Tank Hunter Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The other day when playing CMFI against the US I noticed I was fighting the 82nd AA since they have their shoulder patches included in the game being the only American airborne unit present in Sicilly. I personally feel that these small details lift the experience and was thinking how nice would it be to include Divisional insignia into the game for all units? I know you can do this today by modding but you have to change mods every time you wish to switch forces. The OOB data for WWII is researched and known so it would not be difficult to find out which divisions were present in a specific region during a specific period. Technically BF would have to assign a texture spot for infantry and tanks where the insignia would be applied depending on what choices scenario maker or QB player did. When selecting units for scenario you first have to select a division and then the units you wish to deploy. All the selected units under that division would get their insignia applied to uniforms / vehicles. Selecting another division would fetch another insignia and so on.. One other thing that is missing is combining different forces in QBs, Airborne and Regular, or US and British or German Panzer and Luftwaffe and so on.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 While unit and rank insignia and tank numbering etc. does add to the atmsphere, I don't expect to see it,very soon as there's plenty of stuff actually important for the simulation. Such as horses and anti-tank dogs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Tank Hunter, What a cool idea! Don't know about the other, since I've yet to play a QB. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouGotGunYouGotGun Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 While unit and rank insignia and tank numbering etc. does add to the atmsphere, I don't expect to see it,very soon as there's plenty of stuff actually important for the simulation. Such as horses and anti-tank dogs. I've been waiting for incendiary pigs for nigh on ten years now. It's a well known fact the Germans used them at Sevastopol. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I've been waiting for incendiary pigs for nigh on ten years now. It's a well known fact the Germans used them at Sevastopol. What? To scare the Russian elephants? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fernando Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 US wore the divisional insignia on the upper left sleeve. Sometimes it was painted on the helmet too (front, rear and/or sides). That was until the unit became truly veteran then usually they don't bother to stich the colorful insignia to their field uniforms or paint their helmets. In fact late war helmet net was so closely woven that no helmet insignia could be seen. Divisional insignia wasn't usually worn on the HBT uniform. British wore (from top to botton) regimental/nationality, divisional and brigade insignia on both upper sleeves. Sometimes thay also had helmet insignia. Polish troops in British uniform wore regimental collar insignia on top of that. Germans: Waffen-SS wore cuff titles on the lower left sleeve. Heer Infanterie Regiment List too Grossdeutschland, Afrika Korps, HG and FJ units cuff titles on the right sleeve Army independent units wore the unit number and insignia (in Waffenfarbe color) on the shoulder boards Regular infantry wore no insignia but different arms and branches wore EACH ONE a Waffenfarbe color on the shoulder board pipping (red for artillery, white for infantry, black for Engineers, pink for panzer, yellow for cavalry and some panzer and recon regiments coming from cavalry, lemmon yellow for signals etc.). In fact some units like Panzergrenadier changed Waffenfarbe during the war (from white to green) and people still discuss today what green shade (grass green and/or light green) was correct for late war Panzergrenadieren and Gebirsjäger (it was a different shade for each one). In short a nightmare!!! Soviets wore no divisional insignia but Guard units usually wore a Guard insignia pinned on the breast, above right pocket Italian wore divisional/arm/service insignia on the collar. IIRC people is not sure about insignia from some coastal divisions. In short, a nightmare to code and do all of this I guess. (Note: The above data written out from memory so there might be some errors) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The other day when playing CMFI against the US I noticed I was fighting the 82nd AA since they have their shoulder patches included in the game being the only American airborne unit present in Sicilly. I personally feel that these small details lift the experience and was thinking how nice would it be to include Divisional insignia into the game for all units? I know you can do this today by modding but you have to change mods every time you wish to switch forces. The OOB data for WWII is researched and known so it would not be difficult to find out which divisions were present in a specific region during a specific period. Technically BF would have to assign a texture spot for infantry and tanks where the insignia would be applied depending on what choices scenario maker or QB player did. When selecting units for scenario you first have to select a division and then the units you wish to deploy. All the selected units under that division would get their insignia applied to