Jiggathebauce Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 New driver dropped today, and nothing in the release notes about OpenGL fixes. The decision to just switch to Nvidia at some point is being made for me with each update that doesn't fix this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nox_plague Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 (edited) We got a reply from Ray_AMD who added Matt_AMD to the thread https://community.amd.com/t5/drivers-software/amd-driver-issues-with-opengl-in-combat-mission-games/td-p/587742#.ZByfYQKrmZI In these situations, the best thing to do is provide examples and context so they can reproduce the issue. The challenge with this bug is that since the game doesn't crash/hang etc the support people might not realize the "flashbang" effect is not the intention of the developer. @BFCElvis is there anything you can provide Ray_AMD and Matt_AMD that could aid them tracking down this issue? Like do we know which OpenGL function/extension is the culprit? Edited March 23, 2023 by nox_plague 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFCElvis Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 1 hour ago, nox_plague said: We got a reply from Ray_AMD who added Matt_AMD to the thread https://community.amd.com/t5/drivers-software/amd-driver-issues-with-opengl-in-combat-mission-games/td-p/587742#.ZByfYQKrmZI In these situations, the best thing to do is provide examples and context so they can reproduce the issue. The challenge with this bug is that since the game doesn't crash/hang etc the support people might not realize the "flashbang" effect is not the intention of the developer. @BFCElvis is there anything you can provide Ray_AMD and Matt_AMD that could aid them tracking down this issue? Like do we know which OpenGL function/extension is the culprit? Excellent. And excellent question. Our sometimes coder Phil has been looking into this. The great thing about that is his computer experiences it! I'll run this by him and see if he has any ideas on what he can share. Thanks!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lerxster Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Great stuff! Looking forward to a possible resolution... We are rooting for you Phil! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiggathebauce Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Thank you Phil and Elvis! Wooo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codreanu Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Added my input to the thread, it would be great if we could get this fixed by AMD themselves so Phil doesn't have to waste a bunch of time on it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 I can't speak to the details that Phil uncovered, but he did narrow things down a bit. Not surprisingly the likely culprits are older OpenGL API calls that AMD broke. Unfortunately for us all, these are not easily updated to newer OpenGL alternatives. Lots and lots of things are dependent upon the older way of doing things, which means changing the underlying OpenGL calls requires rewriting a lot of pretty complex code that hasn't been touched in a very long time. Possible to do? Yes, but time consuming to say the least. Having AMD fix what they broke would be a much better solution. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBlaque Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Well, this seems to have pretty far-reaching implications. Steve are you suggesting that if AMD does NOT fix their "broken" OpenGL API calls as a consequence of their OpenGL "upgrades" that all AMD users of Battlefront CM games are therefore stuck on legacy drivers? Beyond the flash-bang issue, per my earlier post I received an out-of-memory error on CMBS after an email turn completed its 60 second cycle making that game "fully broken." Since it sounds like all Engine4 CM games are suffering from this (I can confirm on CMBS and CMRT-- oddly no out-of-memory on the latter), I can't see both parties ignoring this issue indefinitely-- and frankly, AMD might end of "just not caring" about a comparatively smaller user base. Its not like this is happening in Call of Duty.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 6 hours ago, LeBlaque said: Steve are you suggesting that if AMD does NOT fix their "broken" OpenGL API calls as a consequence of their OpenGL "upgrades" that all AMD users of Battlefront CM games are therefore stuck on legacy drivers? Not at all. I'm simply getting ahead of anybody who thinks that knowing there's a problem with AMD's drivers means we can "easily" produce a fix. Case in point... A long time ago AMD introduced two bugs that caused mouse clicks in the 3D environment to not register correctly. We even had someone within AMD tell us exactly what the bugs were. Because AMD didn't prioritize fixing it (broken API calls are critical for CM, not used by hardly anybody else) we made our own fix. It was pretty ugly. It kinda mostly worked, but it was absolutely not a smooth result. We made it optional so that non-affected AMD card users and nVidia could opt out of the fix. Eventually AMD did fix the problem and we were able to kill off the work around. Hopefully AMD will fix the issue as they are the ones that broke something. We are already looking into alternatives if they do not. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBlaque Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 (edited) Thank you, Steve, good to hear. I will speak for the rest of us and be hopeful that AMD won't wait ANOTHER nine months to address these issues. The last version that worked for CM was released June '22.... (and BTW I remember that 'mouse click' issue ) Edited March 24, 2023 by LeBlaque 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 2 hours ago, LeBlaque said: Thank you, Steve, good to hear. I will speak for the rest of us and be hopeful that AMD won't wait ANOTHER nine months to address these issues. The last version that worked for CM was released June '22.... (and BTW I remember that 'mouse click' issue ) It took them about a year to fix the mouse click issue, so hopefully that means they are close to fixing this one Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lerxster Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 Appreciate the time taken to explain the issue. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nox_plague Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 @BFCElvis @Battlefront.com Another AMD staff member replied to the thread: https://community.amd.com/t5/drivers-software/amd-driver-issues-with-opengl-in-combat-mission-games/td-p/587742#.ZB3TXcS-w9Z "Just FYI, a bug ticket has been created to track this issue: "flashing white screen when explosions occur in front of camera/player" . The OpenGL dev team is currently looking into it." If you have any information on which OpenGL functions/calls/extensions are used during explosions we should pass it along to help them narrow it down. CM:CW gets the "Out of Memory" breaking error with AMD drivers after 22.6.1., if you have any ideas on that one we should pass it along while we have the AMD team attention, although we should probably create a separate thread and Bug tracker for that. One thing at a time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nox_plague Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 @Battlefront.com @BFCElvis btw it is worth pointing out that the OpenGL AMD team did improve game loading times tremendously in the newer drivers. Often reducing load times by as much as 75% for large-huge battles. So they're trying to make OpenGL run better. It just unfortunately introduced this explosion regression. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 24, 2023 Share Posted March 24, 2023 I'll see if there's any thought as to what specific calls are at the root of it, but at this point it's probable they are OpenGL v1.x as that particular code has not been updated over the years. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisol Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 This is sounding perhaps a little like progress... really hoping it gets sorted as CMBN would be a definite purchase on Steam. Thanks for all you are doing 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 On 3/23/2023 at 4:31 PM, Battlefront.com said: I can't speak to the details that Phil uncovered, but he did narrow things down a bit. Not surprisingly the likely culprits are older OpenGL API calls that AMD broke. Unfortunately for us all, these are not easily updated to newer OpenGL alternatives. Lots and lots of things are dependent upon the older way of doing things, which means changing the underlying OpenGL calls requires rewriting a lot of pretty complex code that hasn't been touched in a very long time. Possible to do? Yes, but time consuming to say the least. Having AMD fix what they broke would be a much better solution. Steve Anything more specific came out of it? We/you should use the opportunity while we have some AMD support people listening to us and have open a ticket with engineering. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bufo Posted March 30, 2023 Author Share Posted March 30, 2023 Can anybody who owns Normandy confirm this claim?: https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatMission/comments/125vkex/white_screen_fix/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiggathebauce Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 (edited) If true that the steam version fixed the flashbang issue, it leads to 2 questions 1. Is this replicable in the battlefront versions somehow? 2. Will i be able to get keys for games i bought from battlefront years ago, before steam was on the horizon? I first got CMBN back when it released originally, or is there a statute of limitation? Edited March 30, 2023 by Jiggathebauce Clarity 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane's Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bufo said: Can anybody who owns Normandy confirm this claim?: https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatMission/comments/125vkex/white_screen_fix/ I have a Steam version and with no mods there are flashes. Edited March 30, 2023 by Jane's 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane's Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 8 minutes ago, Jiggathebauce said: If true that the steam version fixed the flashbang issue, it leads to 2 questions 1. Is this replicable in the battlefront versions somehow? 2. Will i be able to get keys for games i bought from battlefront years ago, before steam was on the horizon? I first got CMBN back when it released originally, or is there a statute of limitation? There is no limitations, you can use your activation code from whenever you bought the game. If it doesn't work, open a ticket at Battlefront and they will help you. They helped me within a couple of hours:) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBlaque Posted March 31, 2023 Share Posted March 31, 2023 (edited) @Bufo, @Jane's @Steve - that is fascinating-- why with MODS would the flash be eliminated on the steam version? Does this imply that with the same mods a non-Steam version of CMBN would be repaired? I can't test as I don't own this particular game. The original author claims it is the Steam version itself that solves the problem so this implies its MODS? This should be updated to AMD by Battlefront if replicated as it just makes driver resolution (IMHO) more confounding? Edited March 31, 2023 by LeBlaque 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane's Posted March 31, 2023 Share Posted March 31, 2023 I highly doubt that mods have anything to do with flashing. He didn't say what gpu drivers he's using. I also checked Black Sea (Slitherine but non-Steam version) and it's flashing too. We need to wait for AMD to fix this, hopefuly soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codreanu Posted March 31, 2023 Share Posted March 31, 2023 On 3/30/2023 at 9:42 AM, Bufo said: Can anybody who owns Normandy confirm this claim?: https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatMission/comments/125vkex/white_screen_fix/ I still have flashes on the Steam version, both without mods and with whatever explosion effects the All in One pack uses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted April 3, 2023 Share Posted April 3, 2023 All versions of Combat Mission use the same core code, which means there is no variation between the different CM games and between the ones we release and those on Matrix and/or Steam. The delivery method has zero effect on the underlying game any more than when you purchase a consumer product from different shops/websites. Sometimes different Combat Mission games (CMBS vs. CMBN vs. CMCW, etc.) behave differently because each new release might have slight coding changes from the previous versions. However, in this case that's not likely as the problem is with core behavior that hasn't been touched in years. All games are using the same code so they should all behave the same. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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