My review: CM:SF is the best wargame out there

[Duke d'Aquitaine]

CMSF is the best wargame out there, feature for feature and overall. It's easy to play, hard to master, just like it's predecessors. The amount of details hidden in it only become clear after hours of gameplay.

About me: Presently with 25 years of wargaming under my belt (time flies), I clearly remember the day I loaded up Valley of Trouble for the first time. Amazement. 'Almost like being there, the Panther was moving, really moving, not jumping board hexes.' I have participated in a leading role in the Combat Mission Meta Campaign, and I wrote the one and only national daily newspaper review CM ever, to my knowledge, received in the Nordic countries. The editor still wonder how the heck I snug that review into the paper, hehe.

CMSF: The gameplay in CMSF is fluid and the sense of realism unparallelled. Infantry is both incredibly easy to get killed, and very powerful, squad for squad. Once I learned how to use them, it took time, I manage big infantry scenarios (fx Webwings 'Crossroads' campaign) with 1-3 men killed + a bunch of wounded, which seem right to me. Seeing how you can split squads, assign different task, and follow each soldier as he sets about his business is good stuff. And the interface is very good and fast.

I see how the engine has been revolutionized from CM1. The implications of the new spotting system are very big. Losing a platoon leader and HQ team has never hurt so much before, and the way you can see information travel up and down the chain of command is awesome. And the graphics update it has received is very satisfying too

Modern vs WW2: I will never understand the business rationale behind the decision of going modern instead of sticking to WW2, but then again, Battlefront is not Sony, and praise the lord for that. The marketing guys do not sit in on the development process and the whole thing seems driven by interest and passion, which is as it should be. But most wargamers out there need an epic narrative as backdrop to their battles, and the setting of CMSF just doesn't provide that. It's gritty reality, and we see it on televised news all the time. It's almost an educational experience to play CMSF, not a game. I will admit to mourning the focus on realtime gameplay - maybe I'm too old, but I'm simply not capable of controlling and monitoring a company+ worth of troops and vehicles on a big map in realtime. 'Boom' it says on the far side of the map, I zoom over there, a tank blew up, but I have no idea what happened and the units are not really reporting anything to me, neither before or after the fact. Maybe I'm still missing something, though, as I saw Steve comment that he plays in realtime and he is older than me, I believe

Also, you should perhaps consider 'flashing' the capabilities of the engine a bit more: some gamers like to sense the underlying mechanics, like we had in CM1 with the damage messages that appeared next to vehicles when they got hit

Anyway guys, I just felt I needed to vent my opinion after lurking for years here since my last post. I just never tire of this game..

PS. And if you wonder why my forum account is new, it's because I changed email years ago, and now my old venerable account info is lost.

[Webwing]

Duke d'Aquitaine,

Very nice post.

But if you want any responses you will need to add some bug reports and bash the game a bit. Then loads of people will reply.

--

[vincere]

Good point Webwing .

Duke d'Aquitaine I'd agree with most of your post since 1.6 (and me sorting some graphic card issues). My gaming experience with cmsf has been the most intense I've had for a very long time.

I'm also happy with its setting and would like to see many modules for csmf and later a return to a modern setting.

[dynaman200]

Just wanted to correct one error, the marketing guys DO sit in on the design sessions here - it's just that they are the same guys who do the coding...

I started my first PBEM game with 1.05, and am having great fun. There are still a couple bugs to sort out (low walls) but it looks like they will be sorted out real soon.

[Topo]

Duke d'Aquitaine, i'm with you 100%.

This is a Great Game, and i dream a WWII version also.

Saluti.

[Wiggum]

Originally posted by Topo:

Duke d'Aquitaine, i'm with you 100%.

This is a Great Game, and i dream a WWII version also.

Saluti.

...no, i will not buy another WW2 game...

[General_solomon]

great game. it keeps getting better. I dont think there is another game like it in the market.

[the Fighting Seabee]

Duke,

I agree. There is no other game so realistic on the market. Sure, Company of Heroes has more realistic visuals, but fails in realism.

I happen to LOVE the modern setting. In CM1 I was constantly "pretending" that it was modern. I love the ww2 setting too, but I think it was time for some modern warfare.

The details are amazing too. Some of the things that blew me away were:

1. the speed of sound being modeled (when something goes boom across the map, it takes a couple seconds for the boom to hit you).

2. Different types of artillery missions/ammo.

3. Projectile trajectory, evident in my mission "death on the sand" when you zoom in across the map from ground level.

4. Finally!... bouncing tracers!

5. Bradleys fire one round to mark/adjust fire, then unleash.

6. Map/mission/campaign editor.

7. Focus on realism vs. hollywood style combat.

8. Smoke usage and how the wind affects it.

9. Many others I can't think of at the moment.

Ofcourse there are things I would like to see added and improved, but overall I love this game.

I give it 9/10.

[Dirtweasle]

Originally posted by vincere:

I'd agree with most of your post since 1.6 (and me sorting some graphic card issues). My gaming experience with cmsf has been the most intense I've had for a very long time.

I only see the 1.05 patch available... are you sure you have 1.06?

[JohnO]

1.06 is not out yet.

[bodkin]

I know we all have our opinions about what CMSF needs in terms of patches and features, but I'm just glad I have something that doesn't require memorising a sequence of hotkeys to optimise your base building and teching, while frantically resource gathering so you can send an endless stream of troops into the meatgrinder without any real tactical thought.

Even the latest version of Sudden Strike has turned into an unlimited reinforcement meatgrinder game.

[MarkEzra]

Stylish post Duke! I think it's a great game that's gonna get greater

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by vincere:

Good point Webwing .

Duke d'Aquitaine I'd agree with most of your post since 1.6 (and me sorting some graphic card issues). My gaming experience with cmsf has been the most intense I've had for a very long time.

