John Kettler Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) Have seen still and moving imagery of all sort of AFVs in Paris in this period, including a CV-33 and a recaptured Char B heavy tank with FFI stenciled on it in huge size, but this is one I never knew of before today. This is the blown up version of the pic. Wonder what the locals thought as these ground shakers came through. Note the guy on his bicycle based cart between the two monsters. Regards, John Kettler Edited March 28, 2020 by John Kettler 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Backer Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) And riding with typical French aplomb, as if his very manner says “bah! These metal monsters do not impress me, monsieur.” Great shot. Bresson’s decisive moment. Edited March 28, 2020 by Bud Backer Adding élan... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 It looks like Stalingrad to me. but I can't read the street sign. And I can't find an exact match for that flight of stairs, bloody modernisation. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Warts 'n' all said: It looks like Stalingrad to me. but I can't read the street sign. And I can't find an exact match for that flight of stairs, bloody modernisation. You think you are funny. You are not. You are very tiresome. Just refrain from commenting if you have nothing to say. I'm sure that will reduce the number of your annoying posts at least by half. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) Nice pic, John. Thank you! I think I once saw this picture in a book about the German intervention in Budapest/Hungary in 1944. Edited March 28, 2020 by Aragorn2002 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 Stalingrad ([stalinɡʁad]) is a Paris Métro station on the border between the 10th arrondissement and the 19th arrondissement at the intersection of lines 2, 5, and 7, located at the Place de la Bataille-de-Stalingrad, which is named for the Battle of Stalingrad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalingrad_(Paris_Métro) Obviously not called that in 1944 though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 Let's get this bit out of the way first. Dear Adolf, you keep telling everyone that you are going to put me on your "Ignore" list. PLEASE do so as it will spare other forumites from having to read your tiresome complaints about me. Dank u wel. Now to those of you who's opinions I care about. @John Kettler has only been able to tell us that the picture was taken in Paris. I haven't been able to find a more detailed caption online. I'm giving Stalingrad as the location because it is a Metro station on the elevated section on the Right Bank, and it stands on one of the few places where the line does such a sharp left hand turn. I don't know it's pre-war name, in the same way that don't know the original name of Bir-Hakeim, a station on the left bank that takes it's name from a WW2 battle. If anyone knows their wartime names please tell us. The only Kompanie from 503. to be equipped with King Tigers was 111.Kompanie which took delivery of them at Marly-le-Camp in early August. From what I can glean they didn't make it to the front in Normandy, and weren't actually able to make it to the Left Bank at all. As previously stated the area has undergone extensive modernisation, the building on the left no longer exists, and the flight of stairs have gone. I have tried to find another set of stairs at another station on that are on that alignment but without success. There are mature trees near the station now and one of them matches the young tree in the picture. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, Pete Wenman said: Stalingrad ([stalinɡʁad]) is a Paris Métro station on the border between the 10th arrondissement and the 19th arrondissement at the intersection of lines 2, 5, and 7, located at the Place de la Bataille-de-Stalingrad, which is named for the Battle of Stalingrad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalingrad_(Paris_Métro) Obviously not called that in 1944 though. I really need to type faster. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 Ah, but you typed more, I just copied and pasted ! P 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 6 minutes ago, Pete Wenman said: Ah, but you typed more, I just copied and pasted ! P Nice one, Pete. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 Rue du Château-Landon looks possible, but so do many other locations P 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn2002 Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Warts 'n' all said: Let's get this bit out of the way first. Dear Adolf, you keep telling everyone that you are going to put me on your "Ignore" list. PLEASE do so as it will spare other forumites from having to read your tiresome complaints about me. Dank u wel. I did put you on my ignore list for a while, but that didn't stop you from attacking me with your cheap insults. So, no, I'm not going to ignore you anymore. For the sake of this forum I will keep it civil, but man, do I have a low opinion of you. Dear Adolf? Really? So, you compare me with a mass murderer and fanatical nazi? And that's allowed on this forum? Edited March 28, 2020 by Aragorn2002 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaise Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 These tigers are unlikely to belong to s / pza 503.They arrived in