Haiduk

This was not the battle. Just turkey shot of columnes, which drove in march order. Battle for Ilovaisk, which took place from 7-24th Aug is a separate episode, which mistakenly mixed with developments of 25-29th Aug, when under ruling of Khomchak arrived units of Sector D, which was disbanded approx.23-24th of Aug. If all that forces would manage defense in seized part of Ilovaoisk or really would try to break through, the result could be other... One of main argument of pro-Muzhenko's "camp" is Ilovaisk operation has been planned in interests of oligarh Kolomoiskyi (to take control uder energy plant in Zugres - Ilovaisk was the obstaclee on the way to this target) and conducted by volunteer battalions. As if ATO HQ didn't give any orders to assault Ilovaisk (and as I said, volunteer battalions weren't under command of Muzhenko). Also this "camp" claims Khomchak (he was the general of "6th Army Corps Dnipropetrovsk military clan", when Muzhenko is from "8th Army corps Kyiv military clan") was close to environment of Kolomoiskyi and in violation of Muzhenko's order gave to volunteers in support army group of Sector B (about two combined companies) and personnaly led the operation, moving Sector B HQ to Ilovaisk area. Finally this played bad work for remained Ukrainian runits of Sector D - when the sector was disbanded, these units were attached to Sector B and retreated to the dislocation of Khomchak's HQ. Directly in the trap. As a counter version, pro-Khomchak (or anti-Muzhenko&Poroshenko) "camp" claims ATO HQ had a plans to encircle Donetsk and Ilovaisk was a part of this plan. They also showed the WARNO from 4th Aug, where some army units receive orders to set chekpoints around Ilovaisk. On their opinion this is a proof that exactly Muzhenko planned this operation, but small detail - in WARNO text clearly written "The staff of Sector B orders..." and the sign - general Khomchak. Not Muzhenko. From the other hand, Muzhenko really said ATO HQ planned operation of outflanking Donetsk from the south, but he claimed Ilovaisk battle was usual tactical clash, not general battle. As if this was secondary task, so ATO HQ decided to involve volunteers through representative of police in ATO HQ, because according intelligence information, Ilovaisk hadn't strong garrison (that turned out wrong). @kinophile I think this will be interesting for you, since you have interest to Ilovaisk battle

By the version of Muzhenko, at the evening 26th of Aug Putin agreed with "green corridor" and about two days this question discussed on the RU and UKR General Staffs level. But 28th Aug Russian side suddenly changed own mind - at 22-00 Russian colonel-general Bogdanovskyi, first deputy of General Staff Chief called to Muzhenko and said Ukrainian troops now can withdraw through "green corridor" only if they will be completely disarmed. Muzhenko rejected because Russian side evaded from the question about security guaranties. Muzhenko claims, that because of hard situation, he couldn't order nothing to Khomchak and because Khomchak was in epicenter of developments, he gave to him a right to assume decision. But he has offered to Khomchak to take all trops in Ilovaisk, set up strong defense there and wait reinforcenent, which should to deblocate them. But this offer was rejected by volunteer battalions commanders - they are were not part of ATO HQ and subordinated only to Ministry of internal affairs, so neither Khomchak, nor Muzhenko couldn't order them to stay. Commanders said, if Khomchak and army units want to stay and die, that is their business, but volunteers will go out, because they exhausted (exacly mostly volunteers - about 500 fighters were involved in the fight for Ilovaisk since 7 Aug, most of army units - remains of Sector D, withdrew to Ilovaisk area from the border on 24-26th of Aug). Then Khomchak said "well we will withdraw together". Then Muzhenko offered to Khomchak the variant of night breakthough of small groups on wide front in different directions - mostly on the south, where enemy screen was not so strong. But on the next counсil volunteer units commanders rejected and that variant too. Russians alredy have negotiations directly with Khomchak and offerd him secure withdrawal - all commanders knew about this and didn't want to risk. In this time negotiations continued both on General Staffs level and on the level of Sector B staff. Muzhenko was in contact with generals Bogdanovskyi, Yebstratov and with Gerasimov, Russian Chief of General Staff. But Russian generals were turning this around each on other and than on lower levels. At last on Khomchak staff level as if achieved an agreement about withdrawal with weapon and vehicles. It was supposed to start at the down 29th of Aug in two columns under leading of Russian troopers. But in 6-00 to the Khomchak a Russian officer arrived and said that condition has changed again - there is only one route now and UKR troops must witdrawal completely disarmed. Khomchak claimed to communicate with hihger levels to know what happened and how to turn conditins back. Russians were promising to give an answer each half hour. Other version said, that not only Russian delayed the time, but Khomchak too, because of not all Ukrainain troops left positions in Ilovaisk and around it yet. At last, Russians answered they are agree on previous conditions, but Ukrainian combat vehicles must drive with covered weapon. At 8-15 Ukrainain columnes started a movement, when the head of northern column, headed by Khomchak passed inner circle of Russian positions (that on the Shaposhnikov's video), the tail is not moved yet. But when all Ukrainain troops were already on the march, Russian troops opened fire. There is a version, that commander of southern column without any visible reason commenced fire on Russian positions and gave the code order "Buran 555" (to breakthrough), but from other hand, Ukrainian troops proceeded in march order with covered wepon, so were unable to make any offensive or breakthough actions. But other troopers, survived in this hell told Russians opened fire, when рфда ща UKR south column already passed Chervonosilske village...

