UI Request to BF.C

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

But obviously there are still limitations so FIST units in CM:SF will be extremely valuable commodities.

Steve

info on FIST

(Fire Team Support Vehicle

The XM7 FIST is a variant of the M2 Bradley used as an artillery forward observer.

FIST web page link

[c3k]

Steve,

Air Force ops are closer to my forte than Army. The operations concepts can change quickly, but Air Force Close Air Support (CAS) seems to rely on Air Force personnel attached to the Army unit to call in the strike. The Air Force and Army are trying to push the Forward Air Observers down to a lower level. That doesn't mean, as I understand it, that Sergeant Johnson can direct an airstrike because he a radio. See this website:

************************************************

http://www.tradoc.army.mil/pao/training_closeup/050504.htm

Huang said that a couple of the measures include using trained, experienced observers and pilots during live drops. Air Force forward observers will guide in aircraft to ensure that pilots have properly identified the targets, and the Army and Marine Corps observers will call in the artillery, he added. Also, revisions were made to the airspace coordinates to make sure artillery isn’t fired at the same time aircraft is flying over, said Huang.

************************************************

The above was in reference to a Fort Sill (U.S. Army artillery school)exercise and training program.

Let's talk more about airpower...

Thanks,

Ken

[Andrew H.]

Originally posted by aka_tom_w:

re: commando-ization

interesting term

a search of the internet and web found only ONE reference

by a person posting to another forum

Hellfish6: from Aug 2005

[snip]

By contrast, there are 1000's of hits on "going commando": including this one.

[M1A1TC]

There is a difference between calling in an AIRSTRIKE and calling in ARTILLERY. If a unit has Arty assets assigned to them according to OPORD, then pretty much a platoon SGT and above can call in arty. Damn, Ive called in Arty before, adjusted it, and I am just a SGT. Of course I was a tanker, so we had arty all the time

[flamingknives]

Do US FOs have the authority to call in artillery, or do they request fire?

[M1A1TC]

I can only speak for what tankers do. I have no clue about FO's job. Hold on, I am scanning a Fire Support SOP for tank platoon

Here you are

[ November 11, 2005, 02:18 PM: Message edited by: M1A1TankCommander ]

[Battlefront.com]

c3k,

Remember, FACs are not just Air Force. For example, the Major I heard speak about his experience in Fallujah is a Marine with F/A-18 Weapons System Officer experience. One of the interesting things is he found, in his research for Marine Corps Center for Lessons Learned, is that having "trigger pulling" experience (i.e. pilot/weapons officer) was not necessary. Some of the best guys he knew of were crewmembers on C-130s. Here is an interesting link:

USMC FAC in Fallujah

Again, I am not saying that SGT Johnson of 2nd Squad, 3rd Rifle Platoon is going to be calling down a 2000# JDAM into the 3rd window from the left side of the eastern face of a 15 story building. In fact, I'd be surprised if he could. What I am saying is that if he sees a tank or enemy troops, and there is something in the air, he has the potential to call in a strike of some sort. Especially if it is a helo since the whole point of helos is to provide such support, which is one reason why they are Marines or Army, not US Air Force. I don't think for those situations a FAC needs to be there, on the spot, to facilitate the strike. Maybe he does, so this is certainly something I need to dig into further.

Like I said, I need to do more research on this. But just keep in mind that "air support" is not a monolithic combat element.

Steve

[MikeyD]

I assume calling in an airstrike in-game presupposes available air assets within reasonable flying distance. Timely artillery support would (should) be a given. Whether there's always a circling A10 less that 5 minutes away is another matter entirely. Linked with available air support, there's the matter of your Stryker fire support vehicle lazing a target for the incoming fighter/bomber/gunship. I'm at all not sure how the coordination/timing will be handled.

But I'm thinking in CMx1 timescales. BFC says CMx2 weill be more off a measured 'real-world' tempo.

[M1A1TC]

Just posted the scan, check above

[hellfish]

IIRC, most requests for air support go through the Battalion S3-Air, though I don't know if the procedure is different if an ANGLICO or FAC is on the ground with the squad/platoon requesting it.

A benefit of JDAMS, I think, is that the requester only has to have a grid coordinate for the weapon, and since it's GPS guided it should, theoretically, be pretty easy to target.