I'm also happy with its setting and would like to see many modules for csmf and later a return to a modern setting.

this may be a suggestion or hint that v1.06 is on the horizon and beta testers have it now for testing purposes. FWIW

[General_solomon]

Originally posted by aka_tom_w:

[/qb]

this may be a suggestion or hint that v1.06 is on the horizon and beta testers have it now for testing purposes. FWIW [/QB]

[Paper Tiger]

Good review, and I couldn't agree with you more, sir. This game has finally broken my Civ IV habit, even with the BTS expansion. Civ III broke my CMBB habit and now, here we are again, stuck on Combat Mission. The scenario editor is simply brilliant and that's wher I spend most of my game time.

I'm really hoping 1.06 will be out before next weekend.

[vincere]

Sorry guys my "1.6" was a typo.

I'm not a beta tester. I'm sure you're aware Steve has mentioned several times that 1.6 wont be far off.

[Nemesis Lead]

Originally posted by Duke d'Aquitaine:

Anyway guys, I just felt I needed to vent my opinion after lurking for years here since my last post. I just never tire of this game..

Wow--I was tired of this game after two multiplayer battles. Game has been out for 6 months and it still doesn't work as the numerous bug threads all (correctly) point out.

If I remember the URL of one of the CMSF fan websites and multiplayer ladders, I will send you the link.

Oh wait--there aren't any. Why would that be? CMSF is the best wargame ever, isn't it?

[ January 05, 2008, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: Nemesis Lead ]

[FaxisAxis]

Originally posted by Nemesis Lead:

Wow--I was tired of this game after two multiplayer battles. Game has been out for 6 months and it still doesn't work as the numerous bug threads all (correctly) point out.

If I remember the URL of one of the CMSF fan websites and multiplayer ladders, I will send you the link.

Oh wait--there aren't any. Why would that be? CMSF is the best wargame ever, isn't it? [/quote

Now is it true what this young man is saying? That the multiplayer still isn't working properly... "broke"?

What's the matter mommy won't buy you what you wanted in the store today. awwwh

Well don't you worry now you can still play the single player game at 1.5 and there will still be plenty of "issues" for you to complain about- with the game and by the same token some of your own.

[Paper Tiger]

Nemesis:

hmm, reading your quote, you seem to be taking issue with the fact that he never tires of the game. I'm sorry that you're not enjoying the game but it shouldn't be a problem for you if we are.

You are entitled to post in any number of "this game is broken/bugged" threads that we see every day on this forum. I occassionally post there too so I don't think that the game is perfect but it's still my favourite. Posting your concerns there shouldn't attract any hostility. Posting it here just seems like sour grapes and will draw you some negative responses.

[Nemesis Lead]

PT--

You are correct of course, your opinions are as relevant as the next guy--I just like baiting people like FaxisAxis. I love you man!

I was just pointing out that the "best wargame ever" has no fan sites or any semblance of organization for multiplayer competition. It was also in the bargain bin about 2 months after release. You are all entitled to your opinions, they are just shared by very few others in the world at large.

I really wanted to like CMSF. But BFC released a product they knew was flawed and have been slower than slow in correcting their mistake. They basically took $70 from me (I bought the collector's edition) and others considering buying the game should know that most people do not agree that this "the best wargame ever."

In the same vein.....the best president in US history was James Harding (with Richard Nixon a close second)! That is my opinion! Is it valid?

[Guest Guest]

deleted per user request

[GSX]

Originally posted by Nemesis Lead:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Duke d'Aquitaine:

Anyway guys, I just felt I needed to vent my opinion after lurking for years here since my last post. I just never tire of this game..

Wow--I was tired of this game after two multiplayer battles. Game has been out for 6 months and it still doesn't work as the numerous bug threads all (correctly) point out.

If I remember the URL of one of the CMSF fan websites and multiplayer ladders, I will send you the link.

Oh wait--there aren't any. Why would that be? CMSF is the best wargame ever, isn't it? </font>

[thewood]

While I have noticed a little more game activity at the blitz, I wouldn't call it lively after 6 months of release. There is still quite a bit of negativity and I think the debate is still going about closing the ladder.

I think a lot of people there are waiting to see how those games play out before doing anything. I personally have tried two 1.05 PBEM games and both ended before finishing due to odd bugs showing up several turns in.

I just double checked:

No active ladder games report since 12/27. A grand total of two CMSF ladder games reported. Averaging 1 or 2 posts a day on the forum, at best. Two pending requests for opponents in the last week, with only one getting a response.

Gamesquad may actually be more active with someone still trying to put a tournament together for the last few months. Although, I think it has not been able to get off the ground.

I like playing around with CMSF, but am very disappointed at the community support. It just hasn't caught on anywhere near games like CM1, SP, or CC. I was really hoping that after six months, all the CM1 sites would have thriving CMSF sections.

[ January 08, 2008, 06:39 AM: Message edited by: thewood ]

[JohnO]

You no what, I agree with thewood and that isn't very often , but everytime someone tries to get something started you get the same jerks who do nothing but bad month the game, BFC, Steve or anybody else who thinks the game has potential. Its starts to get old very quick. So that is why I test and play PBEM, hell even in multiplayer with only the people who I know and who is civilized. And I bet as soon as I post this there will be someone who will come on here and start to bad month either me or the game saying it isn't playable.

[GSX]

Confused here, are you agreeing with the Wood in being dissapointed that the game hasnt been good enough to get a following in the established CM community or are you disapointed that the CM community as a whole has appeared to be dissatisfied with the game and not taken to it.

Surely the worth of a game should be reflected in the community that embraces it? Then again, maybe I dont get it and the game is solely meant for single play?

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