Ilovaisk story smells very bad on all levels. I know about this episode and I think very probably it can be true. Though, Shaposhnikov known like very biased blogger. We have two "camps" - one blames Poroshenko and Muzhenko and their opponents blames Kolomoiskyi, Khomchak and volunteers in reasons and decisions, which led to tragedy. As for each side is right, but don't want to recognize own "party" gult too. Shaposhnikov is not a fan of Poroshenko, but he gives very negative assessment to Khomchak. From other hand, Khomchak rejected to leave own troops, when special force group arrived to the base camp near Ilovaisk 25th Aug to take him in safe place.

There is no full encirclement neither 2nd of June, nor in the night on 4th June. Enemy groups shelled the base from the residual area "Myrnyi" (means "Peaceful", what a play of word), from the hill's slope and from treeplant. Airstrikes forced LNR fighters to withdraw in "Myrnyi". The group, which tried to seize the base has no more than 150-200 men. In the night from 3rd on 4th June most of them were taken to assault National Guard unit, so enemy has only small number of watchers, than real screen. Serhyi Deyneko, border guard commander was familiar with LNR leader and fighters commander Bolotov (before war he was security and driver of local oligarch Yefremov, which in 2010 "asked" for Deyneko appointment ). Deyneko says he took 30 men in five small groups and diring the night left the base in southern direction. Other in civil clothes also left the base in small groups. Hard to say there is were any agreements or not, but after such losses, I think, no. LNR fighters didn't stay near the base, because border guard snipers eliminated and wounded several of them, when they tried to advance or even tried to shot from cover, like in this case:

In the night on 4th June border guards received an order to break through with small groups to Luhansk airport, controlled by UKR troops. Border guard commander want to fight, but chief of Border Guard said form Kyiv he will not send any reinforcement of mobile border guard reserve from nearby Stanytsia Luhanska settlement, because they will forced to assault two LNR checkpoints on their way. He put all responsibility for possible casualties on the commander of detachment and in such way forced him to leave the base. During the night on 4th June most LNR forces were moved to assault of 15th National Guard regiment in the center of Luhansk. 32 border guards with arms successfully passed through sparse LNR shield. Other 95 servicemen damaged own weapon, dressed in civil clothes and in such way left the base. During the fighting on 2nd June, when short truce was declared to take the wounded, 14 mobilized servicemen left the base with agreement of commander, since some time 6 other left the unit because LNR fighters used own standard tactic - after the combat phase they called parents of soldiers in order they begged them not shoot, to think about parents and to lay down a weapon. Exactly this scene, when two dozens mobilized and conscripts leave the base, Russian propaganda showed as "unit surrendered and fighters let to servicemen off". But unlike in National Guard units, where most servicemen were local conscripts, most of border guards were contractors, so this plan foiled and the "green berets" continued to fight and in the next day. They fought good and were the single military unit in Luhansk which provide fierce resistance among other. Own losses were 13 injured (two of them hard), among LNR fighters were 4 KIA and two other died in hospital during next week. Number of injured is unknown - not less a dozen, I think. Again. Su-25 probably has a tack to strike HQ of "Army of South East" in SBU building, address Sovetskaya str.79. Yes, in the center of Luhansk. But instead hit administration building on Great Patriotic War heroes sqr. (opposite Sovetskaya 60 building) in 860 m westward from SBU building. What was a reason of attack of this building - mistake or presence of ZU-23 in the park or something else is unknown. This is a war and such happens not rare. If "bloody junta" wanted to make real "bombardment", they would send Su-25 of Su-24 with 500 kg HE or cluster bombs - in the same way like Russia did in Chechnya and in Syria. Most of our fallen soldiers (if to compare with other regions) are from eastern Dnipropetrovsk region. This is to your sentence about "Western Ukraine make war against eastern". ____________ For moderators. I ask do not close this thread. Local trolls again do own work, but I don't want any politic discussion here. In further I will answer only on the questions about combat developments, if any will have its.

Saying A, say B too. Since 29th of May to 3rd of June LNR forses in Luhansk assaulted or seized several Ukrainian military units with several casualties from both sides. 2nd of June LNR forces attacked a base of Luhansk border guard detachment, located in south part of the city. There is aviation was used for border guards support - Su-27 and Mi-24. There is a version, that Su-25 had a task to hit SBU building, which was HQ of so-called "Army of South East", but the pilot has made a mistake in orientation and struck with several unguided rockets a building of Luhansk regional administration. Both buildings, occupied by terrorists and Russian collaborants were lawful military targets. Israel in such cases is acting more tough.

Even 120 mm mortar shell can penetrate several layers of wood on blindage top. 40 kg shell of 2S3 with 5,8 kg of HE and the more 110 kg shell of 2S7 with 17,8 kg of HE, falling from the sky with 9.81g and a big speed is a fatality for 30-45 mm top armor (well, let even 40-70 mm in Abrams).

Reported by me many months ago, but to this time not implemented

No. We havn't such ammunition for mortars. There is three craters near the trench - looks like several misses remained beyond the video.

There is one realistic and hardcore feature - to use the camera on eye-level only or at least on one step higher. And do not close the camera to the enemy objects. There is would be great, if some "fog of war" existed over terrain in 200-300 m from any unit, especially for crews of armored vehicles.

Enemy BMP hit. Looks like mortar shell. The hole in the hull top is visble at the end of the video.

Initially Yandex maps updated own sattelite images of Ukraine in 2017, Google Maps - some after in 2017-2018. You can also watch almost week-by-week satellite images on TerraServer: https://www.terraserver.com

What new and overhelming Russia demonstrated in Ukraine and Georgia? Most of their success is a consequenses of not so "newest doctrines", as rough mistakes of the opposing HQs and superior in forces. Russia is capable to create outstanding TV-picture of strong modern army, but they have the same problems like all post-soviet armies. Experience of engagement in Sector A in 2014 showed that Russian troops is not "invincible machine" - if their opponents are ready to stand and fight and retain controllability, Russians can't achieve own "primary victory conditions".

Combat episodes of 46th special purpose battalion "Donbas-Ukraina" in Zaytseve area near Horlivka in May 2018. Enemy sniper shells position with large caliber rifle, ukrainians tryes to supress his position with DShK, other episode - ukrainians under mortar shelling.

That was fake news. I've posted about this two years ago, but already forgot where exactly. You can google it.

Destroying of two enemy BMP in trenches and mortar strike on the enemy position - Svitlodarsk bulge area, 7th of May. Such increadable accuracy of fire owing to not only PDA's for targeting, but also because senior battery officer (he calculates data for firing) has great expirience since 2014. Crack level.

"Vasiliok" unlike usual mortar can shot with direct fire. But not too far - about 800 m. It has even HEAT ammunition for direct shot fire. But I didn't hear about such usage on Donbas.

