M1A2..how tough?

[M1A1TC]

Originally posted by oren_m:

Say, what are the reasones for the US army to not use Israel as it's logistical base, i mean, it's a whole lots safer than Iraq and much more closer to Damescus, moreover, the US army could use the already existing logistical sources of the IDF.

I know it's highly unlikely to happen, but would'nt it be much easier for them?

Oren_m

Having Jews fighting on the US side against Arabs is not very good politics. This will never happen - ever

[oren_m]

I did'nt say that the IDF will fight along with the US army, all i'm saying is that the US army will use israel as a base for it's invading troops, just like they used Saudi-arabia or Kueit.

[M1A1TC]

I know what you meant- it will never happen. Arabs will still see it as American Jews and Israel figthing against Arab world. Its all about politics. We will never be able to use Israel

[oren_m]

Unless WWIII will start!

Did you read Nosterdamus's prophecys?

If not let me tell a little story...

I have read the prophecys about 7 years ago,

one of the last chepters of the book talks about the 3'rd world war, he describes the war as a christian-muslim war that will start with a muslim invasion to europe, according to nosterdamus the war will last for many year (no number given).

Well, you cant take it as a real story, but you cant ignore how relevant is sounds...

I really advise you to read it, it's really interesting and it's also written in forms of songs, so if you like apoclyps combained with poetry you're inveted to read it.

Oren_m

[akd]

Originally posted by oren_m:

Unless WWIII will start!

Did you read Nosterdamus's prophecys?

If not let me tell a little story...

I have read the prophecys about 7 years ago,

one of the last chepters of the book talks about the 3'rd world war, he describes the war as a christian-muslim war that will start with a muslim invasion to europe, according to nosterdamus the war will last for many year (no number given).

Well, you cant take it as a real story, but you cant ignore how relevant is sounds...

I really advise you to read it, it's really interesting and it's also written in forms of songs, so if you like apoclyps combained with poetry you're inveted to read it.

Oren_m

You were watching the "History" Channel last night, weren't you?

[gibsonm]

So has it already started (after all the Moors punched into Spain “many years” ago now)?

If so it makes the “phoney war” of 1940 look like a very brief operational pause.

[oren_m]

Actually no, AKD.

[Battlefront.com]

M1 is right... no possibility of the US directly using Israel for Middle East policy/military options. It's bad enough when the US launches initiatives/operations out of Muslim/Arab countries... but Israel? If we think there is a global Jihad against the US, just wait and see what that would unleash. Not even the idiots in Washington have missed that little fact (and that's saying something, unfortunately).

Steve

[M1A1TC]

Thanks Steve, I hope the politicians have as much common sense as us

[John Kettler]

oren_m,

That is a most interesting thing you saw. Would like some clarification, though, on the ATGMs the Syrian troops were carrying. Are we talking the 60s vintage MCLOS 3000 meter range AT-3 SAGGER or the more recent, easier to use and much nastier 2000 meter range SACLOS AT-4 SPIGOT? If you saw a suitcase or any fins on an exposed missile, then it was an AT-3. If there was a launch tube visible, though, then it was an AT-4.

Regards,

John Kettler

[oren_m]

Yes it was AT-3 SAGGER.

But during this event the laser detection system in the tank told us that we are being "lased" by someone, so i guess they had there something a little more advanced than the AT-3.

[Saviola]

I did'nt say that the IDF will fight along with the US army, all i'm saying is that the US army will use israel as a base for it's invading troops, just like they used Saudi-arabia or Kueit.

If this Alice in Wonderland, hysterically laughable option is viewed by most IDF soldiers as a viable and workable option, then Israel’s commanders have a responsibility to suppress the revelation of such detrimental and self-injurious ignorance.

Slowly, but surely the Irans, DPRKs, Venezuelas and Syrias of the world are learning the benefits of lateral military thought when faced with a destructive conventional force.

The IDF’s conventional force suffered a humiliating defeat in southern Lebanon in 2000 due to relentless, sophisticated guerilla attacks brought to bear by Hizbullah. The withdrawing Israeli occupation army was forced to abandon and leave to the wolves its then proxy South Lebanese Army which was decimated and destroyed days after the Israeli rapid withdrawal.

