Water In Scenario Design

[Mord]

Thanks Mord. It sort of grabbed me and wouldn't let go.

And to think that not a single soul will ever have any reason to tread that particular swamp.

Maybe I will put Shrek's shack in the middle.

Yeah it's not hard to get lost in the details...but then again that's what makes the maps go from nice to spectacular.

Oh, I could see a depleted stick of paratroopers dropped way off course trying to pick their way out of that quagmire...a few hours before dawn...Germs everywhere.

Mord.

[Sgt Schultz]

That is coming soon™ to a scenario near you.

Squads/toons appearing at random all over the map every turn. Weakened, and low headcount, and right in the enemy's face.

Drop 'em in one of the new swamps and they may just sit down and cry.

The new time feature where I can adjust when the sun cracks the horizon during the battle is just epic for that. Drop in the dark and fight in the dawn.

[Mord]

EXCELLENT! Look forward to it! It'll be just in time for D-DAY anniversary. Gonna be a great summer!

Mord.

[mjkerner]

Awwww, Sgt., I am doing one similar. It even has swampy areas. Maybe great minds think alike??? I do have one twist to add, though.....

[slysniper]

Speaking of water, can anyone help me with this picture?

http://www.battlefront.com/images/stories/CMBN/Gall3/md_screenshot11_1200.jpg

Firstly, I think this town river looks really great and I´d like to play the scenario but haven´t been able to find it. Does anyone here know where I can find it?

Secondly, the banks of river seems to be a "vertical wall" rather than the sloping banks I am able to produce myself in the editor.

How do I make these "canal-like" banks on a river?

Cheers

I have found one of the best ways to learn tricks about map building is open up the scenario files of others and see how they are getting cool features within their maps.

Other than that, just get in there and try things, it can be frustrating at times, but it teaches you what can and cannot be down with the program.

It is a investment of time though.

[LongLeftFlank]

Thanks for your reply, hoolaman.

But are you sure it´s just a pavement covered slope? I´ve already tried that - and unfortunately it didn´t look nearly as great as in this screenshot. To me this looks like a vertical wall - I´ve only managed to produce slopes.

Could you please tell me if the location in the screenshot is in any scenario? I´d love to have a closer look at it.

Cheers

Try placing a cobbled road running right along the river. That might not get you dead vertical but should straighten out the banks. Also try playing with the elevation - a few meters will steepen the banks a lot.

[akd]

If a single "land" tile is surrounded by deep ford along all or most edges, water will flood the tile leaving only the doodads exposed. This can be exploited to create very large flooded field/marsh grass areas:

No need to monkey with the elevations of the tiles within the body of water, although it may be best to "fix" the elevation of the water tiles that directly border the edge of the wetlands area you are creating.

[LongLeftFlank]

Try placing a cobbled road running right along the river. That might not get you dead vertical but should straighten out the banks. Also try playing with the elevation - a few meters will steepen the banks a lot.

Yep, it works. Vertical enough for ya?

Fix the water at level 20, fix all the adjoining squares at level 22. This shot uses the "paved 1" ground type and a "paved road 2" running parallel to the canal on either side.

[Sgt Schultz]

Very Nice!

I will be pinching that concept.

-

[LongLeftFlank]

Yes, I noticed this "single water table " too, although on balance it seems like it solves more problems than it creates.

There's a weir/spillway on the Vire by La Meauffe (which was a heavily fortified position) with a couple of sturdy old watermills either side. I am currently playing with ways to depict this in the game.

The water is at height 20, road tile (weir) is at height 24, the far bank is at height 23.

And vehicles will not be able to get onto it, only infantry; I just checked.

[theFightingSeabee]

That's some really cool stuff, guys. I love watching all the experiments like this.

[Broadsword56]

So cool, Longleftflank! And with those vertical paved/cobbled riverbanks CMBN has the makings for the Seine in Paris (for those R&R scenarios).

[hoolaman]

Thanks for your reply, hoolaman.

But are you sure it´s just a pavement covered slope? I´ve already tried that - and unfortunately it didn´t look nearly as great as in this screenshot. To me this looks like a vertical wall - I´ve only managed to produce slopes.

Could you please tell me if the location in the screenshot is in any scenario? I´d love to have a closer look at it.

Cheers

No I'm sure this is not in any scenario that is included in the game, I'm pretty sure it was just a setpiece for the "cameras".

I say again you cannot reproduce EXACTLY that setup now because the way water banks behave is different in the game now compared to that early beta. In the game now they tend to produce "cliff" terrain due to the sharp elevation change as you can see in LLF's pics above.

I have found a way to reproduce that effect though and keep the full cobblestone texture, and the key is the low walls running alongside the water which seem to pin the elevations differently.

EDIT: Sorry about the JPEG compression. The tiles there are Cobblestone, Pavement 1 with a low stone wall adjacent to the water and the water itself with elevation 19 all other elevations 20.

[umlaut]

Vertical enough for ya?

Sure is

Only problem is: That´s not the result I get, when I copy your instructions. I get this (which I got some days ago and was the reason for my first post):

So I thought: "Maybe the road´s supposed to right next to the water?". So I tried that:

No exactly right either, is it?

This is most curious - and it gets even curiouser in the next post...

[umlaut]

So I tried hoolaman´s version - even though I´d tried that one before too:

The tiles there are Cobblestone, Pavement 1 with a low stone wall adjacent to the water and the water itself with elevation 19 all other elevations 20.

And whaddaya know? This time it worked!! Just like in Hoolaman´s pic above.

So I began thinking that maybe it was the stone wall that did the trick.

So I tried to remove it - and:

So apparently it is the wall near the water´s edge that is the decisive factor. At least when I try create the vertical sides.

But I a bit puzzled why LongLeftFlank and I are getting different results for apparently identical editing.

Could it be that the order of making the edits is the key?

[LongLeftFlank]

Couple of thoughts. 1. Try raising the banks another meter.... You need the water to be 2-3 metres below the bank to get a nice steep drop. 2. If you Adjust All to try to keep the ground level I think that raises the water base too. 3 I locked the height of the water tiles too although I don't know if that helped.

Note also that if you create a "bend" in your canal or try to run it diagonally you get some funky Salvador Dali effects on the banks.

[umlaut]

1. Try raising the banks another meter.... You need the water to be 2-3 metres below the bank to get a nice steep drop.

Started with water = 18 and bank = 22. No difference

And anyway: The height difference was only two in the map where I succeeded in making the vertical sides by adding a wall following hoolamans instuctions

2. If you Adjust All to try to keep the ground level I think that raises the water base too.

Didn´t use that. Only two heights in the entire map: 20 and 22

3 I locked the height of the water tiles too although I don't know if that helped.

All water tiles were locked at 20 - you can probably see that in the pics

Note also that if you create a "bend" in your canal or try to run it diagonally you get some funky Salvador Dali effects on the banks.

Yes, I´ve seen that - in other maps

[hoolaman]

So I tried hoolaman´s version - even though I´d tried that one before too:

And whaddaya know? This time it worked!! Just like in Hoolaman´s pic above.

So I began thinking that maybe it was the stone wall that did the trick.

So I tried to remove it - and:

So apparently it is the wall near the water´s edge that is the decisive factor. At least when I try create the vertical sides.

But I a bit puzzled why LongLeftFlank and I are getting different results for apparently identical editing.

Could it be that the order of making the edits is the key?

Well I did mention all that in my post...

As for the different effects between yours and LLFs I think there may be some effect from having the water hard up against the map edge too.

[Gen Von Television]

Interesting stuff Gents!

I need an advice on how to make a W road Bridge crossing one 100 m wide canal: if I place two 'segments' they stay under water!

Maybe this has been discussed already, but I cannot find the solution: in the CMX1 editor it was simply a matter of placing that single length bridge segment one after the other, but here it seems I cannot control the elevation of the bridge segments. The only way I can keep the bridge afloat is to squeeze the canal so that the single spanned bridge can cross it since the longer road bridge is 56 m only...

Any help/hint would be much appreciated!

TIA

[undercovergeek]

Interesting stuff Gents!

I need an advice on how to make a W road Bridge crossing one 100 m wide canal: if I place two 'segments' they stay under water!

Maybe this has been discussed already, but I cannot find the solution: in the CMX1 editor it was simply a matter of placing that single length bridge segment one after the other, but here it seems I cannot control the elevation of the bridge segments. The only way I can keep the bridge afloat is to squeeze the canal so that the single spanned bridge can cross it since the longer road bridge is 56 m only...

Any help/hint would be much appreciated!

TIA

where the two bridges meet you need a land tile standing higher than the water - i used it to create the Arnhem bridge - looks fine

[Gen Von Television]

I was just thinking to do the same... Thanks!