Schoerner Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 ...came home, opened the Box and saw... ...a 88 pages "thick" manual. OK, not that huge problem i thought, after i saw, that certain chapters are included as PDF-files (ok, i understand: the company developing the game over years has the money to include a great and thick manual, adequate for this game, but the very-cost-intensive distribution eats up all the margin and therefore you get a booklet like for a ego-shooter). At the moment i'm on page 33 and what should i say? The whole text sounds like it was written by a person, not interested in wargaming. The formulations are partially sounding like simple translations and on the other hand with the target to describe a politically correct game, without any enthusiasm of a wargamer about such a great piece of program. The back of the box is showing some pics out of the game, but i saw already MUCH better ones in the "bones", Matt gave us months ago. Also the description on the back of the box does by far not give a sense about the ultimate complexity and the detail depth the game offers. "Über 300 Fahrzeugtypen" (over 300 vehicles) is much to less for a game available in shops, when each vehicle is represented by a unique penetration-model. "Über 600 Infanterieeinheiten" (over 600 infantry-units) - and also no more words about the detail-level of each one "Historisch genaues, rundenbasiertes Strategiespiel" - (historically accurate, round-based(!) strategy-game) - CDV describes the real revolutionary CM-game-concept for the potential customer, who never heard about CM before and his first contact is the look on the box, as "rundenbasiert" (round-based)?! What a joke. Also not a word in the manual about the fictional "Waffen Grenadiere". It's really painful, to read a manual, telling you about the different historically accurate units and to read below "Deutsches Heer" and above "Volkssturm" WAFFENGRENADIERE, without any explanation. I'll do the best i can, to make a patch that eliminates this stupid politically correct "WG" in the game. CDV may have offered BFC a good deal, but CDV has absolutely no sense for historical accuracy, wargaming and it seems they don't even know what the strategical/tactical wargamer wants. :mad: :mad: :mad: [ October 02, 2002, 02:52 PM: Message edited by: Schoerner ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danzig Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 I think we need a seperate forums for CDV customers. 'nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feldgendarm Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 Originally posted by Danzig: I think we need a seperate forums for CDV customers.Why? CDV has a first-class CMBB forum, where the most enthusiastic wargamers of this planet meet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schoerner Posted October 2, 2002 Author Share Posted October 2, 2002 I just finished my post in CDV's forum. I posted here, too, 'cause i want BFC to know about it. [ October 02, 2002, 03:34 PM: Message edited by: Schoerner ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt. Ryan Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 They know, Schoerner. They know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sytass Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 Am I the only one happy with the CDV version? Ok, so the manual is not as beefy (usually I read those in bed), but it's there, all I have to do is take it to the office where I work and print it out. Waffengrenadiere? So what? We have laws in Germany in that regard, including certain symbols, and as long as I know what it's meant to be (I used historical flags/badges, though), I can live perfectly well with it. My only concern is that after maybe a few rounds of patches the German version receives no patches any more. I've seen that happen all too often when Talonsoft still brought out translated versions of their games in Germany and patches never were made available for those "international" versions, until Talonsoft began releasing their English games with an additional German reference manual. SSI's Age of Rifles went so far that the latest pacthes were suitable for all versions, turning even the German version into the English version. I just hope that CMBB will not suffer the same fate as the Talonsoft games and that patches will either be compatible with both versions or available for both the "original" and the German version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake bullet Posted October 2, 2002 Share Posted October 2, 2002 ok guys i just posted this at the cdv forum :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: I am frankly appaled by the way u have handled the marketing of combat mission barbarossa to Berlin after battlefront.com built up such a large following you have managed to undermine all there hard work, and have let not only the english speaking european countries down but also battlefront .com. How can you justify releasing a german version before a english version. Surely you recieved the game in english why then is there such a long delay releasing to the rest of europe in my opinion you are being very short sighted and the longer this fiasco is allowed to continue the more sales you will lose so do all us English speaking countries a favour "take your finger from out of your arse and release combat mission barborrosa to berlin [ October 02, 2002, 06:33 PM: Message edited by: jake bullet ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt Steiner Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Hi "take your finger from out of your arse and release combat mission beyond barborrosa[/QB]Ah the subtle approach eh ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake bullet Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Well it needed saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schoerner Posted October 3, 2002 Author Share Posted October 3, 2002 @Sytass: Yes we have laws in "germany". But which law forbids to call units historically correct "Waffen-SS"? Don't believe the excuses of managers, knowing NOTHING about history. They just want to release a for the system in germany politically correct game, believing this will increase the profit, but not knowing, that especially wargamers have a much better knowledge about WWII-history, than they will ever have. I'm sure if you ask them, they will tell you that SS is equal to Waffen-SS. 95% believe that - but wargamers usually know about the difference. Even the trial at Nürnberg, made by the former opponents and winners(!) didn't judge the Waffen-SS a criminal organization. The high-court in germany judged it is allowed to say "Ruhm und Ehre der Waffen-SS". I know, mass-media and school-books are not differentiating, but I know about the truth in this aspect and if such a abhorrence-worthy lie, denouncing all soldiers of the Waffen-SS as criminals - and therefore the "Waffen-SS" is replaced with "Waffengrenadiere"! - makes it into the historically most accurate and best tactical wargame ever, i'm getting really fed up. Battlefront is a US-company and they have much more decency and show much more respect to ALL involved nations, than the german grandsons to their own fallen grandfathers. Creatures. [ October 02, 2002, 07:13 PM: Message edited by: Schoerner ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Not really. I mean it has been said, and said again, and said again, and even said again. And now you all said it again. Great! Super! I never understood the folks who cried about the Waffen Grenadier thing. Talk about shallow and ignorant. The folks who cry about release