Since 2000, the Israelis only sneak a peek into southern Lebanon from fixed wing fighter bombers and satellite imagery. The IDF now calculates a zillion times before mounting a manned expedition into Hizbullah land. In fact, Hizbullah is sneaking peeks into northern Israel with its own, self-manufactured surveillance drone, it flew it twice on 45 minutes missions unopposed.

On a different note, the present Israeli administration is the main opposing party to an American led Syrian invasion, Sharon prefers a weak and isolated Syria rather than a liberated, potentially democratic Syria.

A liberated, and potentially non hostile democratic Syria will trigger the need for peace talks with Israel brokered by the US. The latter will be a step that’ll cause Sharon another stroke _ peace talks? Give back the Golan? Can’t we just NOT get along? Can’t we go back to the way we were? Me Tarzan, you Lame?

[FAI]

Originally posted by oren_m:

Unless WWIII will start!

Did you read Nosterdamus's prophecys?

If not let me tell a little story...

I have read the prophecys about 7 years ago,

one of the last chepters of the book talks about the 3'rd world war, he describes the war as a christian-muslim war that will start with a muslim invasion to europe, according to nosterdamus the war will last for many year (no number given).

Well, you cant take it as a real story, but you cant ignore how relevant is sounds...

I really advise you to read it, it's really interesting and it's also written in forms of songs, so if you like apoclyps combained with poetry you're inveted to read it.

Oren_m

Talking about prophecys, I've even heard about one that said the rise of the Caliphate will begin in Syria, followed by a war that fits the description of Armageddon. But of course, details may vary...

[SgtMuhammed]

Of course Armageddon would mean that any war had spread to Israel because the final battle is supposed to take place at Megiddo.

[akd]

Originally posted by oren_m:

Actually no, AKD.

Ah, too bad, because (just like they did around Desert Storm) History Channel ran a program connecting Nostredamus's prophecies to the current "apocalyptic" world situation. (I guess the Nostradamus "experts" were mistaken with their previous interpretations, but then they always seem to have new ones ready to go at a moments notice.)

The best was a passage saying that the "really evil guy" that would rise up in the land "between two rivers" and seek to conquer the Christian world would be opposed by "the black one."

The Nostradamus expert said that "the black one" was obviously Colin Powell.

[gunnergoz]

Schwartzkopf of Schwartznegger - take your pick - could have just as easily been implied. "Black" as a reference to Negroes is a fairly recent connection. I think old Nostradamus would have been far more likely to be familiar with the German word for black, than the English one. And Schwartzkopf is old news...

So, we're left with one scenario: the Governor of the Golden State is going to have the California Highway Patrol invade the Holy Land? Interesting...

[Battlefront.com]

"Dis iz owa Holy Lant, ant ve owa he-ah to take it baak! Hey, Assad, I kill you laast! But ifv you give me a nice politikal campaign contributon, or zome hot vemen vit few morals, I might make you nice pozition in new government instead", Arnold "Syranator" Schwartznegger addressing the Syrians as his fleet of armored Hummer2s and Pinzgauers pour over the border into Syria.

Steve

[Pvt. Ryan]

Don't you have a game to work on?

I want CMSF and dese tings.

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by gunnergoz:

Schwartzkopf of Schwartznegger - take your pick - could have just as easily been implied. "Black" as a reference to Negroes is a fairly recent connection. I think old Nostradamus would have been far more likely to be familiar with the German word for black, than the English one.

You are of course assuming that Nostradamus actually knew what he was talking about. He might instead have been like the Oracle at Delphi, who spoke the words of the god without comprehending them. So it is said.

Michael

[oren_m]

El_operative,

i'll try to do this one without politics,

I belive that Hizballa (Hizble=party, Alla=god)

will definetly drag israel to with in lebanon and most likly in syria also.

The last full scale war Israel had, was in 1982 in lebanon, in which, i'll remind you, Beirut fell to the IDF in few weeks after the border crossing, the result of the war was PLO being kicked out to Tunisia, altought Hizballa took it's place it was a sucsess.

Due to the long time that Israel was'nt in a full scale war, the arab side, mostly Hizballa, tend to underastamate IDF's capabilitys against terror, which i can understand some how.

What they dont know, and neither of anyone in this forum, are Israel's real capabilitys, which are unimagineable, and i really mean that, and i'm not talking nuclear options.

Besides that, i think that the only ones who can prevent war in the next few year are the Lebenes, their country is now in a financial grouth not seen since the civil war broke in the 70's, so they have the most to lose from such a war.