In early part of the war was standard mortar for airmobile brigades, also was in mountain brigade. Now still in use by air-assault troops and some mech., motorized and mountain troops in battalion's fire support companies, where 82 mm mortar platoon are established. Some is using 2B14, some 2B9.

Emmm..... What division/corps? In 2014 no one brigade did not operate in full order. Combined groups of several army unints and National Guard/volunteerrs is formed. Whole length of Russian-Ukrainian border, where our troops took main positions (Kumachove-Izvarino sector) is 140 km. This space should have been taken and held only 5 BTGs (two of them was airmobile without tanks) of three different brigades, two artillery batteries of corps level, Special Forces detachment (equal to mech.company ), combined group of National Guard equal to battalion and different border guard units also equal to battalion. Only since 2016 we got brigades properly equipped with personnel. Maneuvers of last two yeras shows brigade and combined forces training, not BTGs only.

Not agree with this. BTG/RTG is a basemant of tactic. WWII style battles "division on division" already impossible.

Russian artillery "oblitarated" about month several battalion tactical groups, which were deployed on one place near the border and wich can't respond on Russian territory. Yes, Russians used ELINT, UAV targeting, sometime guided ammunitions 122 and 152 mm, but most losses among Ukrainian troops was in vehicles (about 2/3 ), but not in the personnel. The maneuver was limited, so vehicles were easy targets. Of course, several weeks under day by day shellings, hit morale of troops, but they successfully broke through and escaped. Most known strike on Zelenopillia took 36 KIA and 93 WIA because personnel was deployed with big density in the tents and this was first sudden strike from Russian territory. And yes, despite Donbas war is a war of MLRS, artillery and mortars, but this is low intensity conflict, no one of sides never grouped more artillery battalion for firing simultainously and this was too rarely. So it can be approximated on possible "big war", but very approximately. The usual practic is actions with artillery batteries, which already in 2014-2015 transformed in actions with artillery platoons and this inflicted some changes in tactic of artilelry usage and spotters work. Now each commander, even in the infantry squad is studying to target artillery and adjust artillery fire. I think in the game, time of artillery call should be reduced in 1.5 times relatively to real world norms because speed of action developments in the game about in 1,5-2 times faster, than in real combat. Though, 7-9 min for "serious caliber" calls look like already reduced.

The hystory is making by active minority. Rest "swamp" only can boil over on own kitchens. I don't know what will do Zelenskyi, but I think the situation with Trump will repeat. Russia prayed for his victory, but... something went wrong. Zelenskyi of course, more liberal then Poroshenko, but since 2014 he is supporting our army on Donbas. Zelenskyi with Air-assult troops commander lt.general Zabrodskyi.

Yes, usual ammunitions. UAV also successfully targets SPG-9 and AGS indirect fire. Of course, if UAV has targeting function and features of data transmiting on PDA with artillery soft. In other case UAV just observes battlefield and fire is adjusting "on eye", but this anyway better, than nothing. Here February 2019 episode, "Azov" regiment hit enemy BMP in the trench with indirect SPG-9 fire, using UAV targeting And here also "Azov" strikes enemy positions with UAV targeting, looks like mortars used. The end of March 2019.

Several months ago Joint Forces Operation HQ changed own information policy. If recently they limited publications of videos with strikes on enemy positions, and most of videos were publishing via civil volunteers and soldiers, then now many of videos almost every day are officially posting through special account. Only on fifth year of the war or top brass at last understand important of such type of propaganda. For example,the video how 2-3 days ago 82 mm mortars hit LNR ammo truck near Zolote town. UAV is adjusting fire. MTLB, which stood near, moved back after the end of shelling, but new round impacted near and vehicle was sligtly damaged. Two fighters, which tried to save boxes with ammunition, probably got injuries or even were killed.

OSCE spotted it on 16th March. The strike was conducted on 27th of March. Who care that Russians almost didn't change positions (ok, moved on 8 km northern) for that time? Both sides uses heavy arty and mortars - this is not secret for OSCE, they point all facts in own reports. Diplomats and politics lives in own world, military - in own. The war is going on. Our HQ officially will say "enemy got return fire with allow weapon systems". You wanted hybrid war, so take it.