Terrapin Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 (Humph! Absolutely NOTHING! Say it again!) If there's a choice in a QB between getting a T34/85 and any late war KV-1, does anyone pick that KV-1? I think it's absolutely useless. Yeah, it has a huge gun (what is it? a 122mm?), but it's ROF is MOLASSES SLOW. I mean, A PzIVD gets off like FOUR shots for every one of the KV-1's shots. It doesn't stand a chance in the engagement ranges you usually see in CMBB. Can anyone use this tank effectively in the game? How? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Leader Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 It's king in '41 and '42, I can tell you that. It's especially good against teh Finns, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xerxes Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 KV-1 in '41 will rip the lungs out of the Germans. You better hope you immobilize the bad boy before it turns your armor into excess tin foil. In '41 the KV-1 was stopped by: 1. breaking down. 2. 88's deployed in AT role. 3. Combat engineers. 4. Pounding on them until their green crews just wanted out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterGoodale Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 It's what I like to call the "Goon". It's a big, slow, well-armored, and VERY powerful gun that needs to be protected and used carefully. You can't just send it blasting through the forest or plains until it meets the enemy. It needs escorts like T-34/85s. Use it in a really good ambush spot (hehe) or against infantry from a distance where you are pretty sure there aren't any good enemy guns around. It's a follower not a leader. But when it hits it hits hard and the fury of it's angry TNT is unmatched once it gets rolling!! :mad: :mad: :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickovich Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Hmm.The KV1 has a 76m gun.The KV85 had an 85m.The KV2 from the early war years had the 152m gun.It had vanished by the time the T34/85 was available.If the latter is available then the KV85 should be the model for the period.Not a tank from the early years.That's kinda like selecting a PZIVC when you could be choosing panthers .But as others have said KV was a beast in the early days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomm Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by xerxes: In '41 the KV-1 was stopped by:In CMBB the KV-1 is stopped by: GUN DAMAGE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarquelne Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 122mm? The KV1 has a 76m gun.Do you mean the IS-2, Terrapin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrapin Posted December 10, 2002 Author Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by Tarqulene: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> 122mm? The KV1 has a 76m gun.Do you mean the IS-2, Terrapin?</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 IIRC, the 122mm gun in the IS-2 had what's called a separate charge. First you loaded the projectile and then loaded the powder charge. This double-loading results in a pretty slow ROF, especially considering the VERY cramped conditions in the turret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abbott Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 I like the 122mm main gun on the IS tanks. Having a slow ROF does need to be considered in its deployment. When it hits, it hits hard however. Protect their flanks and use them in a break through or support roll. A very strong tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarquelne Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 I like the 122mm main gun on the IS tanks. Having a slow ROF does need to be considered in its deployment. When it hits, it hits hard however. Protect their flanks and use them in a break through or support roll. And the more you use at once the easier it is to protect the flanks, and the less the slow ROF hurts. (In that you're more likely to have _somebody_ able to fire at any given moment, and better able to maintain something close to a continuous "stream" of fire.) Slow turrets, but the more tanks you have, the more likely it will be for one to already be pointed in the right direction. So the more tanks you can afford, the better the IS-2 looks. The shorter the battle, which - all other things being equal means a less ammo needed - the better the IS-2 looks. The more infantry you face, the better the IS-2 looks. Blast is what, near 200 I think. (More MG ammo too, though it has a coax+flex rather than a coax+bow.) The bigger the AT guns you'll be facing, the better the IS-2 looks. Look esp. at the front hull armor. (I guess it might be more accurate to say, "If you're not facing big AT guns, the IS-2 looks better." The really nasty AT stuff will penetrate anything, but the IS-2 can (sometimes) shrug off frontal attacks that would destroy a T-34.) The tougher the armor you'll be encountering, the better the IS-2 looks. Esp. the slower ROF, less maneuverable stuff. The IS-2's own weaknesses won't be quite as apparent. [ December 10, 2002, 11:50 AM: Message edited by: Tarqulene ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgdpzr Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by Terrapin: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Tarqulene: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> 122mm? The KV1 has a 76m gun.Do you mean the IS-2, Terrapin?