uniforms / vehicles. Selecting another division would fetch another insignia and so on.. One other thing that is missing is combining different forces in QBs, Airborne and Regular, or US and British or German Panzer and Luftwaffe and so on.. While an interesting idea - interesting enough that I have a folder set up to mod my games by division for both the pixeltruppen and the UI (and sometimes for the armor as well) - it would be a real pain for BF to code. One example is the scenario editor, selecting a unit would need a drop down with every unit represented then BF would have to code the game to represent all those and every time they needed to adjust maps they would have to touch every one of those. It is a sure fire plan to slow down any version upgrades for previously released games. So while I love the concept I would rather not have it impact game production if I am already capable of doing this myself. Once you have the folder structure done, it really isn't that hard to swap folders. DC has done a great job of preparing this for a lot of Commonwealth units in CMBN and they are already up on the repository. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank Hunter Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 While an interesting idea - interesting enough that I have a folder set up to mod my games by division for both the pixeltruppen and the UI (and sometimes for the armor as well) - it would be a real pain for BF to code. One example is the scenario editor, selecting a unit would need a drop down with every unit represented then BF would have to code the game to represent all those and every time they needed to adjust maps they would have to touch every one of those. It is a sure fire plan to slow down any version upgrades for previously released games. So while I love the concept I would rather not have it impact game production if I am already capable of doing this myself. Once you have the folder structure done, it really isn't that hard to swap folders. DC has done a great job of preparing this for a lot of Commonwealth units in CMBN and they are already up on the repository. I'm not sure that it would complicate things. I don't know the inside of the design of the game but I guess the biggest work would be to code a certain area on a model to a certain texture. Once that is done connecting it to units and scenarios would be pretty straight forward. One folder or file can hold all the insignia with appropriate name (101,82, 54..). The scenario designer would from drop down menu select whatever division he wants to field and then select the units. Once selected these units would be referenced to correct insignia. The designer can then select another division and pick another set of units which would get their own insignia and so on.. There is no need to change this between the versions, once it is in place it doesn't have to be touched. Changing maps does not affect forces since they have already been assigned. The only time it would affect is if a divisional insignia was removed completely from a base game in which case they did a bad research They could also have default selection in which case the insignia patch would not be applied. For those who have no idea which forces were fielded I know this is not something that should be high on the list, there are tons of other more imortant stuff (FIRE.. ). It might however be one of those low hanging fruits which can be included with a small effort. I know that players like me who like to sniff around on the ground level during the fighting would appreciate it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poesel Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 IIRC a) would decals solve this problem and Steve said close to the release of CMBN that those were high on the list. So there might be a solution and we might even live to see it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not sure that it would complicate things. I don't know the inside of the design of the game but I guess the biggest work would be to code a certain area on a model to a certain texture. Where those insignia reside however changes by unit. Whether as poesel71 suggests that decals may help resolve I don't know. A drop down list of divisons in the editor however is something I doubt BF will be thrilled about. There is no need to change this between the versions, once it is in place it doesn't have to be touched. Changing maps does not affect forces since they have already been assigned. The only time it would affect is if a divisional insignia was removed completely from a base game in which case they did a bad research Just for clarification, I wasn't referring to game maps, but image maps which potentially could be impacted. I know BF wants to stabilize those so they do not need to be redone just to upgrade a version, however they are having to do just that for CMBN. I know this is not something that should be high on the list, there are tons of other more imortant stuff (FIRE.. ). It might however be one of those low hanging fruits which can be included with a small effort. I know that players like me who like to sniff around on the ground level during the fighting would appreciate it. Yeah I know I would! I definitely wouldn't want to give up fire for it, but yeah if it is something that eventually they found a reasonable answer for it would be absolutely cool. As it is now I have a couple PBEMs I may go through a turn or two a night and I definitely am not going to reload mods each time. If I am going to look for screenshots however I would. It would be really nice if that were not the case and every save I load in had the unit specific images for. yeah I'd pay extra for that - 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 sburke, I'm updating my old US div patch mod for use with sdp' Italy mod to use with for CMFI. I might not upload them, depending on how they look to me. But you're welcome to them when they are finished, regardless. They go along with a US uniforms mod (an admittedly unneeded product--the stock uniforms look great as is). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 sburke, I'm updating my old US div patch mod for use with sdp' Italy mod to use with for CMFI. I might not upload them, depending on how they look to me. But you're welcome to them when they are finished, regardless. They go along with a US uniforms mod (an admittedly unneeded product--the stock uniforms look great as is). excellent!! now all i need is mord/dc portrait mods.... hint hint hint 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darknight (DC) Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Mord is working on some stuff for CMFI....me, I'm the CW guy, so I'm just getting the proverbial ducks in a row for the eventual expansion module. I still have lots planned for CMBN but decided to take the summer off to recharge, play some games and wait for the upgrade before jumping back in. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I've been waiting for incendiary pigs for nigh on ten years now. It's a well known fact the Germans used them at Sevastopol. Only if they double as flares. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Ya, and Mord just got his friggin' computer working again...for the SECOND time in two days. And if he finds the Muther @$#$#^% ^&%$ &^$## ^^ *&%#@ dude that codes Java he's gonna beat his face in with a shoe! Up until that Java update my comp was working great. Now, after two complete reformats and installs I still can't get CMFI to run like it did before everything happened. And it crashes every now and then which has never happened to me on any CMX2 game. As far as divisional unis, I think that's a bit superfluous. We can easily do it now just by switching mods. And divisions don't normally mix, so? The only other thing I could see is if they assign unis by rank which Steve mentioned a while back I believe. My guess is we are probably about two upgrades away from having vehicles that can be numbered. We are real close on them now. All that needs to be done is to keep the hulls and turrets and such together by their bmp numbers. The real question is when do we see some Hit Decals?! Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hister Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I'm all in favor for the OP's idea! Oh and Hit Decals sound fabulous to! I found swapping insignia mods almost as a nuisance (in my The Road to Mounterbourg campaign) so I just opted to go without them. Too much work. For single scenarios that is a different story - just apply insignia mods and forget until new scenario is played. BUT having all this integrated by BF would be soooo much better! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I'm all in favor for the OP's idea! Oh and Hit Decals sound fabulous to! I found swapping insignia mods almost as a nuisance (in my The Road to Mounterbourg campaign) so I just opted to go without them. Too much work. For single scenarios that is a different story - just apply insignia mods and forget until new scenario is played. BUT having all this integrated by BF would be soooo much better! Lol, you should experience the hassle in modding them in the first place! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hister Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I know it had to be a grand undertaking with which simple mod swapping is like a baby's fart in comparison! But it's a nuisance never the less, albeit a small one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 But it's a nuisance never the less, albeit a small one. Agreed! And as far as making them, Mord's voices and UI faces mods, and Fuser/Aris dirty vehicle mods, take the cake by far for the most hassle/time consumption 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darknight (DC) Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 I was trying to make this easier with my 'mod packs'. Honestly, I really don't want BFC to allocate precious resources to doing this when there's so many other things I'd rather see first (actually, I wouldn't think they'd even consider it until they'd implemented almost every other wishlist item out there). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paper Tiger Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 LOL! I had the same idea when I read about the unique 82nd Airborne unit models in CMFI. Only one Brit, one Polish and two US airborne units in MG. It's not as easy to implement as you'd think. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 LOL! I had the same idea when I read about the unique 82nd Airborne unit models in CMFI. Only one Brit, one Polish and two US airborne units in MG. It's not as easy to implement as you'd think. And the mods go by Regiment not just division. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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