dates and such are almost as bad. And yes I am American and yes I am enjoying CMBB right now. But we Americans get screwed on these deals all the time. In fact right now I am waiting for a game for my GameCube that is already out for the PS2 (which I own) and the XBOX. Did I go to the forums of this game company and complain? No. Did I go to the publishers site and complain? No. Why? Probably because it is a game and this is how the game industry works. This is not the first time a situation like this has happened to a game and it will not be the last. Same thing with BFC. Heaven forbid they try to promote wargaming to the masses. Wouldn't want to actually create new fans and capitol to invest into new and better wargames now would we! So yes, there are changes made to the games in Europe and there are delays. Welcome to the real world. And before anyone complains it happens constantly to us Americans with regards to games from places like Europe and especially Japan. Get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Hey morons - if you spent your money on CMBB and THEN whine to CDV about it, guess what - they don't care, and YOU are a hypocrite. There has been enough discussion on this board for all of you to go into your purchase eyes wide open, and you did it anyway. If it REALLY bothered you, you wouldn't have spent your money. Now, are you getting your dollar's worth from the game? If so - SHUT UP ALREADY! If not - RETURN THE PRODUCT FOR A REFUND. And yeah, great post at the CDV board - you look like an illiterate 8 year old. Next time try using their mother tongue, or get someone to write a post in English for you that doesn't look like it was written by a drooling retard. I suspect your consumer action may be insufficient to bring CDV to its knees, but good luck, anyway. Enough is enough, already! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hertston Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Originally posted by Priest: I never understood the folks who cried about the Waffen Grenadier thing. Talk about shallow and ignorant. Yup, that's probably why you never understood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: If not - RETURN THE PRODUCT FOR A REFUND. Of course, German shops do not give any kind of refund for software. If it's physically defective you get another piece of the same but that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Wacky Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Can't you guys at least agree on one CDV thread (god knows there are enough of them) to bitch in? At least then all the complaints can be repeated over and over and over again in the same place. Do a search! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schoerner Posted October 3, 2002 Author Share Posted October 3, 2002 @Michael Dorosh: I think you shouldn't mix up things this way, when you are attacking people. I bought the CDV version. And I wrote in german in the CDV-forum. If i had the opportunity to buy the original version, i would have done so. And it doesn't matter, if you want me to shut up: i think it's my right as a consumer to tell the company (CDV) what i think about "their" product and i wanted to let BFC know my opinion. It doesn't matter if it was said again: in this case it matters, how many people are giving feedback to BFC (and especially to CDV) that they are able to make their conclusions for the future, 'cause in this case it's not possible to make conclusions about the number of sold games, only. If it will become a success in Europe (and so i hope for BFC), CDV surely will think it's also due to their version. They should know, that it was despite their version. [ October 02, 2002, 08:09 PM: Message edited by: Schoerner ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 You of course are talking about the CDV version that is 99.9 percent the exact same friggen version as the direct BFC version right? Does Europe not have a lot of game publishers or what? So far as I can tell they are not doing anything that is not done daily here in the US by game publishers and game companies. And as far as letting BFC know, well if you think after the thousands of threads posted on the forum they might have gotten the hint. Of course if you still think they may still not be getting is somehow then they do have an email address, at least sparing the rest of us from the same old thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Originally posted by redwolf: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: If not - RETURN THE PRODUCT FOR A REFUND. Of course, German shops do not give any kind of refund for software. If it's physically defective you get another piece of the same but that's it.</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Great now see what you all have done, Dorosh and I are agreeing. Super you have unlocked the Seventh Seal! You think you had to wait long in England for your game, try Hell!!!! I jest I jest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Originally posted by Priest: Great now see what you all have done, Dorosh and I are agreeing. Super you have unlocked the Seventh Seal! You think you had to wait long in England for your game, try Hell!!!! I jest I jest.Do the anti-Nazi laws apply to games sold in Hell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Only Europeans, I mean it is Hell! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 In fairness the points probably did need making but they have been made and responses (at length) have been given. BFC have offered a workaround to get the US manual (search will bring it up) and a number of forum members did offer to acquire the US version and send it to Europeans who responded. Those are the options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetchez la Vache Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 I posted a question in CDV English forum a few days ago. Reasonably worded I thought (although I couldn't help mentioning the artwork and the manual - me bad ). No answer forthcoming as of yet. I have say in all honesty that I don't think Jake's thread is particularly helpful really. CDV will not respond to flaming I suspect - although if it does elicit a response I take my hat off to you sir. At this moment all we can do is politely ask, send a few (nice) e-mails, hope that CDV spits something up and talk about the situation on these boards. Which brings me to another point I'd like to get off my chest. Can people not affected by the CDV distribution deal please just go away and stop your anti-whining whining? Just don't read any threads with 'CDV' in the title. It’s really that easy. Please get out of other people’s faces and take your pseudo-intellectual-superiority-attitude somewhere else. Calling someone an 8 year old drooling retard is hardly going to help, is it now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sgt. Emren Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 Priest & Dorosh: Yeah, stay away from our whining! Due to lack of FAQs around here, it's hard to keep up with the information flowing from BTS/BFC. If it hadn't been for THIS particular thread, I wouldn't have known about the possibility of ordering the US manual, for instance. Thanks to Apache for that tip! Some of us have lives, you know, especially us Euros with no CMBB. We still have other things to do than hang around this board all day. Ahh, those days will soon end! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illo Posted October 3, 2002 Share Posted October 3, 2002 I just wait if i get chance to buy US version. I wont buy CDV one...no no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts