ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I remember there was talk of this back in the Big Time Software days, and I think some folks said it wasn't going to be done 'cause not much interesting happened over there during WWII that would make for an enjoyable tactical simulation. Do I remember correctly?? But then how about that early Soviet engagement with the Japanese which made them decide to focus efforts elsewhere, or how the Japanese sent their tanks through Malayan jungles to catch the British from behind, or even an Iwo Jima thinggy as the Japanese commander?? I'm just the most casual of wargamers (like, "Close Combat" was a wargame to me) so these scenarios seem pretty interesting to me (in fact, I'm looking forward to Theatre of War 3: Korea as the Chinese commander, wondering how to intelligently deploy inferior forces).... Anyway, just wonder whether years later the thinking's changed on this. To be honest, I'm getting a little tired of panzers and GI Joes...heck, how about colonial wars and ancient wars?? I know Battlefront's still fairly limited budgetwise as in their BTS days but could I really be the only one who's tired of seeing Germans, Americans, and Russians every time I pop back in here every three years or so?? Just curious; TIA! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Syria and Afghanistan are both in Asia, so your wish has already been fulfilled. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Only a madman would get involved in a landwar in Asia! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Belenko Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Only a madman would get involved in a landwar in Asia! I learned that lesson playing Risk. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kipanderson Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Hi, I would be happy enough to see a Pacific theatre title, one of the mainstream battles in the Pacific. But a new CM title is such a huge undertaking I guess Battlefront have to be confident they will get their money back from their investment. I think Europe with Panzers is where the money is in wargames when it comes to WWII. But maybe Steve will chip in and give a view. All the best, Kip. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vonRocko Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I would love to see pacific action also, but we can't even get the next module for this game! I don't see it ever happening. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 Okay, so it's not that nothing interesting happened there, wargaming-wise. But I still don't see how the market of grognards would avoid a WWII Asian war. I know it's not as sexy as Nazis (which, BTW, seem less "sexy" without their swastikas -- I think the politically correct crowd are unwittingly diminishing the evil of the Nazis by forcing game developers to pretend these are just German units same as any other German unit in any other German conflict in German history), but I'd imagine the interest is there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan/california Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Jungles and Islands are both somewhat problematic from a game play perspective. In a vaguely realistic jungle simulation the LOS issues are such that no one above the squad leader has much if any idea whats happening at a given spot, and even less ability to influence it. The island fighting was mostly serial bunker reduction. It was expensive in both men and material but very repetitious. If the U.S. was ashore at all it usually meant that the Japanese ability to maneuver was essentially over. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 CM tends to be at its best in combined arms operations, and some theaters just are richer in that area than others. You get more of that in two months in Normandy or Bagration than in the entire Pacific War together. If you truly believe otherwise, contact BFC and make an offer they cannot refuse. BFC would never have made a game on Soviet war in Afghanistan on their own, either. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 Jungles and Islands are both somewhat problematic from a game play perspective. In a vaguely realistic jungle simulation the LOS issues are such that no one above the squad leader has much if any idea whats happening at a given spot, and even less ability to influence it. The island fighting was mostly serial bunker reduction. It was expensive in both men and material but very repetitious. If the U.S. was ashore at all it usually meant that the Japanese ability to maneuver was essentially over. But that's why I'd mentioned those other scenarios, such as that Russian Far East one early on. Also, one could conceive of scenarios involving the occupation of China, or the invasion of Australia -- et cetera. I think such an effort would put Battlefront on the map yet again! Imagine: finally, the first real WWII-in-Asia wargame...am I correct in my sense that this is something of a "holy grail" of WWII wargaming?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLeftFlank Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Plenty of combined arms in the CBI Theatre. Also during the fight for Manila and some of the bigger islands (Bougainville, Okinawa). Meeting engagements betweeen mech forces, not so much (a couple in Burma). But as I've observed elsewhere, heavily modded British Airborne troops would make adequate Japanese.... Bren for Nambu, 2inch mortar for knee mortar, etc. No offense intended to the Red Devils. And believe you me, I am finding CMBN more than equal to the task of simulating dense vegetation, albeit on smallish maps. No grass huts, sure, but they'd provide about as much cover as the outhouses and shelters now available as doodads. And a Ryujin texture swap of the CMSF palm tree for the Type A oak would create a pleasing simulacrum of the PTO. Lots of tall grass, marsh and gapped bocage segments to limit LOS. Plus plentiful small watercourses to enhance infiltration and severely restrict vehicle movement. Banzai! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 The reason that BFC has given for not making a Pacific Combat Mission is that they have zero interest in the subject. I suppose that could change but I wouldn't hold my breath. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Balboa Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I would buy a PTO game using the CMx2 engine. I'm hoping another company will come along like the guys that did CM:Afghanistan who might be interested in taking the project on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 CM tends to be at its best in combined arms operations, and some theaters just are richer in that area than others. You get more of that in two months in Normandy or Bagration than in the entire Pacific War together. They can always go the what-if route, you know (Australian invasion, etc.). Also, that Soviet-Japanese engagement in Mongolia could serve for combined arms purposes (okay, no sexy hardware, but still...aren't grognards actually interested in the "theory" of it all, too??)...and just occupying China.... If you truly believe otherwise, contact BFC and make an offer they cannot refuse. BFC would never have made a game on Soviet war in Afghanistan on their own, either. Sorry, what's this referring to? The Koch Brothers funded Battlefront's Afghan effort or something?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 @LongLeftFlank: Yeah, I'd go for modding, but is it as cumbersome as it ever was back in the original CM days? :confused: @Vanir Ausf B: Oh, okay, now that you mention it, yeah, I think that was the ultimate reason given back then, too! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 They can always go the what-if route, you know (Australian invasion, etc.). Also, that Soviet-Japanese engagement in Mongolia could serve for combined arms purposes (okay, no sexy hardware, but still...aren't grognards actually interested in the "theory" of it all, too??)...and just occupying China.... That's still not quite the same. You don't have a multitude of tank divisions slugging it out in Manchuria, neither in Burma or China nor in hypothetical Australian invasion. These are in that sense 'poor' theaters compared to NWE or East Front where you get lots of very intense combined arms action in very short time. Sorry, what's this referring to? The Koch Brothers funded Battlefront's Afghan effort or something?? CM: Afghanistan was mostly made by a Russian studio, Snowball. I could envision some PTO afficianados forming their own joint and negotiating a deal with BFC for a 3rd party game. With the right people even a Chinese civil war game could be done. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 That's still not quite the same. You don't have a multitude of tank divisions slugging it out in Manchuria, neither in Burma or China nor in hypothetical Australian invasion. These are in that sense 'poor' theaters compared to NWE or East Front where you get lots of very intense combined arms action in very short time. CM: Afghanistan was mostly made by a Russian studio, Snowball. I could envision some PTO afficianados forming their own joint and negotiating a deal with BFC for a 3rd party game. With the right people even a Chinese civil war game could be done. Well, then, what a great opportunity to make a different kind of wargame, then -- the kind I'd envisioned in my other post about the two Frenchmen -- since there aren't gazillions of AFVs and planes involved! Finally, wargaming that's personal, and not "simply" number-crunching physics and graphics.... If I ever win the Powerball/etc. (or secure some multi-million dollar movies deals for my romance and political thriller fiction [yeah, really]) y'all will see a PTO Combat Mission! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartokomus Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I guess everyone has a different "Holy Grail"; i'm just waiting for CM: East Front to come. Far East, North Africa, and the Western Front are all just ancillary theaters IMO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConfusedBuyer Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 I guess everyone has a different "Holy Grail"; i'm just waiting for CM: East Front to come. Far East, North Africa, and the Western Front are all just ancillary theaters IMO. I also like to see the Mediterranean stuff. Seriously, panzers and GIs, panzers and GIs...it's getting to be like Army chow! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Ost Front. That's gonna be the holy grail. After Commonwealth Im most excited for Arnhem. I could skip the odds n sods. Bulge is ok, though I'm more excited about the Ost front. Arnhem.. Bocage.. its all cool. but it doesnt have the same intensity and bitterness as the Seelow Heights, Berlin, Stalingrad, etc etc etc. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 This subject has been beaten to death. BFC has said it isn't going to happen. As much as I would like to see the period from 41-43 done by BFC, it just won't be so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLeftFlank Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 @LongLeftFlank: Yeah, I'd go for modding, but is it as cumbersome as it ever was back in the CM days? I didn't mod back in CM1 days, and my CMSF efforts extend only to building facades but it isn't all that hard for those willing to learn GIMP or another program. M1A1TC did a Korean War part II mod for CMSF including Korean faces... They don't work right with the CMBN wireframes but would probably work with some manipulation. The Para helmets will do for later war IJA with some good helmet netting. For uniforms and webbing you'd need to play around a bit but probably doable -- the biggest challenge would be the footwear - the Japs did that bandage thing instead of gaiters. If you don't like them toting SMLEs you might texture swap those with K98s which look more like IJA service rifles. A search of the forums will tell you how to do texture swapping. Bottom line: start a CMBN Pac War mod set and you miggt find some modders pitching in to help you. But by now I think you've got the message that an official BFC product isn't in the cards. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Plenty of combined arms in the CBI Theatre. Lots of interesting stuff went on in the CBI and I've been lobbying for it for a decade. Just doing the Chindits would make a damned interesting game, and there was a lot more than that. But has been said, the guys at BFC seem to be immune to the charms of the monsoon country. Who can account for tastes? Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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