Hamilcar1967 Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 Is ASL still the best board game or minature system when it comes to WW-2 squad level combat. I am not really looking to play but am looking for research material. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie_Oz Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 ASL for sure. Chapter H of ASL is an extraordinary reference for ww2 weapons and equipment. I am not sure if it is available separately. I have never seen anything that matches it's depth. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveyJJ Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Complexity does not necessarily equate to realism, re: ASL. There are a great number of tactical WW2 hex-and-chit wargames available ... Combat Commander series from GMT, Conflict of Heroes series from Academy Games, the Lock 'n Load series, and even some highly playable print and play games like Valor & Victory. ASL is not the be-all-and-end-all of tactical games despite it's fans and some would argue it never was. There was Up Front! and Ambush and Squad Leader and a whole host of game even back then that were "as good". ASL is a lifestyle game ... any too many relate it's complexity to it being the perfect simulation of tactical combat. All hex-and-chit games however have both strengths and weaknesses ... they will always be strong in certain areas and ignore others because they are games. Miniature systems abound at that scale. And not just the ever-popular (and highly silly) Flames of War. And the nice thing is that there are scales down to man-to-man to company that work again, for various reasons. Rules of Engagement, Poor Bloody Infantry, Troops Weapons & Tactics, NUTS!, and dozens more. My personal fave is one called CrossFire as it has no rulers/measuring, and throws the whole I-Go-UYou-Go mechanic out the window ... you "go" until you fail, then initiative swaps to the opponent. Never wracking that is because eventually you will fail and so you have to decide what to do in an order of priority. No rulers to measure move distance or target range ... it's all within hitting. It's purely about tactics. Hard to find but worth it. Org charts are good as well. But what sort of research are you doing? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromit Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 That's a tough question in my estimation Hamilcar. I have been playing boardgames and a few miniature rulesets since the 70's and I can't really say that any of them are really all that helpful with regard to research. I will agree with Magpie on the data ASL put out in their rules chapter H. Honestly, I owned few worthwhile books back in those days and I learned much of my knowledge concerning relative values in AFVs from chapter H. Having said that, it is a $70-$80 purchase online these days when you can find it- although someone might throw up an old 1st edition for less now and then. The historical content should be much the same for obvious reasons. Back to the research bit. I find that today I use the internet for my searches to narrow down possible candidates on any particular subject. It helps to have lots of feedback from former owners to take (with your handy "grain-of-salt" that is necessary on the net) into consideration. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herr_oberst Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Is ASL still the best board game or minature system when it comes to WW-2 squad level combat. I am not really looking to play but am looking for research material. Research for what? Unit Histories + copies of captured maps from the Library of Congress, Geography and Maps Division + CMBN Editor might make for an interesting scenario or two (although all my current 1:50000 maps are 'Russland', and my scanner died aeons ago). Perhaps a trip is due to see what they have in the LoC from the Western Front... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Praetori Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Take a look at Vassal. It's an open source engine that can emulate most boardgames. There's about 800+ modules for it and there are some old Normandy style games already. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Not sure what you are researching but for generic tank capabilities and Battalion make-up CMBO/CMAK. Probably the cheapest option too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 For Battalion TO&E needs, I think CMBN is the best option in and of itself. CMx1 didn't have real tank formations, whereas CMx2 has meticulously researched TO&Es for infantry, armoured and other formations. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 ...CMx2 has meticulously researched TO&Es for infantry, armoured and other formations. And you know this because...? Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vark Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 I believe the TO&E's for WinSP Steel Panthers and Win MBT (free downloads) are reputed to be very accurate and constantly being updated, as new resources are found. I think the vast majority of board games/rules use existing data but try to have a unique mechanic to use this information. I cannot think of any game played where data is not consistent with what one can research, though TO&E's can vary quite drastically. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Hopefully a truck can be reskinned for a Dad's Army mod... http://www.matakishi.com/dadsarmy.htm 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMG Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 That would be in the Sealion module. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 And you know this because...? Michael Because I know everything, as always. If you'd played CMSF/CMA you'd know the principle by which the TO&Es go in these games. The TO&Es are highly detailed. Anyway, CMBN contains (at least) the following, as per the TO&E page: German Major Formations * Panzer Grenadier Battalion (Armored) * Panzer Grenadier Battalion (Motorized) * Panzer Aufklärungs Battalion (Armored) * Panzer Pionier Battalion (Armored) * Pionier Battalion (Motorized) * Pionier Battalion * Grenadier Battalion * Füsilier Battalion * Panzer Battalion (Medium) * Panzer Battalion (Heavy) * Panzerjäger Battalion (Pz Div) * Panzerjäger Battalion (PzGren Div) * Sturmgeschütz Battalion/Brigade United States Major Formations * Armored Infantry Battalion * Armored Engineer Battalion * Infantry Battalion * Engineer Battalion * Antitank Battalion (SP) * Antitank Battalion (Towed) * Armored Battalion (Light) * Armored Battalion (Medium) * Airborne Parachute Battalion * Airborne Glider Battalion * Cavalry Squadron (Armored) * Cavalry Squadron (Mechanized) * Cavalry Troop (Infantry) And those come with several options. I think Grogs are going to love just going into the editor and looking around and touching things --- and then rushing here to post complaints about the Abteilung commander's personal driver being a Gefreiter when he should be an Unteroffizier... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Hopefully a truck can be reskinned for a Dad's Army mod... http://www.matakishi.com/dadsarmy.htm Okay, the decoy sheep really sold it to me. CM must do this. Although, mayhaps an 'Allo 'allo mod would be easier? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkEzra Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Okay, the decoy sheep really sold it to me. CM must do this. Not Good News. I recently had a run in with a local sheep rancher... a totally big misunderstanding that resulted in my being slapped with a restraining order (can't be closer that 500 yards from any sheep at any time)... Truly ridiculous... I was only making conversation... Honestly! My Attorney has advised against purchase of this game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Okay, the decoy sheep really sold it to me. CM must do this. CMBN would be the wrong game for this. Clearly this is a clever ploy to distract the New Zealanders in Italy and make them homesick. This will have to wait for CMTB (Combat Mission: The Boot). Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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