Happy hanuka,

Oren_m

[John Kettler]

El_Operative,

A Hezbollah recce drone? Hadn't heard that one! Got a link? And if Hezbollah can have drone support, then why not the Syrians?

oren_m,

My, what an exciting life you've led! Kornet beam or laser rangefinder/designator? Frankly, neither one boded well.

Regards,

John Kettler

[akd]

Originally posted by John Kettler:

El_Operative,

A Hezbollah recce drone? Hadn't heard that one! Got a link? And if Hezbollah can have drone support, then why not the Syrians?

oren_m,

My, what an exciting life you've led! Kornet beam or laser rangefinder/designator? Frankly, neither one boded well.

Regards,

John Kettler

Syria has UAVs:

http://www.nti.org/e_research/profiles/Syria/Missile/3960_3961.html

http://fmso.leavenworth.army.mil/Red-Star/issues/JUL96/JUL96.HTML

http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/ar/uav/DR-3.html

http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/ar/uav/Shmel-1.html

http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/cpc-pubs/me_sec_issues.pdf

Also, Israel shot down a Syrian UAV over Lebanon in 1985, or at least the IAF so claims.

[ December 29, 2005, 09:20 PM: Message edited by: akd ]

[oren_m]

It's not a real drone, i've seen it, it's an Iranian radio controlled small drone, it's more like something you'll get for christmass, it's really lousy, it's imaging equiptmant is kinda like an expencive home video camera.

The drone's main use is not surveillance, but propaganda.

As for Syria's UAVs, i would'nt worry about them, it's a shme i cant tell you why, anyway, thrust me.

Oren_m

[Saviola]

A Hezbollah recce drone? Hadn't heard that one! Got a link? And if Hezbollah can have drone support, then why not the Syrians?

JK,

This is a link to an ABC News source, for I know nothing is credible in the US unless it’s US.

ABC

The drone is called Mirsad 1, if googled, other sources are revealed. Of course the challenge with these typa drones’ always been how to arm them with an effective air to surface missile a la CIA in Yemen and succeed.

Or even render the drone itself into some form of UAV dirty bomb, another possible use, but hardly probable or likely.

UAV technology isn’t new to the Iranians, Iraqis or Syrians, it’s old news. Using drones effectively and to an advantageous end is the challenge for the above however.

[Saviola]

Originally posted by oren_m:

It's not a real drone, i've seen it……. thrust me

Really? I take it you mean up close and personal right? It was never shot down, how is it you managed to see it, other than while in flight on TV? By crossing the fence and examining it with Hizbullah’s tech team over tea and croissant?

Oh, it’s clear now, you’re not a conscript, you’re a high ranking analyst in Aman, Israeli military intelligence. And while you were capable of shooting this piece of **** down, you chose not to. Why? Because you’ve an “unimaginable”, space age, lucid video photography kit capable of dissecting UAVs in flight. Not only that, your capabilities record vital characteristics data via sensory cyber optics on the fly.

Only snag with above proposition, your speech, linguistics and boasting traits aren’t synonymous with the stuff of seasoned, credible officers.

So trust you? Based on what? Your infatuation with this Nostradamus malarky, abysmal understanding of the politics of war, neutral stance, or super objectivity?

Originally posted by oren_m:

What they don’t know, and neither of anyone in this forum, are Israel's real capabilitys, which are unimagineable

What most don’t know, and what was once “unimaginable” is Israel secretly selling US Sidewinders, amongst numerous other American technologies to the Chinese for obscene profits, Israel stealing US intelligence on Iran through Douglas Feith, a neocon pro Israel spy who champions APAC to the detriment of US interests. With allies like Israel, who needs enemies.

Just recently, and in clear violation of the Arms Export Control Act (AECA), Israel was caught attempting a sale of US fighter Jets technology to Venezuela. Luckily the Defense Department did torpedo it.

Asia Times

Armament Source

Israeli Paper

Ultimately, why should Americans be impressed with Israel’s “unimaginable capabilities”? Everything of and about Israel’s military prowess and weaponry is ours, the UK made Israel, we $maintain it and protect it (1973 a la Nixon, Patriots, Iraq 91). All this, while putting up with double cross no nation on earth should have to put up with. So who’s special? The US is special. Who’s capabilities are “unimaginable”? America’s are, not yours.

[ December 30, 2005, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: El_Operative ]