Normandy in early July without having passed through Paris.They are engaged against the British east of Caen.The first is destroyed by Lieutenant Gorman of the 2nd Irish Guard who spurs it (!) On August 18 the first day of Operation GoodwoodA second is destroyed by 5 DCLI of 43eme ID on August 7 after a 2 inch mortar rocket was shot down on the supply vehicle which parked next to the tank.Finally the others were lost during the retreat, abandoned and scuttled by their crew none seem to have reached Paris on this occasionYou probably have to look more on the side of the 1ss Pz division 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaise Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 Eisenhower the 23 august close a tiger 2 on the road between Trun to Vimoutier tracks tensioner hatch used as an anvil that I recovered in 1996 at Nécy between Falaise and Argentan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 That is somewhat confusing as my search threw up the name 503. It is probably just a typo but Goodwood began on 18th July. And whilst I cannot find any record of 1. or 11. Kompanies being withdrawn from the front, 111. Kompanie did go back to Marly and did attempt to return via Paris. That however doesn't mean that these KT's have to be from 111. Kompanie. And hopefully John Kettler will be able to furnish us with more info as to where he found the picture, and it's original caption the next time he is on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Backer Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) I tried to find the picture in Bundesarchiv but none of the Paris 1944 pictures are this one. I’m really intrigued! The shot is on Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.ca/pin/304274518554402208/ source appears to be Getty. https://www.gettyimages.ca/detail/news-photo/in-august-1944-german-tiger-ii-tanks-of-503rd-panzer-news-photo/121507401 Edited March 28, 2020 by Bud Backer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaise Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 I correct what I said beforeThe 3rd company of 503 received tanks at Mailly lateIt does not reach the Normandy front and retreats while crossing ParisThese are KT henschelIn the photo it's a tank from the 3rd company (331) 40 minutes ago, Warts 'n' all said: It is probably just a typo but Goodwood began on 18th July. yes of course i don't understand 111 kompagnie there is only 3 compagnie in 503 !! 29 minutes ago, Bud Backer said: I tried to find the picture in Bundesarchiv but none of the Paris 1944 pictures are this one. I’m really intrigued! The shot is on Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.ca/pin/304274518554402208/ source appears to be Getty. https://www.gettyimages.ca/detail/news-photo/in-august-1944-german-tiger-ii-tanks-of-503rd-panzer-news-photo/121507401 I think it's a French civil photo can be resistance taken from a window, the risks to take this kind of shot was death 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Falaise said: i don't understand 111 kompagnie there is only 3 compagnie in 503 !! Sometimes they are written as 1. 11. 111. instead 1 2 3, sorry for the confusion. Edited March 28, 2020 by Warts 'n' all 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) King Tiger tanks of schwere Panzer-Abteilung 503 having just been transported by rail from Mailly-le-Camp and de-trained at Gare de l'Est, Paris can be are seen turning from Rue d'Aubervilliers into Boulevard de la Villette on their way to Mantes-la-Jolie * https://www.pinterest.com.mx/pin/431078995567859884/ maybe a connection here http://tank-photographs.s3-website-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/king-tiger-tank-fontenay-saint-pere.html * This is a photo of a King Tiger Tank turret in France. He said that this and other King Tiger Tank parts were found in 2001 near Mantes-la-Jolie, France, This Tiger 2 tank, from the 101 SS.s.Abteilung, was lost in a crater near Fontenay-Saint-Père on 26 August 1944. And restored 'According to an article from the Musée des Blindés French Tank museum's magazine n° 54, this King Tiger tank, which now carries the turret number 233, is believed to be tank number 123, which belonged to the 1st Company, 101 SS Panzer Abt in August 1944. It is believed to have been abandoned by its crew on 23 August 1944, due to engine problems, at Brueil-en-Vexin, near Mantes-la-Jolie. It was salvaged by the French Army in September 1944, and then stored at the AMX Tank factory at Satory before being transferred to the museum in 1975.' http://tank-photographs.s3-website-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/tiger-II-heavy-tank-Konigstiger.html 'In August 1944, German Tiger II tanks of 503rd Panzer leaving Paris for the Normandy front.' Colourised version Edited March 28, 2020 by Wicky 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaise Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 wikki answered all of our questions !!!the photo was taken by Robert Doisneau one of the greatest French photographerknown in particular for this photo which was undoubtedly the most common poster in the French student room at the end of the 80's 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Wicky said: King Tiger tanks of schwere Panzer-Abteilung 503 having just been transported by rail from Mailly-le-Camp and de-trained at Gare de l'Est, Paris can be are seen turning from Rue d'Aubervilliers into