in it. Odysseus, after asking about the scale of the thing, made a statement to the effect that the battle must be incredibly famous, remembered in song, and so on. The history prof said "no, actually, among my people it is almost entirely forgotten"

[Abbott]

I believe the Forum will pick up with gaming chatter again when BFC starts releasing more game information. I do have high hopes that Shock Force is a commercial success for the crew building it. I think many of you guys would agree with me when I say the crew building it has proven to be an exceptional bunch of gamers and good fellows over the years.

I don’t care much for the setting myself but Shock Force is on my must buy list as I am very much interested in seeing the new Combat Mission engine in action. Once it is built and functioning properly I think everyone will be in for an enjoyable surprise.

[Coaxial_Puppet]

Cpl Steiner

http://combatmission.com/battle/aar.asp

thats the links for the aar's for the battles.

reading those again has been a treat.

It seems like so long ago.

Hopefully we will get some info on this game soon.

These guys have yet to dissapoint me. although im not thrilled that it's not world war 2. ive never really played a modern day setting.

should be interesting.

[Cpl Steiner]

Originally posted by Coaxial_Puppet:

Cpl Steiner

http://combatmission.com/battle/aar.asp

thats the links for the aar's for the battles.

reading those again has been a treat.

It seems like so long ago.

Thanks for the link. I had a look and can see why it must have been such a thrill to read back when CM:BO was still in development. Hopefully when CM:SF reaches the same point, we will be treated to some nice beta or alpha AARs too (preferably with screenshots).

I think the problem we face is that BFC have said they are using place-holder graphics whilst they write the game code, so the game could be fairly advanced in development and still not be fit for a screenshot. This is a pity but I can see why they've done it this way around. If necessary, whilst we wait for the graphics to catch up with the game code, I'd settle for some purely text-based AARs.