</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrapin Posted December 10, 2002 Author Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by jgdpzr: I could be wrong, but I don't think the KV-1 has a slow ROF. It has a three-man turret so target acquisition/fire coordination should be superior to the T-34/76. Perhaps the game considers it to have a cramped turret so it penalizes ROF, but I haven't noticed that to be the case.[/QB]It does though. I have a flat, blank scenario, where all I do is put 10 tanks of one kind against 10 tanks of another and see what happens. That KV-1 gets badly outshot by any Panzer/T34 available, at any range. It's like 3-1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 IntelWeenie! Holy cow man, I thought you were dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lumbergh Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 If you use the IS-2 as it was supposed to be employed, as a standoff breakthrough tank, it really kicks ass. It's got tons of armour, and that big honkin' gun makes mincemeat of any at gun or machinegun nest or whatever is holding up your infantry. Of course, if you're playing a random QB and you end up on a small, forested map against an opponent with speedier tanks, you're SOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by Terrapin: That KV-1 gets badly outshot by any Panzer/T34 available, at any range. It's like 3-1.[/QB]I just tested it. KV-1 M41: 4.6 rounds per minute T-34/76 M43: 4.8 rounds per minute This is after 5 turns of firing. I would almost bet that there is actually no difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartokomus Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Just finished a QB (combined arms, human picked forces). The two t34's i had were knocked out pretty quickly from some pretty lucky shooting. i figured oooohhhh crap, that's it for me. he had like 2 Mk IV's, 2 Mk III's, and a couple of PzJaeger's (i think) left. BUT... that ugly KV proceeded to win the day by slowly destroying every single one of his armor pieces. it withstood infantry close assault, numerous flank shots, and just a whole bunch of misery. i could not believe it. every time i thought, "he's dead" he just kept going. it salvaged a draw out of what looked like a Total Loss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Gee guys, are you talking about KV-1, KV-2 or IS-2??? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaylord Focker Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 Originally posted by Terrapin: (Humph! Absolutely NOTHING! Say it again!) If there's a choice in a QB between getting a T34/85 and any late war KV-1, does anyone pick that KV-1? I think it's absolutely useless. Yeah, it has a huge gun (what is it? a 122mm?), but it's ROF is MOLASSES SLOW. I mean, A PzIVD gets off like FOUR shots for every one of the KV-1's shots. It doesn't stand a chance in the engagement ranges you usually see in CMBB. Can anyone use this tank effectively in the game? How?There is a reason why there are hundreds of vehicles in this game. There is'nt a rule you have to pick the same best vehicles all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Murray Posted December 10, 2002 Share Posted December 10, 2002 I've played the Iron Roadblock ( don't know how many times now ). I've given the axis experience & troop bonuses, free to place units, extreme FOW & the result is almost always the same: they get their *sses kicked royally. Most of the time my Russian infantry doesn't even have to get involved; they just sit back & watch the show. In 1941 as someone else said the KV-1 was king. Most of the German armor is about as useful as tin cans when they're up against it: they ( the Germans ) BLOW UP GOOD, REAL GOOD. [ December 10, 2002, 04:52 PM: Message edited by: Rob Murray ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalin's Organ Posted December 11, 2002 Share Posted December 11, 2002 Rob you twit!! lol You're supposed to play Iron Roadblock AS THE GERMANS!! It's to give you some idea of using tactics to win - as you say playing as the Russians involves nothing more than hitting "GO" every turn!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gpig Posted December 11, 2002 Share Posted December 11, 2002 Heh heh Actually, Mr. Organ . . . (snicker snicker) you are supposed to play Iron Roadblock as the Allies (Russians). Read the manual, eh. Gpig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Wacky Posted December 11, 2002 Share Posted December 11, 2002 Smoke, flank, and pray. Repeat as necessary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gpig Posted December 11, 2002 Share Posted December 11, 2002 Speaking of KV's, however . . . I played 86smpsoium the other night in a 700 point ME, TCP/IP matchy matchy. It took place in 41, and he grabbed a KV. NIGHTMARE!!!! Ugh. It wandered the battlefield with impunity. My pzIVG spent the battle lookin for places to hide. Gpig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted December 11, 2002 Share Posted December 11, 2002 I am playing a PBEM with Gunnar and he also picked KV-I tanks, at least 3 so far that I see, in a 1941 Armor QB ME. My valiant force of Pz-II, Pz-III and Jpz-I are swarming but so far to no avail I now have a good side/rear quarter shot with the Jagdpanzer, but it does not appear that this acording to the tables is going to do much either. So historically what would happen? The German armor after running into these beast would retreat or by-pass them? Maybe try to lure them into an ambush of 88s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts