Come Share Your CM Horror Stories

[Col Deadmarsh]

Has anybody here played someone who was a really bad sport, someone who not only cut out of the game, but either argued with you or said bad things about your mother? Let's share some of our favorites...

[Michael Dorosh]

How about "poor winners"? Those are even harder to bear.

[Commander]

Fortunately, I'm enough of a newbie that I have not had the experience that you describe. All of my human opponents have been great. The AI on the other hand...

[Blenheim]

Well, last week I was really, really badly beaten by the AI. Yeah, I know.... I know. I suck. But I was in the phone, and did not see that Tiger, and.... errrr.... . I suck.

[Bad Monkey!]

My very first PBEM, and my first game against a human

1500pt Armoured ME, May '45, default terrain. Elite forces. I picked a Crack KT, two Crack PzIV's, an Elite Panther G, a Vet StuH42, a platoon of crack infantry, and an elite sharpshooter.

First turn, I send the KT and one of the PzIV's up the road into the town to lay in wait for the enemy, with the inf running up behind to occupy the town. The Panther and the StuH were on the right, watching the flanks, the remaining PzIV likewise on the left.

Second turn, several unidentified enemy tanks appear around the edge of some trees on my left, about 400 yds distant, and engage my two tanks moving up the road. They turn out to be three Elite Hellcats. First shot bounces off my KT, the KT returns fire and gets a gun hit. Next shot kills the KT. Third shot kills the PzIV. Two more tanks round the corner, and begin shooting at my infantry. These two turn out to be Elite Super Pershings.

After a serious bit of panicking, I withdraw my remaining tanks, still unseen, to better defensive positions, run my infantry platoon into some nearby woods, and run the sharpshooter and a shreck (which were under cover on the other side of the road)into the town. And I waited for my opponent to come and find me.

Which he never did. He retreated the gun damaged Hellcat back off the map, and gathered all of his tanks about 200 meters from the town, about halfway between the town and the map edge. I think he was waiting for me to try and move the rest of my force up into the town, but I'll never know.

After a few turns of doing nothing, I decided to go after him. I snuck my infantry into the edge of the woods facing his tanks, and moved my sharpshooter into a tall building at the edge of the town, while racing my Panther around the far side of the map to get on his left flank, and moving the StuH up behind a hill on the opposite side of town, and the PzIV behind a building on the left.

After everything was in place, I opened up on his tanks first with the sharpshooter, then the infantry, killing two TC's and buttoning the others. His tanks started shooting at my infantry in the woods. The next turn, I hunted both the Panther and the StuH out of cover on his left, leaving the PzIV be on his right as a reserve.

The Panther killed the two Super Pershings and a Hellcat in forty seconds with four rounds, and the StuH got the remaining Hellcat, all flank shots. They never saw it coming.

Needless to say, my opponent was in shock. He reacted poorly when I asked for his surrender, and acted even worse when I asked him to send the final turn so I could see the point total. I'm not sure he was more upset at, me or himself, but either way, he didn't take it very well.

[wadepm]

My one and only rule of CM etiquite is NEVER ask for your opponent's surrender. It is very hard via email not to sound like you are gloating, which you probably were. I would have told you to *&$%-off too. If a guy wan't to surrender, he will. He doesn't need you asking for it.

[PiggDogg]

Monkey,

Good story as to why one should never give up. You were fortunate that your opponent was not as astute & lucky as he could have been.

Also, you should publish the name of your "most worthy" opponent so that his reputation can preceed him. :mad: This way the rest of us can gain the benefit of such reputation.

Cheers, Richard

[ASL Veteran]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by wadepm:

My one and only rule of CM etiquite is NEVER ask for your opponent's surrender. It is very hard via email not to sound like you are gloating, which you probably were. I would have told you to *&$%-off too. If a guy wan't to surrender, he will. He doesn't need you asking for it.<hr></blockquote>

That's an interesting observation. What if the losing person doesn't have enough sense to know when to surrender? What if there are ten turns left in your game and all of his forces are either broken, routed, or obviously incapable of an effective defense? If you don't feel like chasing down every broken or routed unit and gunning them down, don't you feel that it is appropriate to mention "Hey, things don't look too good on your side of the map - perhaps we can try something else?"

In my opinion, an opponent who forces you to hunt him down to the last routed soldier is a poor loser (since apparently he just doesn't want to accept the loss and wants to prolong the game for as long as possible). Rather than continue on with senseless executions you and your opponent can be playing something a little more challenging - like a new scenario.

[Bad Monkey!]

wadepm: I tried not to gloat too much. But honestly, I pointed out that all he had left were a bunch of crews (he didn't buy any infantry), but his moral hadn't dropped to the point to force an auto-surrender.

Piggdogg and ASL Vet: I don't remember his name, and even if I did, I wouldn't tell. He seemed young, and somewhat new to CM, so I just let it be. He had said he was pissed at himself for being such a smart-ass during his setup, only to be beat down by a single Panther, so I didn't really hold his rudeness against him. He apologized about a day later, and agreed to another game, but then after a few turns, neglected to return e-mail, for whatever reasons. Aside from a couple e-mails, I didn't bother to follow up.

[CMplayer]

I recently had a guy down to almost just routed units. There were 7 turns left in the game and it was just a matter of driving a couple of tanks to the last big victory flag, while hosing down his fleeing HJs along the way. He did not surrender, however. What happened? I had taken enough casualties that the game appeared to end by enforced cease-fire, and he pulled off a draw. So I can understand someone not surrendering.

[ASL Veteran]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by CMplayer:

I recently had a guy down to almost just routed units. There were 7 turns left in the game and it was just a matter of driving a couple of tanks to the last big victory flag, while hosing down his fleeing HJs along the way. He did not surrender, however. What happened? I had taken enough casualties that the game appeared to end by enforced cease-fire, and he pulled off a draw. So I can understand someone not surrendering.<hr></blockquote>

If there is a case where the opponent feels he may have enough points to achieve something other than total defeat then he can suggest a Cease Fire instead. Besides, if you are in control of all the victory flags and will gun his remaining troops down anyway, his surrender will not alter the point outcome in the end since it is a given that the point total will end up similar to a surrender by your troops executing everyone eventually anyway. So, in my opinion, there is no justification for prolonging the obvious.

Now, if your opponent has some big surprise up his sleeve or something you aren't aware of - then the act of asking for a surrender can be laughed at since you know you are stronger than he thinks you are.

I personally don't play CM for the joy of having a victory by X number of points or feeling the sting of a loss by Y number of points. I know when I've won and I know when I've lost and point calculating doesn't factor into it for me (unless it is an exit scenario or something like that where points are the focus). The loss level is irrelevant - a tactical loss is the same as a total loss for me. Fact is that I lost. I can accept it though and live to fight another day.

Conversely I know when my opponent has lost. Once the scenario has lost any form of challenge the scenario loses its appeal to me. I fight to the point of decision - once the decision has been acheived the rest of the battle can be tedious. Knowing when the point of decision has been achieved though is important, cause the decisive moment isn't when you lose your first King Tiger/favorite unit. Even an opponent who cuts out early is cool by me though (as long as he sends a surrender file) since I'm all about the challenge portion of the battle. If they have been defeated mentally then I'm fine with that too.

[Mr. Johnson--]

I played this one game with this guy. Combined arms mod hills, mod trees, village.

He picked the germans and he picked one KT with infantry support.

I picked a few brit tanks, some halftracks, like one company and a bunch of Piets. I sent my infantry and tanks stright up the middle down the road leading to town. And packed all my piets onto HTs.

The force going up the middle ran into a KT in hull down on a big hill with infantry covering it from the sides. He precided to start pounding away.

My Piets and HTs saw a perfect little vally along the edge of the map allowing them to stay hidden, so I sent them moving fast around to his rear. Where the Piets jumped out of the HTs and swarmed the KT. I nailed the slow KT np. Then my opponent said, "nice one, but it will only work once." then quit. Never seen him again. Funny how your inner voice tells you to buy certain things at the start of the battle.

[Gyrene]

I hate it when an opponent asks for a Cease Fire after I kick his ass for 25 out of 30 turns.

No, you don't get a Cease Fire, but I'll let you surrender.

Cease Fires should reserved strictly for games where both sides do not have any real offensive ability left.

Gyrene

[Iron Chef Sakai]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Gyrene:

I hate it when an opponent asks for a Cease Fire after I kick his ass for 25 out of 30 turns.

No, you don't get a Cease Fire, but I'll let you surrender.

Cease Fires should reserved strictly for games where both sides do not have any real offensive ability left.

Gyrene<hr></blockquote> i think a cease-fire shows a more accurate score of the battle. whether i'm winning or losing, i prefer the cease-fire. i don't want credited points for surrendered troops that i have not taken out. i don't let people surrender to me, i'm all set with getting more points for surrendered units, then actual killed or wounded ones. if i can get a major victory through way of a cease fire, it's all the better, if not, just as well, if it's a loss, oh well not a big deal either, the game is way to fun. it sounds like, and from a couple games i've played against people on here is that some are way to caught up in winning. a couple players were fun to play, but there was one in particular who needed a glass of warm milk, or better yet a bottle with a nipple on it full of warm milk. i prefer to play people who are as good at the game as me anyway, most of the time i play a friend of mine who is the best i've seen so far and we have some realy good games. the ai is boring to me and is not much for conversation either, i've only played the ai once to get a feel for the game controls. if anyopne is looking to play people on the forum, i would recomend Jagdwyrm, he was fun to play. also i would recomend combined arms games as well. it takes away the sillyness option of buying 8 tanks and 1 platoon of soldiers. tanks are over rated anyway.

[Hensworth]

The 10 commandments of PBEM-ing :

1. Thou shalt not begin a PBEM game and not finish it.

2. Thou shalt not commit that which is considered gamey.

3. Thou shalt be patient with thine less experienced opponent.

4. Thou shalt not gloat at thine opponent's mishaps.

5. When thou asketh for surrender, thou shalt also offer a rematch.

6. Thou shalt play with regularity and discipline, and forewarn thine opponent of long periods of inactivity.

7. Thou shalt not reveal details from an action phase thine opponent hath not yet seen.

8. Thou shalt not give away thine own OOB, thus ruining the game for thine opponent, nor shalt thou let on how much thou knowest about thine opponent's force.

9. Thou shalt not play scenarios thou have played before.

10. Thou shalt be magnanimous both in victory and defeat.

[Pvt. Ryan]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Sgt_Kelly:

The 10 commandments of PBEM-ing :

4. Thou shalt not gloat at thine opponent's mishaps.<hr></blockquote>

I think this is what the Peng thread is for.

[russellmz]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by ASL Veteran:

That's an interesting observation. What if the losing person doesn't have enough sense to know when to surrender? What if there are ten turns left in your game and all of his forces are either broken, routed, or obviously incapable of an effective defense? If you don't feel like chasing down every broken or routed unit and gunning them down, don't you feel that it is appropriate to mention "Hey, things don't look too good on your side of the map - perhaps we can try something else?"

In my opinion, an opponent who forces you to hunt him down to the last routed soldier is a poor loser (since apparently he just doesn't want to accept the loss and wants to prolong the game for as long as possible). Rather than continue on with senseless executions you and your opponent can be playing something a little more challenging - like a new scenario.<hr></blockquote>

funny, i once got a really bad tcp ip loss with only about 5 routed units and crews left. then the game crashed, and he wanted to continue with the game by pbem. i didn't want to go through the trouble of pbem when i had no units to give orders to (all routed, panicked, etc) so i just gave him my password and told him to surrender for me. he got a little miffed and said i should continue the game next time, even though i wasn't even giving orders for the last couple turns.

as for cease fires, you may want to ask just in case the other guy doesn't realize he wiped you out.

[ASL Veteran]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by russellmz:

funny, i once got a really bad tcp ip loss with only about 5 routed units and crews left. then the game crashed, and he wanted to continue with the game by pbem. i didn't want to go through the trouble of pbem when i had no units to give orders to (all routed, panicked, etc) so i just gave him my password and told him to surrender for me. he got a little miffed and said i should continue the game next time, even though i wasn't even giving orders for the last couple turns.

as for cease fires, you may want to ask just in case the other guy doesn't realize he wiped you out.<hr></blockquote>

I can't really understand the mentality of someone who wants to chase down every last broken unit and gun them down. That's being a poor winner if you ask me :eek: . However, I think it probably would have been more appropriate for you to actually send the surrender file rather than sending the file and asking him to surrender for you - at least if you ever intended to play that person again. Now if you offered the surrender and he refused - I can't understand that at all. I think you should always accept a surrender file when offered.

[ASL Veteran]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Sgt_Kelly:

The 10 commandments of PBEM-ing :

8. Thou shalt not give away thine own OOB, thus ruining the game for thine opponent, nor shalt thou let on how much thou knowest about thine opponent's force.

9. Thou shalt not play scenarios thou have played before.

<hr></blockquote>

Actually you can gain a great deal of pleasure in playing a scenario where the OBs for both sides are known in advance by both players. It can also be just as challenging to play a scenario multiple times (maybe flipping sides or even as the same side). You can learn a lot that way since the focus becomes one of tactical ability rather than one of fog of war. A player who requires gimmicks and surprises to win is probably weak in some areas of tactical expertise.

Typically I play scenarios - and I will generally either pick the scenario and allow the opponent to pick the side, or my opponent picks the scenario and I pick the side. In those cases, we both know what the other guy has and it ensures that a relatively balanced scenario is chosen (since you may end up playing either side)

[Chad Harrison]

whats the fun of watching your last three squads be pushed around the map for ten turns?

if its obvious the game is over, and a tie is far from attainable (underdog holds no flags, didnt take out a lot of tanks, ect), end the game by a surrender. if they dont offer, ask them if they want to finish the game, and at the same time, offer a new game.

cease fire on the other hand is for a stalemate. you are both beat up bad, and neither side wants to advance.

to me, its a game for fun. if youve lost, and its obvious, start a new GAME and have fun trying to get revenge!

[ParaBellum]

Well, it all depends on the situation.

You're holding a VL and still have some usuable forces left? Continue the game.

Are your forces reduced to a handful of panicked squads hiding in the corners of the map? Surrender.

I recall a TCP/IP game against 109Gustav (correct me if I'm wrong).

We played a battle with me being Brits attacking his Germans. He played extremely well, inflicting heavy losses on my infantry. I finally pushed him back using brute force (e.g. heavy arty and Churchill VIIs) rather than clever tactics.

When he asked for a ceasefire I agreed, although one or two VLs where now virtually undefended and I only had to advance to them.

We both knew that, so no need to carry on.

After all, it's not about winning or losing, it's about having a great time with great guys.