[akd]

Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

c3k,

Remember, FACs are not just Air Force. For example, the Major I heard speak about his experience in Fallujah is a Marine with F/A-18 Weapons System Officer experience. One of the interesting things is he found, in his research for Marine Corps Center for Lessons Learned, is that having "trigger pulling" experience (i.e. pilot/weapons officer) was not necessary. Some of the best guys he knew of were crewmembers on C-130s. Here is an interesting link:

USMC FAC in Fallujah

Again, I am not saying that SGT Johnson of 2nd Squad, 3rd Rifle Platoon is going to be calling down a 2000# JDAM into the 3rd window from the left side of the eastern face of a 15 story building. In fact, I'd be surprised if he could. What I am saying is that if he sees a tank or enemy troops, and there is something in the air, he has the potential to call in a strike of some sort. Especially if it is a helo since the whole point of helos is to provide such support, which is one reason why they are Marines or Army, not US Air Force. I don't think for those situations a FAC needs to be there, on the spot, to facilitate the strike. Maybe he does, so this is certainly something I need to dig into further.

Like I said, I need to do more research on this. But just keep in mind that "air support" is not a monolithic combat element.

Steve

I don't think the U.S. military has decentralized airstrikes to such an extent. Certainly there is more freedom at lower levels than in Vietnam, but the role of FACs is still of central importance. Also, as far as I know, the Marines don't handle FAC the same way as the Army. The Marine FACs can coordinate all Marine Air (rotary and fixed-wing) and are pushed right up to the front to enable them to do so. In fact, Bing West's The March Up mentions Marine FACs (pilots attached to ground units, as you noted), usurping the loader position on Abrams in order to be at the absolute "point of the spear" ready to call in air (and loading the gun when needed).

But that's the Marines and I'm not sure if the same model applies to the Army and Air Force.

Oh, will IR designators and markers be modelled? will we see the nighttime battlefield in normal vision or through light intensification?:

http://media.putfile.com/050608_UH60Mosul

[ November 11, 2005, 02:57 PM: Message edited by: akd ]

[cassh]

Andrew H. - I think I might have to submit an article to Wikipedia - its info on "going commando" is duff.

AFAIAA the origins of the term came about in the early 1980's in the military following the Falklands conflict. It then percolated its way into general usage.

It is from the practice of the RM commandos whipping off their cacks to save them from the drama and emotion of removing an extra layer of clothing when nature called. As this was often abrupt and sometimes explosively charged the piece of mind of knowing you had a free run once your draws were dropped was of some comfort.

All the boys were going down with dreadful diarrhoea; suffered from drinking the brackish peat water (no doubt supplemented with efforts from a million or so sheep).

Normal routine with steri-tabs wasn't working so it was Delhi-belly all round. Faced with having to make an emergency stop repeatedly throughout the day most bootnecks decided the grundies were hardly worth the effort and stuck them in their kit until normal service were restored downstairs.

Not quite sure how the Paras, Guards and Gurkhas got away with it, but for some reason afterwards the descriptive verb of cacks/underwear removal got lumped on the RM.

Going cacks free in highland infantry units (when wearing kilts) supersedes the Falklands by many hundred years and is affectionately known as "going Regimental"!

Interestingly the prophetic and wise Richard E. Simpkin predicted the requirement for the "commandoization" of the infantry in his 1985 book Race to the Swift. He explained that logically a combination of manoeuvre warfare and revolutionary warfare would be combined to form the main approach to warfighting used by the enemies of the west. He clearly believed that western forces would need to deal with this new yet ancient approach to warfighting (he did not coin the term asymmetric warfare, but it is exactly what he described).

Simpkin explains that organised forces as they were then, and to a large degree still are now, are unsuited to fighting against this type of enemy. He called for the swing towards special forces type training and the development of what he termed "semi-special forces" or fytinghellfish's Commandoization as we see it now coined.

If you wish to be truly astounded by a brilliant military mind, analysts and thinker then I suggest you have a look at his work - simply put the most influential military writer in my view since Liddlell-Hart/Fuller.

[hellfish]

I think I should have my own article on Wiki - "how Hellfish coined 'commandoization'".

[John Kettler]

Steve,

If at all possible, please include both types of sniper weapons. Why? The .50 cal variety has an operationally proven engagement mode the 7.62mm lacks--firing THROUGH typical Middle East mudbrick walls. Believe the Marines discovered this back in Lebanon with the Barrett. Dad learned this at the Barrett factory in Arkansas some years ago during a visit.

cassh,

Simpkin's definitely the man. His triangle model of tank design was brilliant, and I still hanker to own his RED ARMOUR.

Regards,

John Kettler