Boulevard de la Villette on their way to Mantes-la-Jolie 'In August 1944, German Tiger II tanks of 503rd Panzer leaving Paris for the Normandy front.' Oh well done, Wicky. I got the right Metro station, but the wrong end of it. A mistake I wouldn't have made if I'd been able to read the street sign. Just in case people think we make this rubbish up here is a view from inside the modern station... Edited March 28, 2020 by Warts 'n' all 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warts 'n' all Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Falaise said: wikki answered all of our questions !!!the photo was taken by Robert Doisneau one of the greatest French photographerknown in particular for this photo which was undoubtedly the most common poster in the French student room at the end of the 80's I'd like to pretend that I first saw this at an exhibition. But, I didn't. The first time I saw it was on the front cover of a Tracey Thorn single. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted March 30, 2020 Author Share Posted March 30, 2020 Outstanding work, guys! Here is what might've been news before I saw this research extravaganza. You'll note a name I believe to be the author of a bunch of Panzer and Wehrmacht books. Just passing through! King Tigers in Paris, France (Summer 1944) https://dailyarchives.org/…/king-tigers-in-paris-summer-194… Image expands when clicked. DAILYARCHIVES.ORG 3232 23 Comments Like Comment Comments Active Now Steve Miller It's a bug out.... Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d John Kettler Don't think so, for were that the case, they would've been covered with infantry. Have seen StuG IIIs carrying so many I wondered why they didn't overload the suspension. Also, note the complete absence of the Panzer bush look. To me, these factors mean they're moving administratively, not fleeing in retreat. 1 Edit or delete this Like · Reply · 1d George Kettler interesting that the crew are in BLACK this late in the war vs Cammie. Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Topi Mikkola Was it ever switched to completely camo? I have read and seen lots of late war images with panzer crews in black. Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Andy Duffell George Kettler Yeah, don't think this is unusual is it? Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d View 2 more replies Truscott Trotter When are driving King Tiger you could wear a basque and no one would argue..... 5 Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Chris Cornwell Interesting, looking up the movements of the very few Tiger IIs units that went to Normandy, they all appear to have de-trained WEST of Paris, so wouldn’t have driven through the city. Schwere Pzr Abt 503 did have 14 of them en route in early August from Mailly which arrived very late (didn’t fight at Falaise), so it might be them 2 Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Ignacy Kurowski According to an article I read recently, these are tanks of the 3rd company of schwere Panzer-Abteilung 503, which drove through Paris as a display of power. One of them broke down during that drive. 2 Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Alex Wood Only one? 3 Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Chris Cornwell Ignacy Kurowski cool, so it probably is them, with the deteriorating situation in Normandy a show of strength in mid August makes sense. Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d View 1 more reply Ian Hemingway At least they would have been safe from air attack Hide or report this Like · Reply · 1d Ian Black Ian Hemingway I was wondering about that. Otherwise by Summer 44 very risky for paneers to move during daylight. 1 Hide or report this Like Like Love Haha Wow Sad Angry · Reply · 1d Chris Cornwell Ian Black they would be fine in the city, impossible to spot, and no allied jabo would risk flying over the amount of potential flak in a city anyway. They spend their days cruising up and down railway lines. That’s what my old dad did. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudhugger Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 John Kettler, I saw this on a Tiger site. The dates are a bit off from the picture, but some may have left for Paris early. Seems 3. did not fare so well in Normandy. At least they saw Paris. 18 July 1944---- 3./ is bombed during Operation Goodwood, but only two Tigers are lost, one burnt out and the other was flipped over by a near miss. 13 Tigers lost during the day to all causes 20-29 July 1944----3./ ordered to Mailly-le-Camp for re-equipment with Tiger IIs 12 August 1944----3./ entrains for Paris mid-August 1944----Most of 3./ destroyed by Allied fighter-bombers, all of the rest of the Abt. is destroyed during the retreat from Normandy, only 2 Tiger IIs of 3./ on strength 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.X Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 If not said before, Panzer-Lehr-Division (with attached Funklenk-Kompanie 316) used some of the earliest Tiger II (I think, 5 or 6 tanks of this type). These Tigers all had the „Porsche“-Turret. Most of them were abandoned in the Paris-Area due to mechanical defeat while retreating from the Allies in August 44. None of these Panzer-Lehr Tigers ever fired any shot at the enemy. Regards 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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